agh This is driving me nuts! (he's on about his health again

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He told me he wouldn't operate on me until he'd done a test called a discogram. This was the most painful experience of my life (and that's saying something). It involved inserting a needle all the way into the joints of the spine and injecting fluid, for me to tell them if it hurt. After the first joint I had to ask them to stop. It was unbearable. They left me on a wheel chair in a busy out patients waiting room in a whimpering mess. That whole incident nearly pushed me over the edge and was a really low point.


Wiser:

It might be that you're one of the unlucky guys who have a low pain threshold.

I had the same procedure as you well as a myelogram and whilst it did hurt like hell, I found it bearable and just something I had to endure to get it sorted.

I think I'm a real wimp - just glad I ain't female as I certainly having witnessed childbirth would have been celebate!!!!!!!!!!!! :)
 
Dave, I've been nagging my GP for months to get reffered to a pain clinic. When I was in with my gut problem, a member of the pain team came to see me to get my meds sorted for that specific problem. She was really good and listened to all my problems with both conditions. What she did was re-arrange everything and put me on a whole new scheme of drugs. They are not really any better in terms of pain. But they have helped with other areas like constipation and the old meds put me off my food which these don't. So I'm eating better. As I say, I'm nagging my GP but she just keeps telling me to wait for a diagnosis.

Paul, I've been thinking about what to do about the woodworking for a long time. You're absolutely right, downsizing to something like boxes is probably what I'm going to have to do. It'll be hard to come to terms with and a real shock to the system to not have the calibre of machinery to my finger tips. But it's logical.

As I say, phased return is a given. They have offered me a lot and I just can't fault them. The decision is whether I should 'grin and bare' the pain. Will I be any use to them if my mind is constantly thinking about the pain. I'll just be a clock watcher.

Hopefully Friday's uncomfortable video shoot, should begin to give some answers to the gut problems. Who knows, maybe the two things are related. They've co-existed on various levels for about the same period of time.

I can feel the collective vibe of a thousand woodworkers rolling their eyes when reading this thread. But it's helped. Talking to family can be frustrating because they just want me to 'take it easy' and not worry about this stuff. My wife thinks it's bizarre that I'm considering going back to work, despite being fraught at the prospect of what will happen if I don't. I'll never work the fairer *** out :roll: :wink:
 
wizer":1acw1miq said:
I'll never work the fairer *** out :roll: :wink:

You and every other bloke on the planet.

Your financial worries are over if you can sort that one - I for one would pay good money for the answer :?
 
Yes you must be right Lons. I always thought my pain threshold was high. I've sat through 6 hour tattoo sessions without a flinch! :D About a year before the discogram I had facet joint injections which is basically the same thing and I literally screamed the place down. :shock: :roll: :wink:
 
wizer":2lv1yodf said:
Matt you make a good point about the house downsizing thing. My wife is hell bent on it but I'm not so sure. The idea is not to reduce the repayments (as I'm not sure we will really), but to lower the running costs and release some funds. We're talking about selling a 300k house and buying something 185-200k Hopefully the money released will pay off some of the larger debts and give us a bit to do some initial decorating, etc in the new place. Whilst I'm quite good with finances, mortgages confuse the hell out of me and I'm really not sure if this make sense or not. What do you mean when you say slicing off a similar sum from your existing mortgage? Do you mean remortgage for more, releasing funds to pay off the debts? That doesn't seem feasible to me. Plus I'm not sure we could borrow any more in our current situation.

I was really just thinking that you need some capital behind you to actually move house. Stamp Duty is just a classic example of simply giving capital away without realising any benefit. Add to that solicitors fees etc and it all starts to add up to a tidy sum. Depending on the sums and thresholds for stamp duty, and the ability to make early repayments on your mortgage, you may have found it a better investment to pay off some of your mortgage. That way you get benefit rather than everyone else you're paying.

