Resawing 12" wide hardwood

[Fitzroy]

Any drawing would be most welcome. As I said before, hopefully this thread will also benefit future readers too.

Sorry but in the shed for a few days. Pics below of what I meant. I filed the thread off of the length where the slot is cut. Threads filed off in the drill press. Below in M10 which worked for a frame saw but a longer slot to prevent the blade twisting could be beneficial.

 

[Ttrees]

*PS he also shows the problem of ripping thin stuff in that both pieces might bow so far that they are both useless, and he would have done better to just plane to thickness and have one usable board.

True as that, though I wonder if folks of olde took a differing approach than we would today
regarding this.
Not many folks would be happy today if they had to soak, steam, iron or whatever else including the kitchen sink, and come back to sawing the material in such a state.

That's a pure guess, going back to a rather decent Benchtalk hide glue video which got taken down,
(by far the best information on the subject I've seen)
From watching that, and the suggestion to take the chill out of the timber before gluing by wetting it, I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't the only reason to have a bucket of water around.

 

[Hornbeam]

Resawing timber can be a bit of a lottery as you do not know how much tension is stored in the wood untill you start cutting. Unless the wood is old and very dry there will almost certainly be a moisture gradient which will also be affected by how it was stored etc
After resawing boards will often cup but this can be limited by dampening the outer surface and then clamping the 2 cut boards outside to outside with a couple of battens between. This allows the exposed centre of the board to air dry faster and pull the boards back towards flat
I do any resawing on a very large bandsaw but if doing by hand I would build a resaw a bit like Jacobs second video with better handles but longer and use it as a 2 man saw

 

[thetyreman]

True as that, though I wonder if folks of olde took a differing approach than we would today
regarding this.
Not many folks would be happy today if they had to soak, steam, iron or whatever else including the kitchen sink, and come back to sawing the material in such a state.

That's a pure guess, going back to a rather decent Benchtalk hide glue video which got taken down,
(by far the best information on the subject I've seen)
From watching that, and the suggestion to take the chill out of the timber before gluing by wetting it, I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't the only reason to have a bucket of water around.

they used hot water to wet the joint, I've seen a conservator do this, one side is hot hide glue, the other boiling hot water, taken from the double boiler pot, also you can use a heat gun, it's far more important with HHG that the wood is really warm before gluing together, and then you only have about 20-30 seconds. I've been experimenting with it lately and it's much much harder to use than PVA and any modern glue, managed to get a 'death grip' by rubbing a couple of pieces together for a test, no clamps needed. Such a shame that they deleted that video, I wonder why?

 

[Ttrees]

they used hot water to wet the joint, I've seen a conservator do this, one side is hot hide glue, the other boiling hot water, taken from the double boiler pot, also you can use a heat gun, it's far more important with HHG that the wood is really warm before gluing together, and then you only have about 20-30 seconds. I've been experimenting with it lately and it's much much harder to use than PVA and any modern glue, managed to get a 'death grip' by rubbing a couple of pieces together for a test, no clamps needed. Such a shame that they deleted that video, I wonder why?

I had dreams that my heat gun would sufficiently warm my timbers, for small patches rather than using the oil rad, (which has about the same consumption) in my un-insulated workshop.
The only thing I found retaining heat was the tool itself. (admittedly a 50 quid Dewalt job)
Getting an oil rad under the work and making a heavy tent/blanket like below proved to be much better,
so effective by comparison that I've got to keep soaking the timbers every so often or checks will occur, although saying that....possibly not in my very damp workshop, but very much so notable in the house

But onto your point, yes it seems a lot more difficult to use,
but that video made it seem somewhat achievable for someone in a cold workshop.

I guess that video might have been just too good, might try seeing if I could happen across a link
on some German forum sometime, if I can find his name out.

Tom

 

[Ttrees]

Resawing timber can be a bit of a lottery as you do not know how much tension is stored in the wood untill you start cutting. Unless the wood is old and very dry there will almost certainly be a moisture gradient which will also be affected by how it was stored etc
After resawing boards will often cup but this can be limited by dampening the outer surface and then clamping the 2 cut boards outside to outside with a couple of battens between. This allows the exposed centre of the board to air dry faster and pull the boards back towards flat
I do any resawing on a very large bandsaw but if doing by hand I would build a resaw a bit like Jacobs second video with better handles but longer and use it as a 2 man saw

+1 here, one learns their lesson about resawing being a lottery very quickly if they own a bandsaw,
so it's good reason for making a wider frame saw like David's, that is.....
for those who's toes don't curl at the thought of laminations.

