THE FOURTH OF JULY

[Fergie 307]

I think Labour should continue it, for at least one more flight.

 

[RobinBHM]

The truth is that the Rwanda project was starting to see results with people smugglers moving their operations to southern Ireland according to the immigration chiefs. Perhaps you should find out more before offering your opinions as facts.

That only relates to people already in the UK

For the Rwanda scheme to be proven as a deterrent it would have to stop smugglers selling passage from France across the channel

 

[RobinBHM]

we can produce sufficient food rather than depend upon imports

Brexit did the opposite…it damaged U.K. farming

And we need immigrants for U.K. farming industry

 

[selectortone]

Thames Water spent years paying millions in dividends to shareholders, even whilst in apparent financial trouble. That's all you really need to know about their situation.

I used to work in industrial control systems and did a lot of business with Thames Water back in the 80s and 90s. Before it was privatised it was full of people, from top to bottom, with pride in their work and a sense of duty in providing clean water and efficient sewage treatment to their customers. Back then the Thames was becoming clean again - they even had trout and many other species of fish recolonising the river.

Now the river is full of sh*t and the company is full of demoralised people who see insufficient investment in maintenance and new works, a board kowtowing to shareholders and all the profit that would have gone into maintenance and new plant pre-privatisation siphoned off to those shareholders, many of which are overseas.

They privatised OUR WATER for godssakes.

 

[Terry - Somerset]

Almost all "second homes" would make very acceptable first homes for people who need somewhere to live - I would suggest that people who own more than one property should be compelled to rent those properties long-term. It would free up many, many thousands of homes. Of course, if they don't want to do that, that could always sell...

Great idea - only slight problem is that second homes are where people want to go to holiday and relax - live the rural or seaside dream!. Areas are employment and infrastructure (healthcare, education, transport links etc) deserts.

Map

One could of course build an infrastructure to support the second homes then mandated for urban overspill. They would start to look like everywhere else and many would not want to have them as a second homes anyway.

The "tourist" ££ currently being spent in the UK may be used to fund R&R in France, Spain, Ireland etc to the further detriment of desirable areas where jobs for the young are limited.

 

[Delaney]

Far right fanatics offer fantasy solutions which don't work. Brexit? Rwanda? The blame game; immigrants, single mothers on benefits, etc........
Somebody has to make sensible decisions.
And to look after the poor far-right nutters too - they only tend to make things worse, for other people and for themselves.
Stumbling around like sleepwalkers, no wonder they think of themselves as "the unwoke".

That’s an astonishing amount of deflection!
I’d rather do without this sort of left wing nihilism.
You claim to care about things but it is in fact an absence of caring.
Why should children grow up without a father? Don’t care.
Why should we import men from cultures were women are second class citizens, literally - don’t care
Why should we keep increasing the deficit and robbing our children's future - don’t care.
Why shouldn’t we wish for a safe and high trust society - don’t care.

 

[Delaney]

You think an ex-director of public prosecutions would undermine the judiciary ? that's just silly.
Prisoners have always been able to be released before the end of term on parole or licence. Changing when that becomes possible is just a sensible way of trying to deal with the crisis of over crowding.
Worth considering that it was tory cuts to the legal system and lack of investment in the prison service that have caused this crisis. Of course there's also the fact the tories acted illegally proroguing parliament, so they aren't in any position to lecture of the adherence of law.

“You think an ex-director of public prosecutions would undermine the judiciary”?

“Changing when that becomes possible is just a sensible way of trying to deal with the crisis of over crowding”.

“Worth considering that it was tory cuts to the legal system and lack of investment in the prison service that have caused this crisis”

The cognitive dissonance here is impressive.

 

[Cobbs]

Great idea - only slight problem is that second homes are where people want to go to holiday and relax - live the rural or seaside dream!. Areas are employment and infrastructure (healthcare, education, transport links etc) deserts.

Map

One could of course build an infrastructure to support the second homes then mandated for urban overspill. They would start to look like everywhere else and many would not want to have them as a second homes anyway.

The "tourist" ££ currently being spent in the UK may be used to fund R&R in France, Spain, Ireland etc to the further detriment of desirable areas where jobs for the young are limited.

If people who own second homes rent them out, they get an income from those homes, instead of paying out for them on an ongoing basis. If they want to go on holiday, they can use that income to pay for a hotel, still employing people in those tourist areas, but with the benefit of those employees having somewhere decent to live at an affordable rent without covering the area in naff, built down to a price and bland houses.
Wins all round.

 

[John Brown]

I used to work in industrial control systems and did a lot of business with Thames Water back in the 80s and 90s. Before it was privatised it was full of people, from top to bottom, with pride in their work and a sense of duty in providing clean water and efficient sewage treatment to their customers. Back then the Thames was becoming clean again - they even had trout and many other species of fish recolonising the river.

Now the river is full of sh*t and the company is full of demoralised people who see insufficient investment in maintenance and new works, a board kowtowing to shareholders and all the profit that would have gone into maintenance and new plant pre-privatisation siphoned off to those shareholders, many of which are overseas.

They privatised OUR WATER for godssakes.

A couple of friends of mine caught a trout/salmon in the Thames near Hampton, decades ago. I vaguely remember that there was some sort of award, but they'd eaten the proof. It was a long time ago, 40 years or so.