If you're downsizing to save on running costs then I would apply a similar thought process, especially if you're not anticipating a reduction in mortgage payments. Work out the actual cost to move (not forgetting mortgage arrangement fees etc) and then see if you can speculate how many years you would need to be in a new house to recover that sum based on the difference between the running cost of your current home less your new home.

Bottom line - you will give away £x amount of capital to move. You'll never see it again. Gone, poooph, no more. How else might that be better spent?

And have you thought about turning your heating down yet? (And for the casual observer, I'm not suggesting Wizer freezes in his own home, 18c and lower overnight would be "turned down"...) :)
 
Tom, if it is any consolation my body is in tatters a well. All self inflicted mind you. Smoking and drinking.

If bits don't keep falling off, they are shot to bits - I'm not going to make old bones thats for sure.

Still as a misfit in an ever changing world I will view the prospect of leaving with a measure of relief.

I am going out with my glass half full, bugger the two extra years in "Suncourt nursing home".

T (aged 45)
 
Tom, I don't think I can offer any insights or advice, just some support. From several hundred miles away, via the internet.... you get what I mean :D

In general I have pretty good health, so have no frame of reference, the only thing I do seem to acquire easily and once a year is a mild form of gastroenteritis. This means I have a gut ache for a few days and can't really eat, if I'm honest the pain isn't that bad and can be controlled with nurofen, but even at that level because you have a pain in your core it does consume most of your thoughts and you feel quite feeble - full on gut rot/food poisoning or flu (proper flu) makes you realise just how fragile we are.

I've also suffered sports related back pain/injury and know how debilitating that is for the few days it takes to heal. All of which is a rambly way of saying I've just about scratched the surface of what you're going through and therefore have only the utmost sympathy for those that have to deal with this kind of pain every day.

It sounds to me like you're doing all you can to explore options and avoid getting into the benefits spiral; and only you know your body and what you can tolerate. I'd agree that you do need something to keep you sane and if woodworking is that something then you need to keep it in your life somehow. I'm a desk jockey by day and mountain biking, woodworking and photography are my energy and creative releases that help keep the balance.

Don't ever feel that you can't piss and moan here either, it's a good release for you and there's always the chance some good will come from it. Everyone needs a good rant, I had to get my crappy day off my chest to Mrs IB tonight after class, I've been left in the s*** by a spacktard member of staff this week who almost seems to have been living a double life

Chin up
 
wizer":11pskn5l said:
...
The absolute last thing I want to do is claim benefits. .....
Just picking out a detail - I don't think you should feel any guilt or anxiety about being on benefits, if that's what it comes down to.
Benefits are intended for all those who for whatever reason find that they can't easily survive by working. There are a lot of them, not many are out and out 'scroungers'.
Just see it as pay back time for all the tax, insurance stamps etc. which you have paid for whilst working. Your turn now, temporary we hope, somebody elses turn next.
Less than 50% of the population are actually in work - the remainder are all on 'benefits' of one kind or another. It's the idle rich which piss me off, especially when they are dodging taxes and gambling with our livelihoods. I'm quite happy about all the others!
 
big soft moose":522lhp0a said:
wizer":522lhp0a said:
Well the downsizing thing is in action at the moment. I've just gone through phase one of the workshop clear-out ...

without wanting to sound like a nagging wife , didnt you just buy a dirty great scms

DSC_0707.JPG


to point out the blindingly obvious the point of a downsize is supposed to be to generate money to clear your debts and provide a cushion if the worst happens, not to reinvest it in big shiny toolage :lol:

Come on Mr Moose , Give tom a break :lol:

You remember how Good it makes you feel ( Therapy ) with a nice new shiny tool sitting in the workshop looking at you :p
 
Tom, I can tell you that Crohn's is not a permanent problem, you have periods I think are called recession and other times when your stomach nerves are calm and these are normal times.
So try not to burn any bridges and get through this bad spell.
I remember a doctor saying to me, "its not lethal"
 
Tom,

You, and only you, know how much pain you can handle, what your thresholds and tolerances are and whether you can work at the job you are currently employed in or not. We cannot advise on the original question you posed since we all have different tolerances to pain and two presentations of the same disease are not identical. What we can offer advice on is alternative strategies or thougts for your wider situation. To me you have 3 areas - work, medication and woodworking. Running through these is an issue of finance.

