THE FOURTH OF JULY

[RobinBHM]

You're juvenile!

 

[Jacob]

You're juvenile!

Merely Juvenal!
Our man also said "....that no guilty man is acquitted if judged by himself".
Does this mean that people talking bolox always know they are wrong however much they deny it? Not in this forum IMHO!

 

[Delaney]

You have not provided any counter argument.

Do you have one?

The counter argument was provided in the comment.

 

[Delaney]

We'd still need the migrant workers but have to pay them fair wages. Seems a good idea.

Migrant workers return home to make better lives in their country, thus raising the standard for their people and country.
Mass immigration with no intention of return does no such thing.
It lowers wages for native people and it’s anti efficiency, (which ultimately brings down prices and frees up labour to do more import at work).

Like building all the houses you’ll need.

 

[Jacob]

Migrant workers return home to make better lives in their country, thus raising the standard for their people and country.
Mass immigration with no intention of return does no such thing.
It lowers wages for native people,

If true it's the employers not the workers who lower the wages. We need better regulation on wages and conditions of work, for a level playing field
Immigration in general boosts economies.
It's obvious really - they tend to go where the work is and if allowed to, then set about doing it.
It's a simple fact of history and economics.

 

[John Brown]

"Your post in the thread THE FOURTH OF JULY was moved to THE FOURTH OF JULY.Reason: We have to moderate each other. Thanks."
Today at 14:25

Best not misquote Roman satirists again...

 

[RobinBHM]

The counter argument was provided in the comment.

please could you be specific as I cant find any counter argument, (using the words "cognitive dissonance" is not a counter argument.)

here is your original comment:

“You think an ex-director of public prosecutions would undermine the judiciary”?

“Changing when that becomes possible is just a sensible way of trying to deal with the crisis of over crowding”.

“Worth considering that it was tory cuts to the legal system and lack of investment in the prison service that have caused this crisis”

The cognitive dissonance here is impressive.

 

[Jake]

Well that just shows how unwoke they really are!

And how herd-following they are. Massively confected RW moral panic stampede.

 

[selectortone]

Merel Juvenal!
Our man also said "....that no guilty man is acquitted if judged by himself".
Does this mean that people talking bolox always know they are wrong however much they deny it? Not in this forum IMHO!

Physician heal thy self.

 

[RobinBHM]

Mass immigration with no intention of return does no such thing.

UK has never had mass immigration

but those that come here to stay, contribute to the economy

It lowers wages for native people

evidence show this is not correct

"In 2018, the Migration Advisory Committee reviewed the results of studies conducted between 2003 and 2018 and drew three conclusions. First, immigration had little or no impact on average employment or unemployment of existing workers. Second, where an impact was found, it was usually concentrated among certain groups – i.e. a negative effect for those with lower education and a positive effect for those with higher levels of education. And third, the impact may depend on the economic cycle; some—though not all—studies have found adverse effects on employment or unemployment, specifically during downturns.

Similarly, the MAC review concluded that immigration had had little impact on average wages, according to previous research. Some studies had found a small negative impact on average wages, while others found positive average effects."

https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/the-labour-market-effects-of-immigration/

Like building all the houses you’ll need

the housing crisis and crisis with public services is a result of decades of political failure, it is not the fault of migrants

given that the UK has had low unemployment over the last 25 years when immigration has been relatively high, would indicate we have needed foreign workers to fuel our economy

 

[Blackswanwood]

Actually I've had several messages from forum members such as you describe, being very pleased to read so much in their support, coming from so many.
Maybe it's all better out than in?
Keep up the good work chaps!
PS One was an NHS doctor, another an ICU nurse. Others too.
Oddly enough I visited the doctor yesterday and had a trainee doc practicing on me, under supervision. She was a black girl from Nigeria (I think) and doing an excellent job.

I’m a bit confused by this Jacob. We’re you meaning to address your comments to Spectric who had made the original post?

 

[Jake]

We are either going to need working age immigration or else older people to work later and die sooner.

 

[Chris152]

And how herd-following they are. Massively confected RW moral panic stampede.

