Who is in and who is out?

[RogerS]

....
Another thought, I wonder just how much the English leavers wanted to get some sort of revenge on Cameron/Osborne for UK government's austerity measures as well?

That's an interesting thought but no-one I spoke to in the lead up to the referendum mentioned this. Most of them were seeing immigration as the issue.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

I'm not going to lock it until Noel has finished his thoughts (or he might ban me!). On the plus side, I'm about to go over the cricket ground with the some friends from America and watch my son play.....I will very likely drink a large quantity of beer and for the moment at least forget all about domestic politics

 

[RobinBHM]

I hope we see politicians coming into power that are brave and have the vision and negotiating skills to keep free trade agreements in place for goods and protect London so it retains its status in finance and service world.

Out may be a shock, the key will be how quick we can respond.

This is not just about the UK, the EU now also needs to make changes and reform. I understand that some other EU countries do not want a UK exit to fuel a growing federal Europe, rather the opposite. Of course Netherlands and Denmark are looking at possible referendums soon. Greece is making its next payment soon and could default.

Its not impossible to see deals where the UK continue to pay into the EU and get to keep substantial trade deals in exchange. We should keep free movement of people, if we can find a way to invest in infrastructure to support net immigration. I know the EU leaders are saying they will close ranks and wont allow any agreements but they also have a lot to lose as well.

We need now to look to the future with opportunity not failure.

So this thread is now 77 pages and 1142 posts, its still way behind Steve's workshop build.......Woodwork: more important than the EU

 

[doctor Bob]

Pheeeww, been a really busy day at work, much happened today?

 

[Noel]

I'm not going to lock it until Noel has finished his thoughts (or he might ban me!). On the plus side, I'm about to go over the cricket ground with the some friends from America and watch my son play.....I will very likely drink a large quantity of beer and for the moment at least forget all about domestic politics

You're going to explain cricket to Americans?

Enjoy the beer.

 

[Bm101]

I've steered clear so far. I voted to stay but I understand the frustrations that led to the exit result. I think maybe it was those frustrations and feelings of powerlessness that led to the result. Not just with the EU as such but with politicians, financiers and so on. Anger and fear. Already we're seeing far right parties across Europe calling for exit votes.
Personally I hope we come together and uphold the tolerance and other virtues we commonly see touted as British for right or wrong. And for those that sneer at that try living in many other countries in the world if your tired of life here. We have many faults as a nation but when you were born here you won the lottery compared to many people in the world.
Here's a little scenario. Cameron's gone. Corbyn's labour are voting no confidence possibly. General election comes. Only plausible Tory candidates , May or Boris. Only one winner there. Labour in turmoil. In the meantime over in the US. Trump smashes the polls on diet of fear and xenophobia. Sweden and others begin to peel away from the EU. Financial turmoil. Greece and Spain defaulting. The Euro fails despite the best efforts of the Germans. Meanwhile in Russia, a former Kgb agent rubs his hands in glee and masses his toops on the borders for 'defence'. Meanwhile China annexes vast parts of the South China Sea while the US does its best to intervene and protect its interests... sorry, Thailand's interests.

Enjoy the beers like its 1939 Bob .

 

[Wuffles]

I've steered clear so far. I voted to stay but I understand the frustrations that led to the exit result. I think maybe it was those frustrations and feelings of powerlessness that led to the result. Not just with the EU as such but with politicians, financiers and so on. Anger and fear. Already we're seeing far right parties across Europe calling for exit votes.
Personally I hope we come together and uphold the tolerance and other virtues we commonly see touted as British for right or wrong. And for those that sneer at that try living in many other countries in the world if your tired of life here. We have many faults as a nation but when you were born here you won the lottery compared to many people in the world.
Here's a little scenario. Cameron's gone. Corbyn's labour are voting no confidence possibly. General election comes. Only plausible Tory candidates , May or Boris. Only one winner there. Labour in turmoil. In the meantime over in the US. Trump smashes the polls on diet of fear and xenophobia. Sweden and others begin to peel away from the EU. Financial turmoil. Greece and Spain defaulting. The Euro fails despite the best efforts of the Germans. Meanwhile in Russia, a former Kgb agent rubs his hands in glee and masses his toops on the borders for 'defence'. Meanwhile China annexes vast parts of the South China Sea while the US does its best to intervene and protect its interests... sorry, Thailand's interests.

Enjoy the beers like its 1939 Bob .

You remind me of this guy right here BM, so much

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0P3-oXXgQE

Have a good weekend all. Yes I said all.

 

[Bm101]

Lol. No idea what you mean. :wink:

 

[Terry - Somerset]

The law of unintended consequences - don't expect the outcome you think you voted for.

Pointless to speculate on the consequences or outcomes right now - Cameron resignation, Scottish independence, Corbyn unseated - are just the first of many and we are only 12 hours in. Waiting in the wings - other EU defectors, trade deals, growth/recession, Calais camps, exchange rates, pension funds etc etc.

I do not believe the winners will get all they wished for - prosperity, pay rises, quality NHS and schools, jobs etc - possibly some, probably none bar the knowledge that at least they have won sovereignty/control (NATO, WTO etc excepted). Personally I will miss more Polish delis, Latvian restaurants, Romanian painter/decorators, Italian hairdressers etc etc.

