tenon or dovetail saw

[Jacob]

...
Nothing wrong with that approach Jacob but, in that case, perhaps you should give a health warning with all your 'pearls of wisdom'? ......

No need - they are queuing round the block to do it! :lol:

PS sorry you haven't shot out and bought one have you? Just send it back!

 

[Modernist]

Can't say I'm inspired by the proportions of some of the DT in the above gallery. Many of them look a bit steep to me and not too easy on the eye.

Each to their own I suppose and they look as if they enjoyed themselves.

It may just be innate cynicism or a language thing but I find the whole "heirloom" tool concept and Cosmanism thing a bit hard to swallow. After all, through dovetails are not particularly difficult to do after reading a book and a bit of practice. It seems to be more about tool marketing and zippo demo's than cabinetmaking. The cash call for the unfortunate DC didn't help dispel that image but no doubt hoardes will brand me a non-believer, even though I'm very keen on quality effective tools myself.

Hey Brian, Tom Lie-Nielsen, Ron Hock, Frank Beyers, Highland Hardware, Woodcraft Supply and others all stepped in to help DC who at the time was near death in hospital. I spoke to several of these folks before we went public to get help for someone that has given to the woodworking community for years. I find your mean spirited use of the term "cash call" highly offensive and I dont know why it has not been removed. I hope others on this forum will speak thier mind and put you in your place. Dont even expect a lump of coal.
Rob Cosman

Tom Lie-Nielsen, Ron Hock, Frank Beyers, Highland Hardware, Woodcraft Supply

All trade I notice

I find your mean spirited use of the term "cash call" highly offensive and I dont know why it has not been removed

What would you call it? I was not alone in finding it unacceptable and IIRC it was your post that was actually removed at the time.

I know my place thank you and it is interesting to note that you attack me in order to defend your position. For my part I noted my concern for DC's recovery from the outset, own and read all his books and feel justified in airing my view on a clearly controversial subject on a woodwork forum designed for the purpose. IN fact I suspect it is an issue of national style and custom which may explain the problem.

People try and help someone who has given an incredible amount to the woodworking community, and it gets thrown back in their face? I only hope that if I were in DC's position my friends would do so much...

I truly pray you never end up in the same spot as David and have to require the help of a community to get you through it.

ditto the above

 

[bobbybirds]

......................
People try and help someone who has given an incredible amount to the woodworking community, and it gets thrown back in their face? I only hope that if I were in DC's position my friends would do so much...

I truly pray you never end up in the same spot as David and have to require the help of a community to get you through it.

But there are always others on this forum going through the same or worse. There is no precedent for a whip round; it did seem very odd, especially being asked to buy DVDs. Not that we don't sympathise with DC and his illness.
Maybe it should be a regular item? Whip round of the week, for struggling forum members, or other good causes?

In my experience it seems that "charitable" donations seem to come easier when people are getting something for their money over and above the good feeling you get by helping someone in need. Kind of a sad commentary but reality is what it is. I think maybe that is because people are always being asked to give to one thing or another, so the offer of receiving something tangible helping draws a few more people to the table.

 

[Jacob]

.

In my experience it seems that "charitable" donations seem to come easier when people are getting something for their money over and above the good feeling you get by helping someone in need. Kind of a sad commentary but reality is what it is. I think maybe that is because people are always being asked to give to one thing or another, so the offer of receiving something tangible helping draws a few more people to the table.

Well it's a point of view but I don't particularly share it. I occasionally (rarely - I'm not especially charitable!) slip a handful of change to Big Issue seller but I tell him to keep the mag, I don't want it.

 

[Jacob]

...



Hey Brian, Tom Lie-Nielsen, Ron Hock, Frank Beyers, Highland Hardware, Woodcraft Supply and others all stepped in to help DC who at the time was near death in hospital. ....

All trade - nothing wrong with that but they do get a bit self righteous. "Giving" to the woodworking community? "Selling" is the operative word.
Personally I get quite peed off with the relentless pressure to buy posh tools and the monotonous accompaniment of denigration of everything else - I think it's 99% borlocks. Note - not 100%. :lol:

PS and if anybody is reading this who also is thinking of buying a chisel set - these are a bargain!. NB I have no financial interest in this no freebies come my way! I got one once - a tin of Honerite no1. It didn't prejudice me in any way - I advised not to buy it as it is much the same as WD 40 but 40(?) times the price.

 

[bobbybirds]

...




Personally I get quite peed off with the relentless pressure to buy posh tools and the monotonous accompaniment of denigration of everything else - I think it's 99% borlocks. Note - not 100%. :lol:

PS and if anybody is reading this who also is thinking of buying a chisel set - these are a bargain!. NB I have no financial interest in this no freebies come my way! I got one once - a tin of Honerite no1. It didn't prejudice me in any way - I advised not to buy it as it is much the same as WD 40 but 40(?) times the price.

Pot - Kettle - Black

Relentless pressure attempting to make people feel dumb because they can justify buying premium quality products is any better?

This reminds me of the fellow in the 20 year old VW calling down the guy with a new Porsche because they are wasting their money since both cars get from point A to point B...

 

[Jacob]

.......
This reminds me of the fellow in the 20 year old VW calling down the guy with a new Porsche because they are wasting their money since both cars get from point A to point B...

They are thinking of different things. For most people getting from A to B is the only consideration (plus cost, comfort, safety, convenience, reliability etc). A big 10 year old VW would win hands down! 20 years is pushing it (probably literally).

 

[bobbybirds]

.......
This reminds me of the fellow in the 20 year old VW calling down the guy with a new Porsche because they are wasting their money since both cars get from point A to point B...