Braverman yesterday, in an utterly odious presentation to the 'Popular Conservative group,' spoke of the 'lunatic woke virus working its way through the British state'. She's truly warped that one, I don't know why she doesn't just join reform rather than trying to further corrupt the tory party.

 

[Jacob]

I’m a bit confused by this Jacob. We’re you meaning to address your comments to Spectric who had made the original post?

Sorry no I was just commenting on your comment about "potential forum members". Yes directed at Spectric one step removed!

 

[Jacob]

Braverman yesterday, in an utterly odious presentation to the 'Popular Conservative group,' spoke of the 'lunatic woke virus working its way through the British state'. She's truly warped that one, I don't know why she doesn't just join reform rather than trying to further corrupt the tory party.

Good to know she's upset about the "lunatic woke virus". Keep it up chaps!
It's probably a good thing that the unwoke come out of the closet and self identify, rather than permeating and tainting the whole body politic.

 

[Delaney]

UK has never had mass immigration

but those that come here to stay, contribute to the economy


evidence show this is not correct

"In 2018, the Migration Advisory Committee reviewed the results of studies conducted between 2003 and 2018 and drew three conclusions. First, immigration had little or no impact on average employment or unemployment of existing workers. Second, where an impact was found, it was usually concentrated among certain groups – i.e. a negative effect for those with lower education and a positive effect for those with higher levels of education. And third, the impact may depend on the economic cycle; some—though not all—studies have found adverse effects on employment or unemployment, specifically during downturns.

Similarly, the MAC review concluded that immigration had had little impact on average wages, according to previous research. Some studies had found a small negative impact on average wages, while others found positive average effects."

https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/the-labour-market-effects-of-immigration/


the housing crisis and crisis with public services is a result of decades of political failure, it is not the fault of migrants

given that the UK has had low unemployment over the last 25 years when immigration has been relatively high, would indicate we have needed foreign workers to fuel our economy

I’m glad you managed to find figures that fall neatly inline with your with your belief system.

Allow me to show you some opposing figures.
And by a corporation that is actually pro immigration.

Between 1999 and 2012, immigration from outside the EU was a net drain to the country of £125billion. That’s at a time when we hadn’t even heard of a billion.
That was also when it was running at 10’s of k’s per year. Not the 700k+ we see now.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-25880373

Your left wing virtue trolling, is certainly interesting but nobody survives in s system where there is so much chaos, people don’t even know where they are.
That is the world you want to create and normal people just aren’t going to put up with it, regardless if your cries about ‘muh economy’.

 

[Jacob]

I’m glad you managed to find figures that fall neatly inline with your with your belief system.

Allow me to show you some opposing figures.
And by a corporation that is actually pro immigration.

Between 1999 and 2012, immigration from outside the EU was a net drain to the country of £125billion. That’s at a time when we hadn’t even heard of a billion.
That was also when it was running at 10’s of k’s per year. Not the 700k+ we see now.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-25880373

Your left wing virtue trolling, is certainly interesting but nobody survives in s system where there is so much chaos, people don’t even know where they are.
That is the world you want to create and normal people just aren’t going to put up with it, regardless if your cries about ‘muh economy’.

You obviously haven't read it through- you must try harder!
Immigration in itself is neither a good thing nor a bad thing - it's just a fact of life. Generally works out well because it's about people seeking to make a better life for themselves. Some end up in refugee camps of course, but at least they are still alive.
BTW With that Irish surname you probably descend from immigrants yourself. Most of us do, one way or another. Have you ever thought of returning to your homeland?

 

[Chris152]

Your left wing virtue trolling...

Funny how 'virtue' has become a dirty word - my guess is it's happened at the mouths of those who have none.

 

[Delaney]

r

 

[Spectric]

You're blaming Starmer for the failed Rwanda scheme

No but scrapping the only potential deterent before having something to replace it is a really stupid move because anything has to be better than nothing.

Spectric has gone all Jacob on us.

No but it would be nice to have the skill to sharpen a chiesel !!!!