 

[profchris]

My woodworking requires a lot of resawing, to make acoustic guitars and ukuleles. Unless I buy the wood ready sawn, which (a) is expensive - around £100 for a guitar if I stick to non-figured timber, (b) means I can't recycle timber, and (c) means I can only use what's commercially available ready sawn.

As an example, I just failed to complete this uke before the light went today:

It's for playing at open mics in pubs, so it's made from the bar of my village ex-pub. It's oak, which isn't available ready sawn.

Using a 26 inch 5 tpi rip saw needed around 2 hours sawing to produce top, back, sides and fretboard - lots of stopping to clear the waste (4 inch boards, so not huge). It was quite wasteful, probably losing 6mm for each cut (after cleanup) as the saw wandered a little.

The same saw on 8 inch boards for guitars is very hard work, and wanders much more. Even if I retoothed it at 3 tpi It's too short for that really. And I have half a wardrobe which should make some nice instruments

So, a 36 inch frame saw is in the works - I'll report back once it's made.

 

[Blackswanwood]

I may be shouted down as I’m a hybrid woodworker (I use hand tools and machinery as the mood takes me) however in my experience using a kerfing saw to the depth of just a couple of mm significantly increases accuracy. This may in part that it gives a more visible line to follow however I also believe that it has a material impact in guiding the saw.

Good point made in an earlier post that resawing can be a bit of a lottery.

 

[Jacob]

I may be shouted down as I’m a hybrid woodworker (I use hand tools and machinery as the mood takes me)

Me too, but I do like using hand tools even when not essential.

however in my experience using a kerfing saw to the depth of just a couple of mm significantly increases accuracy. This may in part that it gives a more visible line to follow however I also believe that it has a material impact in guiding the saw.

Yep. That's the whole idea. I do a deep cut with a TS, which causes it little anxiety in some quarters!

Good point made in an earlier post that resawing can be a bit of a lottery.

Well yes. Your bought in wood, or selection from your stock, wants to be close to intended finished sizes where possible, to help avoid surprises! Stuff may move even if just being planed.

 

[BodgerM_497]

Hello chaps. (I'll repeat the caveat of being new to woodwork etc...)

Please recommend a suitable saw set tool - preferably one that I'll easily find secondhand. I'd rather the squeeze handle type; I don't trust myself to free-style it with a punch + hammer just yet(!)

 

[Jacob]

Hello chaps. (I'll repeat the caveat of being new to woodwork etc...)

Please recommend a suitable saw set tool - preferably one that I'll easily find secondhand. I'd rather the squeeze handle type; I don't trust myself to free-style it with a punch + hammer just yet(!)

Eclipse 77. Lots on ebay £5 or so.

 

[Blackswanwood]

Yep. That's the whole idea. I do a deep cut with a TS, which causes it little anxiety in some quarters!

Yep - for good reason - far safer to use a kerfing saw.

 

[Jacob]

Yep - for good reason - far safer to use a kerfing saw.

Yes if you feel unsafe don't do it!
I don't want to be accused of promoting unsafe practices but deep cutting is safer than many you see on youtube with fingers close to the blade etc.

 

[G S Haydon]

Yeah, totally safe . Passing a piece of wood over a saw blade where the kerf can pinch and end up throwing it back at you.

As others have mentioned, even with a fair wind it can be a lottery. I have found myself in the situation of needing a piece of wood and deep cutting on a saw (thankfully I have access to kit that does it properly) and the two pieces just cup.

A useful discussion would be on picking good material to attempt this work on.

 

[D_W]

Hello chaps. (I'll repeat the caveat of being new to woodwork etc...)

Please recommend a suitable saw set tool - preferably one that I'll easily find secondhand. I'd rather the squeeze handle type; I don't trust myself to free-style it with a punch + hammer just yet(!)

Somax Japanese saw set for coarse teeth (the wheel says 4-12 this or something). There are two, and the coarse one is what you want. It'll only just set teeth that are cut every 3/8 inch.

 

[Jacob]

Yeah, totally safe . Passing a piece of wood over a saw blade where the kerf can pinch and end up throwing it back at you.

As others have mentioned, even with a fair wind it can be a lottery. I have found myself in the situation of needing a piece of wood and deep cutting on a saw (thankfully I have access to kit that does it properly) and the two pieces just cup.

A useful discussion would be on picking good material to attempt this work on.

Well yes, not for beginners. At least your fingers should be well out of the way.
I could describe how to do it safely but will save that for another day!

 

[D_W]

I may be shouted down as I’m a hybrid woodworker

Good point made in an earlier post that resawing can be a bit of a lottery.