They are thinking of different things. For most people getting from A to B is the only consideration (plus cost, comfort, safety, convenience, reliability etc). A big 10 year old VW would win hands down! 20 years is pushing it (probably literally).

So other than performance in a tool, there are no other considerations? When I buy a tool I consider other things... Maybe I should be ashamed, but fit, feel, finish, possible future resale, etc all come into play for me, and if the price is affordable within my monetary abilities, or anybody else for that matter, why should you feel the need to point out how ridiculous their idea of a good purchase is?

Out of all these premium tool makers you seem to think are taking advantage of the public, I have conversed with many of them prior to making any of my purchases, and not a single one ever told me that their tools are the best and only way to go. Most of them actually made suggestions about how accomplish the things I wanted to do and save money by considering using other manufacturers certain items or even used items along with a specific tool of their own, which was in essence taking money out of their own pockets as I was intending on buying much more than I left with. I for one am happy to see the return of the specialist who cares about their products over the mass market producers of mediocre at best can openers...

I feel sorry for you that you are so jaded on the small scale business guy and manufacturer that you think they are all only out to get you, and you end up subscribing to the giant corporations mentality of build it fast and cheap and sell crap to millions rather than quality to thousands, all while sending your money to countries that do not value humans as people but instead as commodities...

 

[Jacob]

No you have completely missed the point. You've got the tooly bug and are talking the talk. I am much interested in woodwork and the things made (not sure why).
Some people look at cars and think travel, the road, far away places. Others think spanners.
Or something along those lines if you see what I mean :shock: .

why should you feel the need to point out how ridiculous their idea of a good purchase is

By "good" I take it you mean expensive.
The answer is balance - everybody is so keen to dismiss ordinary tools, which is a great pity. The £7 saw I posted about above is actually excellent but I'm regarded as a blasphemer. Those Axminster chisels are OK and certainly wouldn't hinder anybody's woodwork efforts. And so on....

 

[bobbybirds]

No you have completely missed the point. You've got the tooly bug and are talking the talk. I am much interested in woodwork and the things made (not sure why).
Some people look at cars and think travel, the road, far away places. Others think spanners.
Or something along those lines if you see what I mean :shock: .

Not missing the point at all... You look at a result more specifically while I take enjoyment in the entire journey getting to that result, and that involves the enjoyment of my tools as well as the actions and finally result of everything combined. We are very much different in our core, and while I respect how you approach how you do things, you apparently do not respects my way and look down on others who feel the same way and seem to think we are somehow not as genuine with our craft...

 

[bobbybirds]

By "good" I take it you mean expensive.
The answer is balance - everybody is so keen to dismiss ordinary tools, which is a great pity. The £7 saw I posted about above is actually excellent but I'm regarded as a blasphemer. Those Axminster chisels are OK and certainly wouldn't hinder anybody's woodwork efforts. And so on....

No not at all... I am not the one constantly bringing up price. That would be yourself.

 

[No skills]

The answer is balance - everybody is so keen to dismiss ordinary tools, which is a great pity. The £7 saw I posted about above is actually excellent but I'm regarded as a blasphemer. Those Axminster chisels are OK and certainly wouldn't hinder anybody's woodwork efforts. And so on....

Jacob, perhaps a change of name for the coming new year - 'Brian' is a good one.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIaORknS1Dk


:wink:

 

[Jacob]

I just wished people had a more balanced view. I get bored stiff with LN this and LV that, and then "rubbish chisels made of cheese" , mirror polished faces, and so on. I don't think it does anybody any favours (except the tool sellers of course).
For someone just wanting to do woodwork it's a big distraction. and could put them off for life - especially the astonishing sharpening techniques now taken for granted.
If I ran a beginners woodwork course I think I'd kit them all out with very ordinary stuff and have that as the first challenge!

 

[Jacob]

The answer is balance - everybody is so keen to dismiss ordinary tools, which is a great pity. The £7 saw I posted about above is actually excellent but I'm regarded as a blasphemer. Those Axminster chisels are OK and certainly wouldn't hinder anybody's woodwork efforts. And so on....

Jacob, perhaps a change of name for the coming new year - 'Brian' is a good one.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIaORknS1Dk


:wink:

:lol: :lol:

 

[Modernist]

The answer is balance - everybody is so keen to dismiss ordinary tools, which is a great pity. The £7 saw I posted about above is actually excellent but I'm regarded as a blasphemer. Those Axminster chisels are OK and certainly wouldn't hinder anybody's woodwork efforts. And so on....

Jacob, perhaps a change of name for the coming new year - 'Brian' is a good one.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIaORknS1Dk


:wink:

ey watchit you :evil:

 

[No skills]

Ah dang! :lol:

 

[Racers]

Jacob

No one forces you to read the threads, so why not just stick to woodworking and leave up in peace to polish our chisels.
We don't need or want to be saved, and it would probbably lower your blood presure.

Happy Christmas.

Pete

 

[Karl]

What would you call it? I was not alone in finding it unacceptable and IIRC it was your post that was actually removed at the time.

I found it somewhat distasteful too Brian. It was interesting that the mods agreed with me and removed the original post, though subsequent ones remained.

Nothing against DC, or RC for that matter.

Cheers

Karl

 

[Modernist]

A timely illustration of what is wrong in woodworking is this item, coincidentally posted on the current FW web edition

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/433 ... ng-eletter

There is nothing wrong with marketing events to sell tools but it rather demeans the craft of fine cabinetmaking. As Jacob regularly and correctly points out some new arrivals take this stuff as gospel - at their cost.

 

[Jacob]

Jacob

No one forces you to read the threads, so why not just stick to woodworking and leave up in peace to polish our chisels.

We would do, except you all behave as though you have discovered the one true way - believe me you most definitely haven't!