Clifton plane sale!

[speeder1987]

I never liked Clifton because to me they just seemed a bit boring, but having seen that video its made me appreciate how beautifully engineered they are!

John

 

[Noggsy]

Fromey, cracking idea.

 

[Sawyer]

+1

 

[speeder1987]

I think if a companies business model is so poor that it doesn't successfully market its product, especially with competition who do this with success, then they are in trouble.

Loosing a sales channel like axminster should be a wake up call! If not then they will have to deal with the repercussions and the potential failure of their business which comes with that!

 

[Tom K]

How did a thread berating Axi for dropping Clifton turn into the end for Clico? Who may well be jogging along quite nicely selling through other outlets. :?

 

[Peter Sefton]

well said that man, are we missing the point? Why have such good English made planes been dropped?

 

[Jacob]

For that matter - why aren't they selling the new Stanleys? It's not a quality issue they sell all sorts of carp.

 

[MickCheese]

well said that man, are we missing the point? Why have such good English made planes been dropped?

Peter

We have now gone full circle. I suspect there is just more profit in other brands and Axminster do not want to dilute the pot with less profitable items.

Mick

 

[RichardL]

Well, I came accross this thread and read the first page or so with some horror and I'm glad it was only heresay. If I might be so bold (having lived outside the UK for a while), I think one of the problems is that folk (mainly British) are all too ready to find fault with British made stuff while I don't think its quite the same in the US - they tend to be more supportive of made in the good ol USofA. Its a somewhat different culture - they don't so often rubbish their own manufacturers and (some, at least) are happy enough to rubbish others. The result is that its easy to find negative press when you google the likes of Clifton planes, which is a shame.

I was wondering whether anyone had followed through and contacted Clico and alerted them to some of the suggestions made in this thread. I had a look at their site - which didn't really jump out as a woodwork tool manufacturer site although maybe it isn't as bad as some have suggested. It mentions that they are planning new tools, but that seems to be a while ago.

Perhaps an example of a good British tool maker site is this this one http://www.bulldogtools.co.uk/ Although I have no idea how they are doing as a company. These folk make great (indestuctable) hand forged spades etc. I really like the way they incorportate a video explaining why ther tools are unique - and i believe them, my spade has moved mountains! Clico could do the same. I think the main thing is getting that immediate link when you google Clifton planes, like Bulldog have done.

I really wish Clico all the best. I've enjoyed using my Clifton tools hugely. I'd like to buy some more - if they make a block plane, I'll be first in line.

Cheers

Richard

 

[Peter Sefton]

Mick Hudson from Clifton has shown me a prototype Block plane at one of my Open days and it looks like a winner, not sure if its going into production but I do hope so, and that we have a more American attitude to our British made goods I know I have been to ready to believe over hyped Marketing and less inclined to go with honest English engineers. Let’s hope after the Olympics we can put the Great back into Britain!

 

[jimi43]

How did a thread berating Axi for dropping Clifton turn into the end for Clico? Who may well be jogging along quite nicely selling through other outlets. :?

Hi Tom

I think the overriding theme coming across loud and clear is that the vast majority of British woodworkers DO care enough about Clifton to want them to survive...and not just jog along but bloom!

We care simply because we are proud. We are not as openly proud as some countries :lol: but we are none the less.

Patriotism isn't just flags, dancing girls and ra ra you know. It's support in subtle ways....and I think if Clifton haven't been told about this thread by one of their outlets by now, then they blinkin' well should have been. If they choose to ignore the feedback then there is nothing more their customers can do.

Axminster are listening to their customers to stay in business....and their frank and honest statement says why they are dropping lines with falling sales.

I don't know what forces are contributing to this fall...I can only speculate but I do hope they fix it in time.

Jim

 

[MIGNAL]

Mick Hudson from Clifton has shown me a prototype Block plane at one of my Open days and it looks like a winner, not sure if its going into production but I do hope so, and that we have a more American attitude to our British made goods I know I have been to ready to believe over hyped Marketing and less inclined to go with honest English engineers. Let’s hope after the Olympics we can put the Great back into Britain!

