[Q] Why are cabinetmaker's screw drivers shaped that way?

[Fromey]

I really like the look of cabinetmaker's screw drivers and am buying one with every Axmninster order I make;

http://www.axminster.co.uk/crown-crown- ... prod21762/

But so far, I've not found any explanation as to why they are shaped the way they are. Not even Aldren Watson (Hand tools; Country Furniture) can tell me. Is it simply a historical artefact of the way they were made, now left simply for aesthetics?

 

[eribaMotters]

I would say it is for practical reasons. Firstly the shape of the wooden handle is so comfortable in use. Secondly the width of the blade where it meets the handle allows for a wider tang fitting into the handle. This must help give a stronger joint and resist the torsion between the steel of the blade and timber of the handle. I would imagine the flat profile of the blade at the top would also allow you to use a spanner for increased leverage, although I have never used it for this.

Colin

 

[t8hants]

Although I suspect they were not designed for the purpose any more than the scredrivers were designed for them, the old style "King ****" adjustable spanners were ideal for a bit of extra torque applied to the wide flat. Such practice was also the reason for broken blades and mashed screw heads. I bet we have all done it though!

Gareth

 

[Jacob]

I really like the look of cabinetmaker's screw drivers and am buying one with every Axmninster order I make;

http://www.axminster.co.uk/crown-crown- ... prod21762/

But so far, I've not found any explanation as to why they are shaped the way they are. Not even Aldren Watson (Hand tools; Country Furniture) can tell me. Is it simply a historical artefact of the way they were made, now left simply for aesthetics?

They aren't made that way. The example you show is a ******* screwdriver made by people who have forgotten how to make screwdrivers. This is not uncommon with trade 'tradition' - if the chain is broken things go wrong.
The proper job is what is vaguely known as the' London Pattern' screwdriver something like this;

PS What I should have said was that the so called 'cabinet makers' screwdriver was just a wooden handled screwdriver designed for use by all trades. A wooden handle requires a flat blade tang into the handle to stop it rotating.
Later SDs handles were plastic, or engineered as with a ratchet SD, and the flat tang/blade could be lost. Also the wide flat tapered tip as in the 'London' pattern above would also be lost as SDs were used by engineers in more complicated structures.
So the 'cabinet makers' SD in Fromey's link is half a traditional SD at the handle end, but an engineers SD at the tip.
That's my theory anyway!

 

[MickCheese]

To stop it rolling off the bench?

Mick

 

[Sawyer]

I suspect the handle shape evolved differently from engineers' screwdrivers for two reasons. Firstly, inserting wood screws requires you to push hard on the screwdriver. Secondly, cabinetmakers will be able to do this without hands or screwdriver being oily - so no need for the effective, but uncomfortable ribbing on engineers' handles. :?:

 

[Argus]

.

There is the small matter of pilot holes which avoids damage to the screw, screwdriver and the work itself, whilst reducing the work needed ............... makes life easier for all whatever the implement used.

By coincidence, there's a blog from the States just started yesterday on making a so-called 'London-Patern' turn-screw.

http://mcglynnonmaking.wordpress.com/20 ... ew-part-1/

I believe that the writer is primarily a metal worker, but from reading past posts, his methods are sound.

All best

.

 

[Fromey]

Jacob, thanks for the information. Very interesting. I've double checked the picture in Aldren Watson's "Hand Tools" and it looks like the Axminster one. So he got it wrong! I can see from your illustration that the flat handle will stop it from easily rolling off the bench. Also, the blade looks like an adaptation of a file. Possibly just using a file blank or I know that when files wore out, they would make good use of the metal buy re-purposing it into a new tool of some sort. This design of screwdriver looks perfect for that.

 

[beech1948]

So you have been buying and using Crown screwdrivers.

Are they any good and do you like them.

Al

 

[o0dunk0o]

Jacob, thanks for the information. Very interesting. I've double checked the picture in Aldren Watson's "Hand Tools" and it looks like the Axminster one. So he got it wrong! I can see from your illustration that the flat handle will stop it from easily rolling off the bench. Also, the blade looks like an adaptation of a file. Possibly just using a file blank or I know that when files wore out, they would make good use of the metal buy re-purposing it into a new tool of some sort. This design of screwdriver looks perfect for that.

I've got a fair collection of london pattern screwdrivers from a dinky 3" overall one to a massive 28" one, most of the major Sheffield tool manufacturers made them.

