Modern Plane Irons

[Trafalgar]

Stanley and Record both did HSS for Australia and New Zealand. I'll try to find the source but I'm sure I read that they were never all that popular. Of course, these irons do not account for the beautiful work from native species housed in Australian museums and private collections made well before HSS would have been available. They muddled through somehow.

Kunz still make HSS replacement irons that will fit and has provided these for years. Anybody in need of something more robust certainly has had this option for a few decades, at least, not accounting for the Stanley/Record HSS that might have been available in the vintage market.

Here's Kunz that will fit a No. 4 or No. 5:

http://www.pecktool.com/shop/50mm-2-hss ... lane-iron/

And scroll down at the link for HSS block plane irons.

Maybe we need to see a review of these irons, plus the ones Corneel linked to, vs. PM-VII and high end A2.

Alas, I won't hold my breath.

If one is totally freaked about tearout whilst four-squaring some gnarly tropical species, Kunz make toothed blades you can drop in your bench plane then finish up with their HSS for your No. 4:

From England's own Workshop Heaven:

http://www.workshopheaven.com/tools/Kun ... lanes.html

Two Cherries USA has HSS that is a bit less expensive than the Kunz offering:

https://twocherriesusa.com/product/hss-cut-plane-iron/

Mujingfang make their planes with the option of HSS as well:

http://www.workshopheaven.com/tools/Muj ... lanes.html

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

Hi Kees

I have one, I think ... mine is badged "Smoothcut". I have been led to believe that they are the same. Not HSS, rather a typical Japanese laminated blade. And very nice it is too. Same thickness as the Stanley blade.

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Trafalgar]

Yes, the description at the link he provided said it was a laminated iron, blue steel as a matter of fact.

 

[MIGNAL]

Axminster did the Japanese laminated Stanley replacement blades. I think I bought mine back in the mid '90's, so they've been making them for a while. It wasn't cheap even back then, the last time I saw them in Axminster I think they were around £50?
Anyway, hard steel. The difference was noticeable when honing.

 

[D_W]

Tools from japan sells laminated replacement blades too for Stanley planes. Made by Tsunesaburo. Not cheap.

http://www.toolsfromjapan.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=339_514_546

I think they are made from a ready made bulk product also used for japanese kitchen knifes. So they aren't made one by one at the forge like some other Japanes blades are made, but as a large sheet with a laminated edge, which is then cut out. Stanley back in the day probably made them in a similar way.

Yes, rikizai. Pre-laminated material that comes from the mill and looks like it's cut on a stamping machine. Someone in japan (not stu) mentioned to me that a lot of the lower priced plane irons that are called "hand forged" are rikizai material. It's still very good quality stuff and a good option for someone with synthetic stones who doesn't want to use a grinder.

Same goes for the knives that are rikizai, they are super quality and should be relatively cheap. can't steel them, though.

 

[Trafalgar]

Axminster did the Japanese laminated Stanley replacement blades. I think I bought mine back in the mid '90's, so they've been making them for a while. It wasn't cheap even back then, the last time I saw them in Axminster I think they were around £50?
Anyway, hard steel. The difference was noticeable when honing.

They still have them:

http://www.axminster.co.uk/japanese-lam ... ane-blades

Good Lord hardened to HRc 68, blue paper steel #2.

I see Axminster must have dropped their "Tools to Your Door" slogan and logo. I always sort of liked it.

 

[MIGNAL]

That's the one. It's an expensive blade. I can't remember how much I paid for mine. It was significantly more expensive than a normal Stanley blade but I don't think the difference was anywhere near what it is now. In other words the normal Stanley has probably risen with inflation, the Japanese laminate with inflation + quite a bit more.

 

[Corneel]

HRC 68 should be taken with a huge grain of salt! That would be magical steel again.

In pounds the Tsunsabur plane irons are about 28 pound, but add to that VAT, import tax and postage.

 

[Trafalgar]

I certainly did a double-take at the hardness level. The HSS irons I linked to are around 62 to 64 I think. Much more realistic.

 

[Trafalgar]

"Yes, rikizai. Pre-laminated material that comes from the mill and looks like it's cut on a stamping machine. Someone in japan (not stu) mentioned to me that a lot of the lower priced plane irons that are called "hand forged" are rikizai material."

Have to love their marketing moxie, if nothing else. Maybe somebody's hands touched the material at some point in the industrial process.

 

[bugbear]

Long ago (mid 90s), Axminster offered a hard Japanese laminated blade called "Smoothcut" (NOT Samurai) which was rather cheap (only twice the price of Stanley "cheese" blade of the period).

I bought one, and it's been superb.

