Who is in and who is out?

[Benchwayze]

Eric, Phil,
=D> =D> =D>

Well said. But of course I am just an old fuddy-duddy who should be warming his slippers, and dribbling down his front.

It is definitely time to start pulling together, instead of sniping at one another. I hope this doesn't divide the UKW Forum too much mind!

John

 

[timber]

I voted for out Now let Great Britain show what it is made of, instead of hanging on the coat tails of the .E.U.
Show some guts and start producing more goods to sell to the World.
Long live the British Empire.

 

[DennisCA]

The british empire died a long time ago.

Du you have some extra space up in Scotland for a few million Swedish and Finnish immigrants who want to leave the EU but aren't allowed to bring our countries with us?......;-)
I think EU was a very good idea from the beginning but over time it all turned into a bureaucratic empire ruled by a small elite without democratic control and without any considerations for ordinary people's lives.
There are two ways to fix this problem. Reform EU completely or dismantle it. The ultimately best choice from a Finnish point of wiew would have been to reform the EU completely from the bottom up into a democratic people's union. After you Brits deciced to leave us it is too late for that choice because nobody else is allowed to spearhead such a project.
There is a great risk is that now when the only country where open critisim is allowed by the establisment is leaving us the rest of EU will come even closer to one state governed by an elite completely disconnected from the people. A neoliberal undemocratic Fourth Reich.
I don't want to be a part of that. I want Finland to leave EU. That would be a second best choice.

I rather think the neoliberal part of the EU has been greatly weakened with Brexit. So things are looking up for the EU now rather than down. The EU must now reform or break apart, good tidings either way for us.

 

[Wuffles]

But first, undemocratically pick a new Prime Minister.

 

[Grahamshed]

Lets remember that a large chunk of the non voters did not make 'a choice to not vote'. They are the old and infirm, the elderly confused, those in mental hospitals and prisons etc etc.

 

[t8hants]

If the EU had disbanded its parliament, stopped setting European standards for everything, stopped sponsoring basket case economies, repealed the Euro, and put in strict border controls I might have voted to stay.

 

[BearTricks]

First thing this morning I saw a barrage of video posts with Farage backtracking on his suggestion (Promise? Does he have the authority to do anything about it?) that the NHS will get an extra so much a week after leaving the EU. I'm not sure if this was a clip that was broadcast this morning or if people are digging up an old video. If it was broadcast this morning, does he think people are that stupid?

Incidentally, I have seen a lot of people I wouldn't usually agree with - and many I would - suggesting that the UK government actually do its job and decide rather than relying on an uninformed public. I'm sure Cameron's spin doctors pushed the idea of a referendum, however, to confuse accountability if anything does go wrong.

Britain is no longer, and never will be great again. We're in a communication age, rather than one of crusading across the sea to steal other people's tea. Part of the reason why leaving the EU saddens me is that it's a statement that we're happier to burn bridges rather than build them.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Lets remember that a large chunk of the non voters did not make 'a choice to not vote'. They are the old and infirm, the elderly confused, those in mental hospitals and prisons etc etc.

The old and infirm can vote by proxy or by post (and maybe did?). There is no reason why the others should. (another good reason for getting out of the EU?).

 

[Wuffles]

First thing this morning I saw a barrage of video posts with Farage backtracking on his suggestion (Promise? Does he have the authority to do anything about it?) that the NHS will get an extra so much a week after leaving the EU. I'm not sure if this was a clip that was broadcast this morning or if people are digging up an old video. If it was broadcast this morning, does he think people are that stupid?

Incidentally, I have seen a lot of people I wouldn't usually agree with - and many I would - suggesting that the UK government actually do its job and decide rather than relying on an uninformed public. I'm sure Cameron's spin doctors pushed the idea of a referendum, however, to confuse accountability if anything does go wrong.

Britain is no longer, and never will be great again. We're in a communication age, rather than one of crusading across the sea to steal other people's tea. Part of the reason why leaving the EU saddens me is that it's a statement that we're happier to burn bridges rather than build them.

The Farage clip was from today, and Cameron has just resigned. I'm assuming you've not seen the latest news?

 

[Phil Pascoe]

If the EU had disbanded its parliament, stopped setting European standards for everything, stopped sponsoring basket case economies, repealed the Euro, and put in strict border controls I might have voted to stay.

99% of the population would - but most of that is its raison d'etre. (dunno where the circumflex is on my keyboard before someone accuses me of covert xenophobia and ignorance of other languages).