In the picture the blade appears flat but the well made ones swell toward the middle of the blade so I doubt they were made from repurposed files, I do have one made from an old file but it is too hard and brittle to make it an effective driver (I've chipped the tip a few times)

 

[Fromey]

beech1948, there's not too much to report on the screwdrivers. They are, pretty much what you see on the Axminster site. They serve the purpose and are fairly well made considering how cheap they are. The handles are slightly oval in shape but turn fully round in the section next to the ferrule. They are stained a not particularly pleasant urine yellowish colour but the wood grain shows nicely. There are no knots are perceptible weaknesses. The ferrule is about 1 mm thick and stamped out in a single piece. The blade is fitted adequately but it's here where a more expensive screwdriver would probably be better with a neater fit. The blade is fairly symmetrical, although not perfect, and with slightly sharp edges; nothing a quick filing and/or wet & dry paper can't soften up. The shaft is fairly round with just a few flat edges showing if you look closely. The business end is square and crisp. Actually, now that I consider it, they're actually damn fine screwdrivers considering the price. I see no practical reason one would want to refine them any more. If you're after an old style screwdriver, these do nicely and are a good price to add to an order just to push it into the free delivery range, should you need to.

 

[jimi43]

I'm sure the Prof will chip in with the relevant sheet from old catalogues but I will again post my Holtzappfel a later pair of cabinet maker screwdrivers....

The turnscrew from the famous London firm here....

...no rolling off the bench here...

And now the others...a boxwood handled beauties from a later period.....

Of course...if you want to get specialized...then the gunsmith ones of an even earlier era are my favourites...

8)

Jim

 

[Dusty]

i

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Q

 

[Phil Pascoe]

All these olde worlde screwdrivers are great for -
1/ screws you can no longer buy..........or
2/ the 99.9% of screws that are Pozi.....or Philips ....?

 

[Sawyer]

All these olde worlde screwdrivers are great for -
1/ screws you can no longer buy..........or
2/ the 99.9% of screws that are Pozi.....or Philips ....?

3/ Furniture restorers!

 

[bugbear]

I really like the look of cabinetmaker's screw drivers and am buying one with every Axmninster order I make;

http://www.axminster.co.uk/crown-crown- ... prod21762/

But so far, I've not found any explanation as to why they are shaped the way they are. Not even Aldren Watson (Hand tools; Country Furniture) can tell me. Is it simply a historical artefact of the way they were made, now left simply for aesthetics?

They aren't made that way. The example you show is a ******* screwdriver made by people who have forgotten how to make screwdrivers. This is not uncommon with trade 'tradition' - if the chain is broken things go wrong.
The proper job is what is vaguely known as the' London Pattern' screwdriver something like this;

PS What I should have said was that the so called 'cabinet makers' screwdriver was just a wooden handled screwdriver designed for use by all trades. A wooden handle requires a flat blade tang into the handle to stop it rotating.
Later SDs handles were plastic, or engineered as with a ratchet SD, and the flat tang/blade could be lost. Also the wide flat tapered tip as in the 'London' pattern above would also be lost as SDs were used by engineers in more complicated structures.
So the 'cabinet makers' SD in Fromey's link is half a traditional SD at the handle end, but an engineers SD at the tip.
That's my theory anyway!

One hesitates to marr an exchange of opinions with anything as mundane as facts, but...

A look at old catalogues (I checked 3 from around or just after 1900, and all told the same story) shows that "London pattern" and "Cabinet Makers" screwdrivers (often called "Turnscrews") were listed together, with the London pattern being the cheaper option by around 30%.

Looking at a newer catalogue, both patterns are represented by the "Comet" brand, in the 1960's.

So it doesn't appear the London pattern was forgotten, or that Cabinet Maker's pattern are somehow a mistake by the ignorant.

BugBear

 

[Jacob]

Actually what I was trying to say was that the flat tang is basically essential to a wood handled screwdriver and the shape of the handle follows from that. Early screwdrivers would all have flat tangs and flat blades as a matter of course (the easiest way to make them) as in the 'London pattern' above.
Flat tang/wooden handle plus round blade is later. Round blade plus round (fluted) tang is later still and made possible by plastic handles.

 

[bugbear]

Actually what I was trying to say was that the flat tang is basically essential to a wood handled screwdriver and the shape of the handle follows from that. Early screwdrivers would all have flat tangs and flat blades as a matter of course (the easiest way to make them) as in the 'London pattern' above.
Flat tang/wooden handle plus round blade is later. Round blade plus round (fluted) tang is later still and made possible by plastic handles.

OK, that's quite different, in fact and tone, to your earlier post, and a good deal more sensible.

BugBear