EDIT;

http://swingleydev.com/archive/get.php? ... t_thread=1

BugBear

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

Long ago (mid 90s), Axminster offered a hard Japanese laminated blade called "Smoothcut" (NOT Samurai) which was rather cheap (only twice the price of Stanley "cheese" blade of the period).

I bought one, and it's been superb.

EDIT;

http://swingleydev.com/archive/get.php? ... t_thread=1

BugBear

Hi BB

It is interesting how long "improvements" have been made with just an upgrade in blade. Clearly not about using the chip breaker since there is mention of very fine shavings. Very fine shavings have long been the measure of a well tuned plane, and the harder Holtey and Hock blades helped in that regard, and have done so for 15+ years, according to Old Tools discussions. Longer planing sessions are also highly prized.

Regard from Perth

Derek

 

[Trafalgar]

I think there's a huge element of the fisherman's tale with regard to long planing sessions and being put out about stopping to hone. Some guys look as if they need to stop for nitroglycerine, if not a honing break.

For some reason my wife thought this needed to be memorialized. Probably thought I'd die, or something. Earlier in the summer. 105+ degree heat index, four straight hours of four-squaring at this point (NOT a fisherman's tale). I stopped for a rest on a rolling parts cart that's in the shop. Marples jack in hand. Oil lamp burning citronella to ward of mosquitoes. Honing breaks were welcome, though the old Marples didn't need all that many believe me:

Sweatshirt to keep sweat from running down my arms to the tool and wood. You're looking at a tired puppy who couldn't care less about edges that go off too soon. I wish the Marples went off faster. I don't have a whole lot of sympathy for little fairies that flit around bitc*ing about planes getting dull too fast. I got a six mile run in later that evening in about 43 minutes. Not bad for a 54 year old with bad knees.

 

[Trafalgar]

On a less severe note, my daughter got her first public library card today. Here is a picture of her with it and the first book she ever checked out under her own name. I built the mantel she's standing in front of (I'll post better pictures of it sometime soon):

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

Charles, you look exhausted. I feel for you. Perth in summer is dry but very hot (40 Centigrade most days mid December through February). My wife has been pushing me to get air con in the garage/workshop, which is sensible as it is difficult to last longer than a hour at a time before taking a break.

Your daughter is cute and gorgeous. You are a lucky man. That's what it is all about.

Oh, and the mantle looks excellent. I would like a close up.

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[D_W]

I certainly did a double-take at the hardness level. The HSS irons I linked to are around 62 to 64 I think. Much more realistic.

I had one of those irons, and when I went to oilstones, I sent it out with a millers falls plane. I'm sure someone is either enjoying it or in possession of it rusting.

I don't think it was hardness 68, but it was definitely too hard for oilstones unless ground to only a feather of bevel. Certainly wouldn't have done initial back flattening with oilstones.

Shame they're they equivalent of $90 or whatever in the UK. They cost about $40 to get directly from stu and they're an interesting novelty in that they last like hard alloyed steel but wear like carbon steel.

The convenience of oilstones wins out, though.

 

[Corneel]

Hey Charly, you look charming in that picture

I agree wholeheartedly. When doing a lot of planing, the longvity of the edge is the least of your worries. Most of the work is in the foreplane stage, and they can keep on going with sub-sharp blades anyway. Maybe doing big boards of silica rich wood would change my opinion, I don't know. In my shop the only instance when I would like a longer lasting blade is when doing a large amount of engrain work, for example smoothing out a coarsly sawn large and thick table top. But that doesn't happen too often, so I don't mind to sharpen an extra time or two.

 

[G S Haydon]

Nice couple of photos Charles.

 

[MIGNAL]

Long ago (mid 90s), Axminster offered a hard Japanese laminated blade called "Smoothcut" (NOT Samurai) which was rather cheap (only twice the price of Stanley "cheese" blade of the period).

I bought one, and it's been superb.

EDIT;

http://swingleydev.com/archive/get.php? ... t_thread=1

BugBear

I think that must have been the one I bought. It was about the same period, mid 90's.
I later sold it to a friend. I didn't get on with it as I found it difficult to sharpen. Of course I'd have a much better chance now, especially given the number of different stones that I have. Back then I only had a Smiths Arkansas as a fine stone and that seemed to cut very slowly. I still have the Arkansas. I should have sold the Arkansas and kept the blade!

 

[Bluekingfisher]

View attachment 11703184

Sweatshirt to keep sweat from running down my arms to the tool and wood. You're looking at a tired puppy who couldn't care less about edges that go off too soon. I wish the Marples went off faster. I don't have a whole lot of sympathy for little fairies that flit around bitc*ing about planes getting dull too fast. I got a six mile run in later that evening in about 43 minutes. Not bad for a 54 year old with bad knees.[/quote]

Hmmmm........ 'mad dogs and Englishmen'