The ride will be fun/interesting - so long as it has not personal unpleasant consequences

Terry

 

[Glynne]

Really good post Terry.
I can't think we could repatriate those Europeans already legally here even if we wanted to - so your Polish / Latvians etc should still be around.
Its quite amazing the things that might be impacted by the decision and perhaps this thread might continue in that vein now that the referendum results are in.
For example, I live in North Birmingham and drove the huge distance (7miles) to Tamworth today. In doing so, I crossed the route of the proposed HS2 and suddenly thought whether there was any EU money in the equation? Hopefully yes and that will be withdrawn as I'm not a fan of the idea but that is separate debate.
After 40 years in the EU there must be a huge number of impacts that will only start to come out of the woodwork (pun intended) and it would be interesting to start to identify and understand some of the ones that didn't feature in the campaigns.

 

[Benchwayze]

They should care about what happened in History, although that is one of the failings of the young these days; probably because they were never taught enough of it. And that includes some of our politicians. .A bit more awareness and they might understand that some of us 'grumpy old gits' also felt betrayed in the 1970s. They might also one day realise the price they would have paid for continuing freedom of movement; the inability to get rid of people who made decisions they didn't like; and there would have been plenty of those.

The youngsters needn't worry. I have already heard Ed Balls say openly on Nick Robinson's program, just this evening, that there might well be the chance of some kind of special concession on open borders, to lure us back.

The ballot boxes have hardly been put away, and already we get the first murmurings that a Socialist government would be prepared sell us down the river again, once they get back into power; as one day I am sure they will.

 

[dexter]

Here's a thought, the Tory party's hundred thousand or so members elect the new PM. Not wanting to make the same mistake as Gordon Brown the new PM calls a general election. The Labour Party is dead in the water, the Tory party is still universally hated, in steps Mr Farage still riding high in the opinions of millions on the back of Bretex, UKIP sweeps the board and takes power!
I'll bet that scenario has crossed the mind of Mr F.

 

[dynax]

on a positive side we won't be embarressed anymore at the eurovision, and a bit less football clogging up the tv channels :lol:

 

[undergroundhunter]

I'm 27 and voted to leave as did 90% of the people I have spoken to most under the age of 50, just to give some balance. I voted to leave because I want change.

Here's a thought, the Tory party's hundred thousand or so members elect the new PM. Not wanting to make the same mistake as Gordon Brown the new PM calls a general election. The Labour Party is dead in the water, the Tory party is still universally hated, in steps Mr Farage still riding high in the opinions of millions on the back of Bretex, UKIP sweeps the board and takes power!
I'll bet that scenario has crossed the mind of Mr F.

Even though I voted to leave I will never vote for Mr F. I do think some people voted leave just to get rid of Cameron, if that was their reason then in my opinion it was the wrong choice. I think by standing down all he has done is affirm his weakness and unwillingness to do what he has urged us to do and stick together.

Britain will come through this and hopefully better than before.

 

[RobinBHM]

Here's a thought, the Tory party's hundred thousand or so members elect the new PM. Not wanting to make the same mistake as Gordon Brown the new PM calls a general election. The Labour Party is dead in the water, the Tory party is still universally hated, in steps Mr Farage still riding high in the opinions of millions on the back of Bretex, UKIP sweeps the board and takes power!
I'll bet that scenario has crossed the mind of Mr F.

Mr Farage is unlikely to be interested in a further political career, although if he was, we might see the price of beer falling ccasion5:

Time for a lib dem government........

 

[t8hants]

The pundits say that it was the old Labour vote that swung it, to punish Cameron, so if Cameron had campaigned to leave, would the disaffected traditional labour voters have gone for remain to give C the kicking they think he deserved?

Going off in a huff, only demonstrated he was the spoilt rich brat we thought he was.

 

[Jacob]

I lifted this from FB:
"Biggest joke of the referendum was Farage appealing to the common man, referring to others as an elite and "the political class". Always a beneficiary of the ruling class elite himself, perhaps i can suggest he now does the following;
1). Resigns as MEP Immediately, thus ending the hypocrisy of taking money for his and his wife's (sorry his EU secretary's) personal gain from an organisation he disagrees with and takes no interest in ( note his appaling attendance record).
Or perhaps continues to claim then donates this money to the treasury to reduce beer tax so we can all swig our beer with a big silly grin not just him.
2. In the spirit of "returning to our country what belongs to us". He can repay the tax he has avoided with his offshore tax havens over the years to the treasury ring-fenced for Britains NHS he claims to value and support.
3). That he can now humbly apologise for the racist poster that was quickly followed by the racist murder Of Jo Cox MP and the role this is likely to have played, however large or small, in exploiting peoples fears to the degree that one long term supporter of fascist groups felt the need to murder.
Don't hold your breath.
Since I wrote the above i've heard about Farage's comments about the referendum being won "without a shot being fired" . Appalling man."

 

[dynax]

if things do go belly up, and the pound becomes worthless, we have the barter system to fall back on, better get me some chickens and a couple of sheep just in case

 

[finneyb]

For example, I live in North Birmingham and drove the huge distance (7miles) to Tamworth today. In doing so, I crossed the route of the proposed HS2 and suddenly thought whether there was any EU money in the equation? Hopefully yes and that will be withdrawn as I'm not a fan of the idea but that is separate debate.
.

HS1 was EU policy to have a high speed rail link to the extremities of the EU. I assume HS2 to be same policy - it could be cancelled on that basis.

Brian

 

[Jacob]

if things do go belly up, and the pound becomes worthless, we have the barter system to fall back on, better get me some chickens and a couple of sheep just in case

What you really need is a little crop of potatoes hidden away somewhere - plus a dryish cave to store them in. That's what kept many European peasants alive when various forms of sh|t hit the fans.