That prototype Block plane has been around for a few years. You will find posts on this forum that mention it but as yet it's not been in production. Actually I don't understand why Clifton haven't produced 3 Block planes - the standard, low angle and the 102 or Apron size. LN and Veritas have, so I presume that those two manufacturers thought it worthwhile.

 

[Scouse]

How did a thread berating Axi for dropping Clifton turn into the end for Clico? Who may well be jogging along quite nicely selling through other outlets. :?

I think the overriding theme coming across loud and clear is that the vast majority of British woodworkers DO care enough about Clifton to want them to survive

Surely that's HMV syndrome; everyone is upset and outraged at the demise of HMV, a great old British company, but these are the same people who bought all their Christmas DVD's from Amazon! If the vast majority of British woodworkers care about Clifton, why do so many on here extol the virtues of Quangsheng and cry over the loss of British craftsmanship? The same applies as to why Axminster can't shift stock in the same way as they clearly do with L/N.

It's not Axminster's fault if Clifton won't help themselves. They are in a unique promotional position, being a toolmaker in the most famous steel making city in the world, they're almost invisible when their competitors are everywhere.

I'm as proud as anyone to be British and I hope, for the sake of the skilled workers, that Clifton will be ok and that that the incompetent management gets a wake up call from Axminster. I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

How did a thread berating Axi for dropping Clifton turn into the end for Clico? Who may well be jogging along quite nicely selling through other outlets. :?

I think the overriding theme coming across loud and clear is that the vast majority of British woodworkers DO care enough about Clifton to want them to survive

Surely that's HMV syndrome; everyone is upset and outraged at the demise of HMV, a great old British company, but these are the same people who bought all their Christmas DVD's from Amazon! If the vast majority of British woodworkers care about Clifton, why do so many on here extol the virtues of Quangsheng and cry over the loss of British craftsmanship? The same applies as to why Axminster can't shift stock in the same way as they clearly do with L/N.

It's not Axminster's fault if Clifton won't help themselves. They are in a unique promotional position, being a toolmaker in the most famous steel making city in the world, they're almost invisible when their competitors are everywhere.

I'm as proud as anyone to be British and I hope, for the sake of the skilled workers, that Clifton will be ok and that that the incompetent management gets a wake up call from Axminster. I'm not holding my breath.

I'm not sure I'd be quite so quick to describe Clico's management as 'incompetent'. Their products are very good, they are managing to survive in a high tax, high energy cost environment with a relatively labour intensive business, and their service to people contacting them with problems of whatever sort has been reported as very helpful by people posting on this forum. So they're doing some things right.

However, you have your criticisms. So how would you advise Clico to improve their marketing? If you were looking to buy a new plane, what would make you want to buy a Cfifton?

 

[Paul Chapman]

Mick Hudson from Clifton has shown me a prototype Block plane at one of my Open days and it looks like a winner, not sure if its going into production but I do hope so,

That prototype Clifton block plane is a real cracker. It's been around a long time and I've handled it a few times. Feels lovely in the hand - really tactile. I think Mike Hudson shares our frustration that it's not yet in production.

When they do make it, I've told Mike that I want the first one

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[grinder]

Hi my name is Geoff I work for Clico who manufacture Clifton planes. I think it is sad that people start these rumours without giving it any thought of the damage that may be caused. I assemble every bench plane that leaves the factory and I hope this stops the rumours thanks

 

[Scouse]

I'm not sure I'd be quite so quick to describe Clico's management as 'incompetent'. Their products are very good, they are managing to survive in a high tax, high energy cost environment with a relatively labour intensive business, and their service to people contacting them with problems of whatever sort has been reported as very helpful by people posting on this forum. So they're doing some things right.

Their products and customer service are good due to the skills of the metal workers and CS representatives, not effective management.

You hit the nail on the head when you say 'managing to survive', hardly a ringing endorsement of a successful forward looking company.

As for what I'd do, I would PROMOTE! I did a lot of research before I bought my planes, and the lack of access to any meaningful information on Clifton put me off. An indifferent review from Chris Schwarz and a 'How It's Made' documentary by an AMERICAN company is not enough if they want to do better than just 'survive' in a market against North American big hitters.

They have valuable unique selling points which they just disregard. And it costs them money; I would have rather spent my money on Cliftons, but a couple of general pages on a site and not even 'Clifton.com' but hidden within Clico's domain and half ar*ed when you find it (reversed photograph??? Very professional looking...).