Lets start with work. You state you are an IT consultant, and you appear to have an understanding employer who has stood by you so far. They will not carry you forever however and you have a meeting with them soon to discuss future options. The first thing you need to do is have a plan and some suggestions for that meeting. To show a willingness to work if at all possible. So you need to be able to offer to work part time or flexi time. You need to offer to work from home, or switch roles so you can work from home. You need to show you are trying to help as best you can, while realising that as a company they have a bottom line to protect. The smaller the company the less likely they are to carry you indefinitely, but the more relationships become important and the harder it is to let a friend go. Be positive at the meeting and show willing, as I am sure you will be. In a worst case scenario they have to let you go, start thinking about alternative employment now. You have IT skills, can you do odd jobbing or contract work from home? Can you offer web design services? Can you offer programming services to anyone? Can you set up your own business - IT would seem to have little in the way of overheads and equipment so its feasible to run from where you live.

On to illness and medication - if the pain is so great that you cannot work then you need to seek pain relief from your GP and not take 'NO' for an answer. Change your GP if you have to, or at least seek an appointment with another GP at the same practice, but if the pain is such that you cannot work then it needs medicating. Explain your situation to your GP, about your desire to work, that you do not want to be on benefits and that the pain makes it difficult. Book a double appointment to get the time you need to explain everything. The NHS also offers counselling services if having someone to talk to in confidence outside of family and a public internet forum helps you. Be realistic however, the NHS takes time to do anything and it cannot cure everything. An awful lot of medicine is trial and error and diagnoses are not 100% correct first time. You may well need to play with meds to get the relief you need and you will get different views from different docs. They are not doing it to be deliberately annoying. Going private will get you quicker treatment and a more sympathetic ear, but will not necessarily provide a more accurate diagnosis.

Woodwork - I am going to be brutal here, and apologies if its not what you want to hear, its just my opinion. You need to scale back - big time. As already discussed in this thread, pick an area you can do a bit of and stick with it. Be that turning, box making, scrolling, hand work or whatever. Something that is small scale in terms of size and equipment needs. Make sure its not a chore, something that gives you pleasure, but not something that needs a double garage and 15k worth of kit. So you want to make furniture? No problem with that, but you will still be able to make it in the future provided you are sensible now. Be realistic with yourself - sit down with a blank bit of paper and ask yourself what you want to do, what you need to do it and then temper that with your current finances, your future finances and your desire to support and nurture your family. You very often have good bits of kit for sale on this forum, bought at full price and sold at a loss. Be realistic befoore you buy anything else - is it a requirement for your current needs or is it a luxury? Yes it may be useful for furniture making, but does it pay for itself now in terms of either work saving, time saving or resale value. If the answer to all those is NO then don't buy it - its a desire not a necessity.