On the first point, I sure hope not! If I've ever done that to anyone, it's usually because of a declaration of what can't be done with hand tools without having any experience using the hand tools (and often coming from people new enough to not have done much with the power tools either - parroting something they've read or heard from a guru in older writings or youtube).

It seems that this thread has also made a tilt toward making the resawing out as being difficult or needing kerfs - it doesn't, but you made a good point elsewhere - if seeing the line is a problem, they can be useful for that. A very dark marked line and cutting aside of the line so that the line thickness doesn't matter is good policy.

And generally, if we're resawing decent stock, there's perceptible tension, but it doesn't result in more than routine prep of the resawn piece. A lot of pop-up videos on YT show people resawing cheap pine so they can make it look fast and avoid the reality of resawing hardwoods, but white pine here, even when it's clear and quartered, often cups.

having resawn a large amount of cherry and a whole bunch of guitar blanks (some flatsawn, mostly quartered), I've never lost either side of the stock. Working by hand generally does provide more time to consider stock and makes it easier to not make it a pain in the rear separate step because you know you'll be working the stock by hand and subpar stuff is a bigger nuisance.

In the event that something thin would actually "double cup", it would be not too difficult to rip it down the center carefully, let it settle, flatten the two halves and match plane the inside edges and glue it back together without obvious visual evidence that any such thing was done.

 

[Jameshow]

On the first point, I sure hope not! If I've ever done that to anyone, it's usually because of a declaration of what can't be done with hand tools without having any experience using the hand tools (and often coming from people new enough to not have done much with the power tools either - parroting something they've read or heard from a guru in older writings or youtube).

It seems that this thread has also made a tilt toward making the resawing out as being difficult or needing kerfs - it doesn't, but you made a good point elsewhere - if seeing the line is a problem, they can be useful for that. A very dark marked line and cutting aside of the line so that the line thickness doesn't matter is good policy.

And generally, if we're resawing decent stock, there's perceptible tension, but it doesn't result in more than routine prep of the resawn piece. A lot of pop-up videos on YT show people resawing cheap pine so they can make it look fast and avoid the reality of resawing hardwoods, but white pine here, even when it's clear and quartered, often cups.

having resawn a large amount of cherry and a whole bunch of guitar blanks (some flatsawn, mostly quartered), I've never lost either side of the stock. Working by hand generally does provide more time to consider stock and makes it easier to not make it a pain in the rear separate step because you know you'll be working the stock by hand and subpar stuff is a bigger nuisance.

In the event that something thin would actually "double cup", it would be not too difficult to rip it down the center carefully, let it settle, flatten the two halves and match plane the inside edges and glue it back together without obvious visual evidence that any such thing was done.

I wouldn't bother resawing pine tbh.

I'd only resaw is the material I had was two thick and I really wanted to use it. Esp if I wanted to bookmatched panels for instance.

 

[D_W]

I wouldn't bother resawing pine tbh.

I'd only resaw is the material I had was two thick and I really wanted to use it. Esp if I wanted to bookmatched panels for instance.

I guess it depends. I've resawn pine to make a chisel rack, but the point was to use inexpensive wood that wouldn't look like plywood. That pine was quartered, but still a surprising amount of tension. You sort of force it to be what it is and get it glued and then most of the tension isn't a problem.

I lucked out and found that in stair treads at lowes maybe 10 years ago and haven't once seen anything similar since. It would take knowing a sawyer to get clear pine like you'd see in antique furniture drawers.

panels and saving offcuts for thick items is the only time I've resawn things, along with from time to time, having wood that has great aesthetics and is mis-sized for a projection (like having a great grain and color match when you need 4/4 and having 6/4, and imagining a use for the offcut - that use often never comes.

flatsawn pine that isn't any such thing as quality seems to be guru's choice for hand tools here. Mahogany would work almost as easily, but at $13-$20 a board foot, isn't going to be used for class fodder.

 

[Jacob]

.....
It seems that this thread has also made a tilt toward making the resawing out as being difficult or needing kerfs - it doesn't,.....

Re-sawing (splitting boards) is difficult and a kerf will help. Why pretend otherwise?
Only helps a little if it's a little kerf but very useful if it's deep.
I do it with my bandsaw - kerf 1st over the TS and then cut out the middle out on the band saw.
Same op with a hand rip-saw if too big for the bandsaw (12").
Still haven't seen the point of a frame saw though, it doesn't solve any problems- unless you haven't got a suitable rip saw but it'd probably make more sense to just go out and buy one - in fact
BodgerM_497's first suggestion looks good; the 26" x 4.5 tpi rip option.
https://www.flinn-garlick-saws.co.u.../?attribute_saw-size-tooth=22"+Rip+Saw+4.5tpi