Google Clifton planes and they are 9th on the list. Why are they not first with their own domain name? Schwarz's bad review is the first hit on Google. Why have they not tried to counter this? A reply? Rebuttal? Send him another plane?

Any other Youtube videos? Demonstrations? Explanations of the range? Explaining why they are better? It's cheap advertising, thats why L/N and Veritas do it. Why not Clifton?

If I can see this, and I just make violins, why can't they? Surely it's very basic stuff. They may as well just give potential customers L/N's phone number.

Yeah, the management are really great.

 

[Racers]

Hi my name is Geoff I work for Clico who manufacture Clifton planes. I think it is sad that people start these rumours without giving it any thought of the damage that may be caused. I assemble every bench plane that leaves the factory and I hope this stops the rumours thanks

Hi, Geoff

Welcome to the forum.

The main point of this thread seems to me about the advertising of Clifton planes or rather the lack of it.
Can you communicate with the boses and get some more Youtube videos etc out there showing just how good your planes are.

A google search comes up 979,000 hits with this page first http://www.wkfinetools.com/contrib/cSch ... ifton1.asp which doesn't show your planes in a good light.

Lie Neilsen comes up with 1,800,000 hits Veritas Planes 1,720,000.

Pete

 

[jimi43]

I think this is the crux of the matter.

Geoff...with all due respect to your wonderful workmanship....absolutely nobody has anything other than the deepest regard for the product. And there is little in this thread which will do anything other than promote Clifton in a good light...indeed...most comments are extremely positive.

In the viral world we live in now...any promotion on a forum is a massive boost to reputation and ultimately sales.

The statement by Axminster was clear and honest as to the reason for their dropping the Clifton products. Falling sales.

This is not a rumour...this is a fact.

The healthy discussion of this dreadful news should wake up the management at your company and take action accordingly.

It is worrying that you were the first to make a statement and yet we have heard nothing at all officially from Clifton as to this news. Renowned suppliers have made very positive comments on here and they should be applauded but leaving news of this magnitude without intelligent debate is both unhealthy and blinkered.

I have found the UKW members a friendly and passionate bunch and their concern is genuine my friend.

I would definitely take Pete's advice and make management aware of the concern of the forum....as this amounts to a very large and valid cross section of their customer base.

Thanks again for taking the time to post.

Jim

 

[Cheshirechappie]

I'm not sure I'd be quite so quick to describe Clico's management as 'incompetent'. Their products are very good, they are managing to survive in a high tax, high energy cost environment with a relatively labour intensive business, and their service to people contacting them with problems of whatever sort has been reported as very helpful by people posting on this forum. So they're doing some things right.

Their products and customer service are good due to the skills of the metal workers and CS representatives, not effective management.

You hit the nail on the head when you say 'managing to survive', hardly a ringing endorsement of a successful forward looking company.

As for what I'd do, I would PROMOTE! I did a lot of research before I bought my planes, and the lack of access to any meaningful information on Clifton put me off. An indifferent review from Chris Schwarz and a 'How It's Made' documentary by an AMERICAN company is not enough if they want to do better than just 'survive' in a market against North American big hitters.

They have valuable unique selling points which they just disregard. And it costs them money; I would have rather spent my money on Cliftons, but a couple of general pages on a site and not even 'Clifton.com' but hidden within Clico's domain and half ar*ed when you find it (reversed photograph??? Very professional looking...).

Google Clifton planes and they are 9th on the list. Why are they not first with their own domain name? Schwarz's bad review is the first hit on Google. Why have they not tried to counter this? A reply? Rebuttal? Send him another plane?

Any other Youtube videos? Demonstrations? Explanations of the range? Explaining why they are better? It's cheap advertising, thats why L/N and Veritas do it. Why not Clifton?

If I can see this, and I just make violins, why can't they? Surely it's very basic stuff. They may as well just give potential customers L/N's phone number.

Yeah, the management are really great.

Well, that's a bit of a rant, but it didn't really answer the question I asked.

How would you advise Clico to improve their marketing? What would make you want to buy a Clifton if you were in the market for a new plane?