As for finance - thats not something that should be discussed on a public forum except in the most general terms. Only you know your incomings and debts and whether those debts are secured or unsecured. You primary aim, if you suspect your income is going to reduce is to reduce your debt burdon as well. This can be something simple like cutting back on expenditure (take away meals, cheaper shopping bill, less going out, less tool purchases, or turning the heating down and putting a jumper on) or something more drastic like selling assets. As you are finding though, resale value of stuff doesn't cover purchase price - as true for tools as it is for cars. If your debt burdon is still so big that you are going to end up defaulting then there are ways to deal with this from Citizens advice, to speaking to creditors directly through to IVA and voluntary insolvency. Noyt all of these are recommended for all circumstances and you definately need to speak to a professional if you are this far in. As to downsizing the house and mortgage, a house is typically your biggest asset. If you have a mortgage on it you can do one of two things - pay more to clear it quicker, or extend the loan period to reduce monthly repayments. Option 1 is usually not feasible, option 2 doesnt tend to save much but can be handy if you need small amounts iof regular cash. It will increase overall debt sthough due to interest payments. To downsize house you can do either of the above, although from your description I presume you are doing it to reduce your mortgage payments and get some equity from your current property. Be aware that you are not a first time buyer so stamp duty still applies, and that to move will cost in the region of 10-15k when you factor in EA fees, stamp duty, solicitor fees, removals and decorating the new place - more if it needs DG windows etc. Above all with finances, don't hide from it as it will not go away - sit down with a piece of paper again, work out what coming in, whats going out and if out is more than in decide how to reduce the out or increase the in.

Sorry if that is a bit 'sucking eggs' and obvious, but sometimes it helps to have the obvious stated. Whatever you do make a plan and make a start on sorting things out - woodwork, although it may bring you the most pleasure, is the least important of the above areas and while you do not have to stop it completely even in a worst case scenario, you do need to be realistic in your priorities.

Best,

Steve
 
Tom,

Just to lighten the mood for a moment, a Jethro joke (try to imagine a strong cornish accent).......

....My mate Denzel Penberthy walked into the doctor's one day,
walked up to the doctor's desk,
unzipped his trousers, pulled out his todger and flopped it on the desk

"What seems to be the problem Mr Penberthy ?" asks the doctor

"Nothing" replied Denzel, "Its a beauty innit ?"
 
hehe Paul, I don't have any problems in that Debt (thankfully) ;)

devonwoody":3iy8p1xx said:
I think are called recession

Oh god, not more recession John! :lol: I think you mean Remission ;)

Steve, thanks for taking the time to shoot me some home truths. To some extent it is 'sucking egg's', I am aware of what's happening. But I can't help hiding from it. Which is why I get myself in a mess like last night. It's funny how things can look in the morning.

There's so much good advice here but if you take a subjective view of all this advice, it's still hard to chose the right direction.

Hopefully they can give me some clues after the brown movie show on Friday and I'll have more info to help me with these decisions.

One thing is for sure. I'm absolutely eager to get back to work. My biggest worry is people thinking that I'm not. But the battle I have is convincing myself that it's possible\viable. I've tried a few times in the past couple of weeks to get myself back into some sort of routine that would give me the feed back I need to know I can do it. But it always fails miserably. I'm not sure that if I was actually going to work it be different. I might be less tempted to 'give up'. But then I've actually been suffering for 5yrs not just 5months. So I know what it's like to be sitting in a chair with beads of sweat running down my forehead, fixated on laying flat. To the extent that on warm summer days I would go to the nearest park and spend my lunch hour laying flat on the grass.

I work within a support department and as such there is not really any homeworking opportunities. Whilst I consider myself a very competant web designer, I have no commercial experience and have my own 'way of working' which doesn't transfer into the real world. As such I think it would be hard enough to get a job as a web developer, but to get a new employer to give me a job where I work from home will be difficult. Especially if I am upfront about the reasons for not being able to work in an office environment.

I've spent the last couple of months seriously considering my options with regard to setting up on my own. I have what I think are some good ideas and I'm certain they would work. The problem is finance. I have nothing and starting with nothing is going to be tricky. One option is to sell up everything and gamble that money on one or all of these ideas. But obviously this is a big risk. These ideas are all based around businesses that would allow me to work mainly from home where I can manage my day. During 'good weeks' I can get by with doing some sort of activity for 2hrs, laying flat for 1hr then activity for 2hrs, etc It's all pipe dreams tho. I just don't think it's viable.

Thanks very much to everyone who took the time to offer advice. Some of it was raw and hard to swallow, but I guess I was looking for that.