 

[John Brown]

Lots of extra houses need electricity and other services that are already struggling so more sewage into the enviroment and strain on local services. Thames water is £15 billion in debt and others in similar situations as they use a lot of energy which has gone sky high in cost and that is before they find the money for investment. Then of course the added congestion, how much more traffic can our towns and cities handle, it is already bad and getting worse.

The fist stage in this process should be a change in building regs before the planing aspect to ensure new houses are built to high thermal efficiency even if it means fewer houses on a given area so they use less energy and maybe look at a centralised heating system for the estate rather than individual gas boilers.

There is a lot of land but much is farming and agriculture which requires vast areas and we need to ensure we can produce sufficient food rather than depend upon imports.

Where I live there are vast fields that are entirely unproductive. A few years back they were grazed by sheep, but I guess there's no money in that anymore. Try to put a few solar panels or a wind turbine up and the NIMBYs are up in arms.

 

[John Brown]

Because the north will always be treated as the poor relation to the SE.

If we had the investment the SE got then the social and medical issues those in the north face would be much reduced.

Bradford for instance doesn't have a functioning ring road nor a decent through A road, linking the m606 to the a650.

Nor a through station.
It's city centre is a dump compared to any southern city.

Same goes for any other north city beginning with B...

They've only changed the words. I'm sure the policy/investment (or lack of it) will continue to be as ineffectual as it was under the Tories, one of whom openly stated that he would divert funds to Tonbridge Wells or somewhere...

 

[sploo]

That’s an astonishing amount of deflection!
I’d rather do without this sort of left wing nihilism.
You claim to care about things but it is in fact an absence of caring.
Why should children grow up without a father? Don’t care.
Why should we import men from cultures were women are second class citizens, literally - don’t care
Why should we keep increasing the deficit and robbing our children's future - don’t care.
Why shouldn’t we wish for a safe and high trust society - don’t care.

I don't actually think Jacob was "for" any of those things. The point being made was about getting votes by telling people their problems are the fault of "others" (whoever those "others" may be) and presenting yourself as the solution to all ills.

Not wanting vulnerable people to drown is not the same as being in favour of "importing" people who consider women as second class.

Not wanting single mothers to be poorly treated is not the same as favouring families with absent fathers.

As for wishing for a "safe and high trust society"; one of the main tactics of populists is fear. Stoke fear and distrust of "others" in your population in order to gain power.

 

[RobinBHM]

The cognitive dissonance here is impressive

You have not provided any counter argument.

Do you have one?

 

[Yojevol]

The truth is that the Rwanda project was starting to see results with people smugglers moving their operations to southern Ireland according to the immigration chiefs. Perhaps you should find out more before offering your opinions as facts.

@Jacob did not offer his comment as a fact, it was just his opinion

 

[paulrbarnard]

Brexit did the opposite…it damaged U.K. farming

And we need immigrants for U.K. farming industry

Completely disagree with this. We we actually need is super markets to pay farmer fairly so they can pay workers fairly without having to rely on migrant workers from lower wage regions. Oh and we, who are at the top of this chain and driving it, need to stop buying based on price…

 

[Rhossydd]

If you believe these are all just far right stories to cause concern then we don't have a problem but with such a large number over a reasonable time span then probability would say that we do have a growing crisis.

The RW press will always jump on any bad story about immigrants. What you need to find out is if immigrants/asylum seekers have a higher rate of offending than the rest the population.

 

[Rhossydd]

We we actually need is super markets to pay farmer fairly so they can pay workers fairly without having to rely on migrant workers from lower wage regions.

I'd agree about supermarkets generally not paying enough. However it's difficult to see how we could ever pay people in the UK enough to persuade them to take up the lifestyle that seasonable pickers endure.

 

[Jacob]

........
If you believe these are all just far right stories to cause concern then we don't have a problem but with such a large number over a reasonable time span then probability would say that we do have a growing crisis.

Surely that is a small number - and selectively reported?
For it to have any significance you'd need first to look at the details and then to compare it with figures from the non immigrant community too. You really should, as you are obviously keen to prove to yourself that immigrants are an evil bunch.

 

[Spectric]

Not bad for a new PM's first week in office, a loss of 270 million by scrapping Rwanda and with no new plan in place apart from recruiting a new border security chief has just sent a clear message across the channel that the new UK government welcomes all immigrants with open arms so maybe they now need to lay on ferries so that they can avoid taking the responsability of them drowning during the crossing in small boats. There was a report where some of these migrants in northern France have said that now Labour has won the election it will make it easier for them to come to Britain and settle here.

We we actually need is super markets to pay farmer fairly so they can pay workers fairly without having to rely on migrant workers from lower wage regions. Oh and we, who are at the top of this chain and driving it, need to stop buying based on price…

Farmers should set a fair price for there produce, you don't go to a car dealership and tell them what you are going to pay for your new car as they have set the price. Yes it would mean supermarkets would both charge more and make less profit but we need fairness in the system and to pay the going rate for our groceries.

 

[Jacob]

Completely disagree with this. We we actually need is super markets to pay farmer fairly so they can pay workers fairly without having to rely on migrant workers from lower wage regions.

We'd still need the migrant workers but have to pay them fair wages. Seems a good idea.