Core tool kit

[Jacob]

I guess the game of Jacob-baiting is sort of an official game here at UKW... and played by none quite so well as Jacob himself.

Not sure whether to be flattered or insulted!

 

[bugbear]

I guess the game of Jacob-baiting is sort of an official game here at UKW... and played by none quite so well as Jacob himself.

He is the master.

BugBear

 

[G S Haydon]

Since the demise of the 5061, wobble in the second dimension, can be eliminated by planing the stick face, opposite the screw, out of square. The screw then twists the stick in the hole to make it firm.

I learned this very useful technique from Colen Clenton. My gauge pins are ground and honed to small crescent shaped knives. Just like his pins. These work very well both long and cross grain. Cutting gauges are reserved for veneer work.

David Charlesworth.

While I agree that cutting gauges are of course perfect for veneer work they are also used to great effect across the grain. Frank Strazza demonstrates how he uses a cutting gauge in a way I also find useful http://www.sustainlife.org/blogs/woodwo ... ing-gauge/

Not unusual to see it written about too http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=70fa ... in&f=false and http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=W2Sv ... in&f=false are just a couple.

Hope that did not come across a pedantic, just good to know it does not have to be reserved for veneers unless the owner of the gauge prefers it.

 

[G S Haydon]

I know Jacob won't want to hear it as I'm sure praise is the last thing he's looking for but I know I feel lucky to read his thoughts. He can be provocative but he is experienced and wants to promote simple methods. His is not the only road and others are equally valid but sometimes keeping things simple is the hardest thing to do.

 

[bugbear]

Bling!

(note the narrow elliptical, nearly pointed, end of the cutter, better for marking than cutting)

BugBear

 

[Ed Bray]

Just to bring this subject back on topic, how would you go about sharpening the core tool set?

 

[G S Haydon]

:lol: Ed!!!!!!!!! :lol:

 

[Sgian Dubh]

I never know whether to simply laugh or become exasperated at threads like this. To be honest I never knew that marking gauges were tools of such fiendish complexity ... until now. I always thought they were pretty simple bits of kit readily tweaked if required. Oh well, live and learn. I shall look upon those two little bits of wood, a knob with its threaded rod, and a spike (or spikes, or knife thingy) with renewed respect for their devilish complexity, their never-ending need for challenging physical upgrading, and the difficulty of their operation.

Never again will I simply set a dimension and scribe (or score) a line or lines with insouciant impunity as I've been doing for the last forty or so years without wondering how I've been getting away with it so untraumatised for so long. Slainte.

 

[JimF.]

What I like about the humble marking gauge is its humble simplicity and the way that it works because it is simply bound to.

A sharp point on a stick and a fixed distance. What could be easier or more elegant?

 

[bridger]

What I like about the humble marking gauge is its humble simplicity and the way that it works because it is simply bound to.

A sharp point on a stick and a fixed distance. What could be easier or more elegant?

Pointy stick!

 

[lurker]

=D> =D>

Just to bring this subject back on topic, how would you go about sharpening the core tool set?

=D> =D> =D>

 

[Jacob]

What I like about the humble marking gauge is its humble simplicity and the way that it works because it is simply bound to.

A sharp point on a stick and a fixed distance. What could be easier or more elegant?

Well yes.
Mind you I have a beautiful cast iron bottle opener on my key ring - this sort of thing.
It's not affected by seasonal movement in the slightest!

 

[woodbrains]

Mind you I have a beautiful cast iron bottle opener on my key ring - this sort of thing.
It's not affected by seasonal movement in the slightest!

Hello,

At last, a definite contender for inclusion in anyone's core tool kit!

Mike.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Mind you I have a beautiful cast iron bottle opener on my key ring - this sort of thing.
It's not affected by seasonal movement in the slightest!

Hello,

At last, a definite contender for inclusion in anyone's core tool kit!

Mike.

May I humbly suggest a pair of ear defenders, as well?

 

[bugbear]

What I like about the humble marking gauge is its humble simplicity and the way that it works because it is simply bound to.

A sharp point on a stick and a fixed distance. What could be easier or more elegant?

Just like its cousin, the surface gauge...

surface-gauges-for-woodworkers-t22873.html

BugBear

 

[John15]

Having followed both sides of this discussion so far, I have to come down in favour of Jacob's point of view. I enjoy using my three gauges made of wood - the single pin, the mortice gauge and the cutting gauge and get good results from them all. The inaccuracies in my work are due more to my woodworking ability rather than the tools. I do have a wheel gauge in its box up on the shelf but so far it hasn't been used.

John

 

[woodbrains]

Hello,

I think things get a bit carried away here. I only argued that wheel gauges work very well indeed, and saying they are inferior to wooden ones is nonesense. I never said wooden ones are poor tools, though some fettling is often required to get them to work effectively. I use wooden ones and wheel gauges, and fully understand the merits and pitfalls. The main benefit of the wheel gauge is, they work and you can get going without fuss. It is daft to say anyone having used pin gauges, one has never experienced the pin follow the grain and make an errant mark. It looks ugly on something that matters and a pound to a pinch, that is exactly where it happens, never under something that doesn't show. It is somehow implied here that it is lack of skill that allows this to happen, but it is just a characteristic of wood, sometimes it happens despite everything. If a gauge takes away the error, then use it and get on.

Surface gauges work well, but metal doesn't have grain direction like wood. Try marking wood with one and either the pin deflects, or the base lifts from the surface plate. Skill, whatever form that may be, will not compensate for the eccentricities of grain run out. Wood is a funny material and anything that reduces the unexpected is welcomed by me.

Mike.

 

[David C]

The modifications I have described will produce a gauge that works as well or better than a Titemark.

These take some care and time.

The pin is visible and cuts deeper than any disk/wheel. One side of the line is square to the surface, which greatly assists accuracy, just like a knife line.

Starting and stopping are more precise.

All this on a wooden gauge costing less than £5.

I can see no possible advantage in a tapered pin, except possibly for carpentry?

David

David

 

[matt_southward]

Well I've followed the discussion with great interest and I too, on balance and after reflection, would agree with Jacob's view - though not necessarily with how he expresses it :lol:

So much so, that I've decided to revisit the ordinary wooden gauge and work through the issues I've previously had with them - working with the various fettling options suggested here. I do still like my wheel gauge and don't know whether I'll switch or not, but being informed is what it's about (especially for those of us with less experience) and you have all done an excellent job of that! So bearing in mind the original topic - core marking...er...tool kits for newbies - on behalf of the newbies out here, thanks!

 

[Jacob]

The modifications I have described will produce a gauge that works as well or better than a Titemark.

These take some care and time.

The pin is visible and cuts deeper than any disk/wheel. One side of the line is square to the surface, which greatly assists accuracy, just like a knife line.

Starting and stopping are more precise.

All this on a wooden gauge costing less than £5.

I can see no possible advantage in a tapered pin, except possibly for carpentry?

David

David

Tapered pin keeps things simple.
If you have a flat side then there is a 50% chance it'll be on the wrong side, so you'll need 2 gauges, or if it's a wheel you'll have to keep turning it. There'll be a lot of confusion. With a tapered pin it's the centre of the line every time. The tiny bevel is insignificant and unlikely to be seen in the finished work
Have encountered a lot of gauges old and new but never seen one with a flat sided pin except for cutting gauges which is a different thing altogether.
I see the point (ho ho) of the trailing pin alteration but can't say I've ever felt the need.

PS at £80 almost anything is better than a Titemark! Madness!