 

[RobinBHM]

My local coffee shop has a manageress that is Eastern European, she was visibly upset this morning, tellng me 'I am 28, the UK is my home and now I dont what is going to happen to my future'. This morning my thoughts are with those that have a very personal concern about their future and I hope they are all quickly reassured by the government that there wont be any rash decisions made on border restrictions.

I agree fully with Jacob about a free market in Europe, I hope it can continue.

 

[MIGNAL]

It probably will after Boris has been selected. Some time later he'll have us making a Norwegian type deal. Back in again !
Lot of fuss about nothing.

 

[MIGNAL]

My local coffee shop has a manageress that is Eastern European, she was visibly upset this morning, tellng me 'I am 28, the UK is my home and now I dont what is going to happen to my future'. This morning my thoughts are with those that have a very personal concern about their future and I hope they are all quickly reassured by the government that there wont be any rash decisions made on border restrictions.

I agree fully with Jacob about a free market in Europe, I hope it can continue.

Tell her she'll be OK. This isn't Germany circa 1933. . . . . :shock:

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I hope all the Europeans working and living here don't take fright - I can't see any reason for them to. It'll be an age before anything is done, and restrictions will undoubtedly apply to future immigrants. I just hope we can get to a point that the next immigrant (of whatever nationality or colour) is a brilliant engineer or surgeon, not a pickpocket with his family of twelve. Bye bye Cameron, btw - a two faced hypocrite ... still, he'll have a much better life than most of us.
^^^ Of course, you are right. This isn't Germany in 1933.

 

[dickm]

It's a sad, bad day. Whatever happened to the spirit of tolerance and compassion that did once characterise Britain? However it was dressed up in spurious economics and claims about democracy, the Leave campaign was at heart a vicious, racist denial of the rights of anyone apart from Little Englanders. How could so many of our compatriots (at least south of the Border) fall for these arguments, especially when presented by unsavoury characters like Farage, Gove and Johnson?

 

[Eric The Viking]

But of course I am just an old fuddy-duddy who should be warming his slippers, and dribbling down his front. )

You're ways away from anything of that sort.

My mum (89) and my dad (86) were both absolutely determined to vote. Mum did so by post (which she organised all by herself, recent cateract op not withstanding); dad got a lift to the polling station from my brother-in-law.

They both saw it as an unexpected chance to correct the mistake they made in 1975.

E.

 

[Wuffles]

...not a pickpocket with his family of twelve.

The understanding of the #LEAVE manifesto for many, in a nutshell.

 

[Jacob]

Parliament is sovereign.
The leave vote is not legally binding and if it proves impossible to get the mythical brexit "good deals" we could be back to square one very quickly.

Brexiters are already trimming away and saying it's too soon or may not be necessary to implement article 50. I think they know it's a stupid decision and, in time, yesterday will be seen as a passing protest vote.

The big Brexit mistake is in not having anything in place before the referendum. Hoping to negotiate (with EU and the rest of the world) after having committed to leaving, is basically dead stupid.

So it'll be years of fudge with everybody a loser.

 

[Eric The Viking]

It's a sad, bad day. Whatever happened to the spirit of tolerance and compassion that did once characterise Britain? However it was dressed up in spurious economics and claims about democracy, the Leave campaign was at heart a vicious, racist denial of the rights of anyone apart from Little Englanders. How could so many of our compatriots (at least south of the Border) fall for these arguments, especially when presented by unsavoury characters like Farage, Gove and Johnson?

Seriously?

If it was all "little Englanders", why did Wales vote for Brexit so strongly?

We just happen to be in the first lifeboat leaving the EU (after Greenland managed to swim to shore on their own).

Other nations will follow. And nobody wants to leave Europe, only the EU.

E.

 

[Eric The Viking]

Parliament is sovereign.
The leave vote is not legally binding and if it proves impossible to get the mythical brexit "good deals" we could be back to square one very quickly.

Brexiters are already trimming away and saying it's too soon or may not be necessary to implement article 50. I think they know it's a stupid decision and, in time, yesterday will be seen as a passing protest vote.

The big Brexit mistake is in not having anything in place before the referendum. Hoping to negotiate (with EU and the rest of the world) after having left the room is basically dead stupid.

So it'll be years of fudge with everybody a loser.

Not everybody. The other European nations now see that they can do it too. See my previous post.

It's what you wanted all along, Jacob: Britain actually leading Europe!