I would say that I will keep you informed, but that's obvious ;)
 
Just one quick thought on what you wrote. Have you had any tests recently to see if you are suffering from depression? If you haven't there are plenty of websites with questionnaires which can help you to see if this may be a problem. I'm quite sure that you don't want to be diagnosed with yet another illness however if you are suffering from some form of depressive illness then treatment for it may well help you to cope with your other problems. I have been treated both medically (prozac) and with therapy (loosely based on CBT) and can recommend both although long term it was the CBT that helped me to address the underlying issues that caused my depression. I really think now, I am much better able to handle problems thanks to the therapy that I had as I have generally a more positive attitude, although this year I am pretty sure that I have been affected by SAD - not something that occurs when living in the tropics!

Finally I can thoroughly recommend a book by Dr Tim Cantopher entitled Depressive Illness - The curse of the strong.

HTH,

Steve
 
wizer":11f7zswd said:
. . . I can't help hiding from it. Which is why I get myself in a mess like last night. . . . My biggest worry is people thinking that I'm not. But the battle I have is convincing myself that it's possible\viable. . . . I might be less tempted to 'give up'. . . . Whilst I consider myself a very competant web designer, I have no commercial experience . . . . The problem is finance. I have nothing and starting with nothing is going to be tricky. . . . It's all pipe dreams tho. I just don't think it's viable.

Tom,

You wrote the above while I was writing my previous post.

Steve
 
Thanks Steve. That's something that I've tried to ignore. What I can't bring myself to do, is go to the doctor and say "Hi Doc, I'm depressed. Got any Prozac?" It's so easy for people to say "Oh I'm so depressed" these days, that you just sound like a "Slap head back whinger". Despite pouring my heart out on a public internet forum, I'm actually not one to bleat on about my personal problems. The more and more 'real' all this gets the more I talk about it because it's all encompassing. But to be honest I'd rather it just stopped and I could get on with talking about wood and tools :roll: :wink: I'm perhaps one of the more social members here, I've met many of you face to face, but it's still easier to talk about this here than in person with people. Here, people can just ignore me without giving me that suppressed eye rolling look. In person I prefer to skim over it unless I sense someone is genuinely interested. The Christmas before last was a bit of a dark time for me and I really was frazzled. I went to the dock and she sent me to 'Mind'. But I didn't get on very well with them. It was all "think happy thoughts' and 'Count to ten' sort of stuff. MY problems are very real, not just negativity. Since then I've given up on exploring depression as being something that can be fixed.

You mention SAD. My missus always says I suffer from that. I do dislike the winter with a passion and in the last couple of weeks I've been feeling much better on these sunny days. Is it real tho? Normally I'd be among the people who'd say "oh just pull yourself together and get on with it".

I will check out that book, cheers.
 
Tom,

I've just read through this thread and there is a helluva lot of sound advice as expected from this forum.

On the health note though, I have had back (muscle spasms) and gut (indigestion, feel sick a lot of the time, just not good generally) problems for a while now.

For the back I was quite lucky in that I can't get it fixed but I have a cure, muscle relaxants, great things, what took 3 weeks to fix now takes 3 days. Unbelieveably about 10 years on from the discovery the doctor still tries to give me painkillers when I run out lol. It's costing a prescription every couple of years to sort. If I get the twinge I can usually avoid the pills by exercising the muscle loose before it siezes up by standing and alternately raising my knees to above my waist lots or rubbing the area like mad to generate heat and massage the muscle. My point is NHS Doctors, even nice ones, don't always know whats best for you. Is there anything you have found that releases your back pain? I think I have read that when you lie on your back things get better? Have you worked out what happens internally when you do that? Does something click, tension release, you generally relax? This might help you identify the problem and a solution yourself.

