Pope's Visit - cost

[Fred Page]

I'll probably get into trouble because of this posting but if anybody feels as strongly as I do about who pays for this then please go to -

http://www.secularism.org.uk/petition-the-pm.html

 

[Max Power]

Im not a catholic , but isnt he the head of the Vatican state ? Do other nations pay when their leaders visit us ? If your lot were protesting for the leader of a muslim state to pay his own way we would be having rioting in the streets no doubt

 

[Mike.C]

I'll probably get into trouble because of this posting but if anybody feels as strongly as I do about who pays for this then please go to -

http://www.secularism.org.uk/petition-the-pm.html

I am a catholic, but thats neither here nor there, and I do not see why this head of state should have to pay for his visit when none of the others do. If other countries paid their way then I would agree that the pope should, but they do not, so why should he?

EDIT: I must admit that at first I did not pay much attention to who organised the petition, but after seeing that it came from a Secularism group who appear to be very anti catholic, their statement of the £20 million could be used by schools, hospitals or the social services is just a smoke screen and IMHO holds no water. This group is nothing like what George Holyoake had in mind when he came up with the term "Secularism" He like many others through history wanted the government and religion to exist separately (rightly so) and neither of them to have any say in how the other was run. But these are just a bunch of catholic bashers.

Cheers

Mike

 

[Steve Maskery]

I can see both sides. Yes the Pope is head of a State, but it's a State like no other in the world. What is its population? What does it produce? What i its political and social structure like? It bears no resemblance to any other State or country in the world, it is just a very wealthy and well-run self-promoted organization.

The issue may be that the cost of protecting The Pope may be considerably higher, than, say, the King of Sweden (do they even have a King, anymore? I don't know) but you get my point.

I've never been a very political animal, but as I get older, my niaivety becomes more of a problem. I find the idea of politicians spending money that I have no choice about handing over, to pay for things I don't want to buy, increasingly annoying.

This is just one of many.

S

 

[jlawrence]

Steve, that would be a very very long list of things.

As a head of state the pope deserves the same courtesy as all others - that includes paying for whatever security is necessary to ensure his safety whilst here. I'm not religious in any way and disagree with a lot that the catholic church stands for, but that is irrelevant - he is still a head of state.

 

[Smudger]

In which case he really shouldn't tell his people to get involved on a particular side in a general election - which is what he has done.
Personally, I wouldn't let him in. I might even reinstate the Test Acts...

 

[Digit]

Well I'm Jewish and don't believe in bashing any faith, and I would point out that the Pope was invited by the British Government.

Roy.

 

[Max Power]

Shalom, Digit , there is a large orthodox jewish community near me at gateshead . I did a lot of work there when I was involved in double glazing, some of the best people I ever worked for

 

[Digit]

Ahhh! Shucks!

Roy.

 

[Smudger]

I lived in Sunderland in the late 60s early 70s, when there was a large Jewish community. The jumble sales were great - big coats and Homburgs! All the men looked like my idea of a Rabbi...
All gone now, kids moved away, parents died or went to live with the kids. Sad.

 

[Max Power]

The community in gateshead is thriving as theres a large jewish college there. All the streets off coatsworth road have jewish famillies. I sometimes call that way to go to super pie =P~ =P~ =P~ (the best pie and mushy peas in the north east) and in 25 + years have never heard of any trouble

 

[Digit]

There's good and bad in all groups Alan.

Roy.

 

[Max Power]

Thats very true Roy, an unfortunate aspect of human nature

 

[shedhead]

As a Catholic and i do not see what the problem is all about.
Yes the British Gov should pay for the Pope's visit. Just think of the money that will be made in Britain with each region as everyone turning up to see the Pope will spend money in that area. Also the manufacturing of memorabilia and so on.

 

[Digit]

As far as I'm concerned Dermot, there isn't one.

Roy.

 

[big soft moose]

i'm an aetheist but i still think the british govt should bear the cost of the visit as he is a head of state and they invited him

as a matter of interest the popes personal security is handled by the swiss guard (traditionally swiss "mercenaries" in the pay of the vatican) who are very tasty so i dont think the uk security forces/police will have much to do beyond sweeps and vetting etc - most of which they do as a matter of routine anyway.

 

[miles_hot]

as a matter of interest the popes personal security is handled by the swiss guard (traditionally swiss "mercenaries" in the pay of the vatican) who are very tasty .

Didn't realise you were into that sort of dressing up Moose

when you talk about smocks I assumed that you were into turning smocks...

Miles

 

[wizer]

I'm a devout aethiest. But I find the catholic religion and especially the concept of the vactican, fascinating. I care not about him visiting the UK, I just some nut job doesn't do something silly or it'll be the typical media frenzy on steroids.

 

[MikeG.]

I used to be an aetheist until I realised that Richard Dawkins is god. I don't give two hoots about a Papal visit, nor who pays for it, but I do care that his words condem generations of Africans to more misery through Aids and over-large families.

Mike

Aetheist? Well, my daughter has labelled me an anti-theist, which I rather like. Isn't this thread running close to the "no religion, no politics" rule?

 

[StevieB]

I used to be an aetheist until I realised that Richard Dawkins is god.

He used to be, now he seems to be a bumbling old fella that repeats himself an awful lot and attempts to break the world record for the number of books published by one writer in a year :roll:

The Selfish Gene and The Blind Watchmaker were good, with a scientific background appropriate to their time and place. They could do with updating but still make coherent sense today. Books such as The God Delusion tend towards the pontification end of scientific theory and seem designed more to counter pro-religious theories than to provide truly novel understanding of evolutionary biology, genetics and science. Perhaps its just me, as a scientist, having a better understanding than I did as an A-level student and undergraduate, but I have gone from avidly reading his early works to not even buying the latest books, which seem to appear every 6 months or so now and to be very similar to each other.

Richard Dawkins has also lost him niche appeal - you cannot move in a bookshop for similar titles and authors both for and against the 'god debate'. All they seem to be doing is arguing back and forth with each other in print, with varying degrees of scientific evidence or passionate belief to back up their views. Fine for them as has time to pontificate, but hardly pushing the boundaries of the field forward by much.

Steve