Another thing you mentioned was the gut. To be honest I've not really had a bad back since I managed to sort this out myself. And my mental/physical wellbeing has improved a lot! Again same doctor, lots of hospital visits (including private), cameras, allsorts, not nice and results all clear lol. I was determined to sort it though so I started ignoring certain food/drink groups one at a time. Wheat/Gluten (mum/sister is coeliac), Veg, dairy, caffiene, then last but not least meat. I was shocked to find out that meat or most likely the meat proteins were giving me so many problems. I am currently a non political vegetarian and feel great most of the time rather than sickly. I've started jogging, woodwork, have more energy and even the back has been better. It might be something you could try to identify if its something in your diet causing you problems with the gut. I'm gutted that it's meat and do try a bit now and then but I usually feel terrible for a couple of days afterwards. I spoke to a friend doctor unofficially and she said maybe give it a year or two and see how you are after that. So I will with the odd temptation here and there :)

I really hope something here helps. I equally know how frustrating it can be when you're told to try this that and the other. Fingers crossed for you matey whatever decisions you make.
 
wizer":38utg3jj said:
You mention SAD. My missus always says I suffer from that. I do dislike the winter with a passion and in the last couple of weeks I've been feeling much better on these sunny days. Is it real tho? Normally I'd be among the people who'd say "oh just pull yourself together and get on with it".
Tom, much sympathy. I can't add much to the vast amount of sound information that others have contrributed, except to wish you all the best in whichever way you see as the 'way forward'

I will however just add a word about SAD, which is something that SWIMBO suffers from during the winter. The solution is easy and pain free (apart from the damage to the back pocket)...buy a large SAD lamp and sit in front of it for about 40mins each day. It does work :wink: - Rob
 
Tom, lots has been said already on here, I too think that you should at least ask your employer about working from home. I work from home and it is great gives you flexibility. Benefits to the employer are increased productivity and reduced costs.

I had never met you in person until the Kent bash, and I have never seen discussions of your illnesses, so I was not aware of them. What I can say as a "stranger" is that as soon as I met you it was clear you are not a well man, I did wonder if you had cancer and were or had been on Chemo. This I hope will be reassuring for you in that if you attend any meeting it will be clear that you are unwell. (why not ask for any meeting to be in the afternoon, so they get you later in your day rather than fresh in the morning?)

When did you have your back operation? these things can take an awefull long time to recover from, and then learning to live with what you are left with. My wife had a back operation 9 years ago, she was not in a position to consider working for at least 12 months, and full recovery took 18months. In this time, here employment was terminated by her employer as the Doctors said she may never be fit enough to return to that job. She was pentioned off with the princely sum of £70 per month! After 2 years or so she was fit enough to return to her old job, but the bridges were burned. ......Strangely, there is a job coming up there and she will be applying to go back there....shame 'cos she will lose her £70 pension!
 
Blister":17ct0po8 said:
big soft moose":17ct0po8 said:
wizer":17ct0po8 said:
Well the downsizing thing is in action at the moment. I've just gone through phase one of the workshop clear-out ...

without wanting to sound like a nagging wife , didnt you just buy a dirty great scms

DSC_0707.JPG


to point out the blindingly obvious the point of a downsize is supposed to be to generate money to clear your debts and provide a cushion if the worst happens, not to reinvest it in big shiny toolage :lol:

Come on Mr Moose , Give tom a break :lol:

You remember how Good it makes you feel ( Therapy ) with a nice new shiny tool sitting in the workshop looking at you :p

Oh yeah - I know exactly how it feels ( I have just scored a sealey pillar drill of ebay), however the point is whether one can afford it .

The sailent issue here is that yes tom will only be "£90 down" in real terms - but my point was that if he hadnt bought it but just sold the bosch he would have £300 or so more than he has now - and money in the bank is what is needed as a cushion when it comes to keepingup mortgage payments etc.

Course its not that bad because the new saw could be sold off later - possibly even for a profit - but what i'm saying is by all means sell tools to buy more tools but dont kid yourself that the selling part is "downsizing"

I'llleave that point there because I know it sounds a little unsympathetic and like anagging swimbo.
 
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