Speed Limit

[MikeJhn]

Wrap them in cotton wool and heaven forbid let them out in the garden to eat worms.

 

[llywmog]

It doesn't need to be banned outright. IMO cars need a limiter set at say 80mph that needs to be manually turned off by the driver if they wish to exceed that. If you want to turn it off when you drive to Germany fine, but then it is entirely on you if you decide to turn it off so you can drive at 90mph on UK motorways. If you have an accident that speed is a factor and you have turned it off then penalties should be even higher. That is then your personal choice and responsibility.

Even Germany has speed limits on 30% of the autobahn and additional variable limits on more. How many times do UK drivers actually drive to Germany though? I would guess very infrequently.

"
A new European Union Mandate is set to come into force from Sunday July 7th 2024, which means that all new vehicles sold will require a speed limiter.
Although this law will not apply in Britian, it is very likely that most new cars will be affected by the introduction of the technology. This is because the manufacturers are unlikely to modify new vehicle designs for the market here in Britain."

and, because we often read comments that it is 'sometimes necessary to go above the speed limit', speed limiters do allow you to do that:

"But a driver can still press hard on the accelerator to override it momentarily, for instance to negotiate a hazard in the road ahead."

https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/news/motoring-news/all-new-cars-sold-in-europe-required-to-be-equipped-with-speed-limiters/#:~:text=A new European Union Mandate,the introduction of the technology.

 

[Scruples]

If 100 bikes were doing 70mph the woman would still be in the wrong.

There used to be regular moans in the Telegraph motoring supplement (which used to be excellent) from people upset at being undertaken on motorways, the answer was always the same - if you were undertaken, you were in the wrong lane.

You guys collectively appear to be big brother. Freedoms are hard come by and once surrendered even harder to recover.

It's not about freedom, mate. It's about collective responsiblilty; something that seems to have faded a bit and now needs a little help from the authorities.

 

[Scruples]

Who’s freedom? I want my grandchildren to live to become adults without someone with small **** syndrome ‘accidentally’ killing them.

Just adding to offset my frustration reply above. I am so weary of the vehicular man slaughter findings in cases where someone in a vehicle kills a vulnerable road user. If ISA is mandatory and over ridden by the driver they are taking full responsibility so should then be charged with murder as they have pre meditated to remove the safety measures designed to protect others. I get frustrated in the extreme with the notion that people should be free to place others at risk.

I suppose it could be argued that although driving illegally, the intention was not to murder anyone. Those types wouldn't see life that deeply.

Manslaughter is the only real option for the courts. Rather than attempting to redefine murder, it would be better to fight for higher prison sentences, since all we really want are more appropriate sentences for causing death by careless driving.

 

[Scruples]

my standard car legally purchased in the UK will top 170mph yes not legal in the uk but I can drive to Germany wear it is so why ban it?

That's nice, but what's the reasoning about driving at those speeds...anywhere other than a race track?

 

[Blackswanwood]

"
A new European Union Mandate is set to come into force from Sunday July 7th 2024, which means that all new vehicles sold will require a speed limiter.
Although this law will not apply in Britian, it is very likely that most new cars will be affected by the introduction of the technology. This is because the manufacturers are unlikely to modify new vehicle designs for the market here in Britain."

and, because we often read comments that it is 'sometimes necessary to go above the speed limit', speed limiters do allow you to do that:

"But a driver can still press hard on the accelerator to override it momentarily, for instance to negotiate a hazard in the road ahead."

https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/news/motoring-news/all-new-cars-sold-in-europe-required-to-be-equipped-with-speed-limiters/#:~:text=A new European Union Mandate,the introduction of the technology.

Prompted by this thread I looked at theavailable settings on our car - it already gives a warning if the speed limit is exceeded - an this setting is already there.

I switched it on and two days later I’ve not noticed any adverse impact from my civil liberties being infringed.

I don’t get why people get so hot under the collar about this - obviously though being a BMW driver if they try and infringe my right to change lane without a signal or park across two parking bays I’ll be marching on parliament …

 

[paulrbarnard]

Prompted by this thread I looked at theavailable settings on our car - it already gives a warning if the speed limit is exceeded - an this setting is already there.

I switched it on and two days later I’ve not noticed any adverse impact from my civil liberties being infringed.

I don’t get why people get so hot under the collar about this - obviously though being a BMW driver if they try and infringe my right to change lane without a signal or park across two parking bays I’ll be marching on parliament …

The only draw back in our car, Volvo, is that it reduces the volume of the radio while it does the warning beep. I find that very frustrating as a passenger and it often leads to ‘discussion’ with my wife if I miss an important bit due to her insatiable need for speed.

 

[Blackswanwood]

The only draw back in our car, Volvo, is that is reduced the volume of the radio while it does the warning beep. I find that very frustrating as a passenger and it often leads to ‘discussion’ with my wife if I miss an important bit due to her insatiable need for speed.

I’d suggest introducing a “Personal Development Plan” so you wife can address this shortcoming.

Do let us know how you get on (once you are back from hospital)

 

[Rhossydd]

I looked at theavailable settings on our car - it already gives a warning if the speed limit is exceeded

I have a 'speed limiter' warning in my car (Mazda), but it's effectively useless as you need to set it yourself for a single speed. Google maps sometimes gives the wrong limit and can be slow to update.

The idea of a speed limiter is good, but how it can be reliably implemented is a nightmare. I'm sure we've all seen overhead signs on motorways that bear no relation to actual conditions, haven't been cancelled or are in the wrong area.

 

[Agent_zed]

Wrap them in cotton wool and heaven forbid let them out in the garden to eat worms.

You guys collectively appear to be big brother. Freedoms are hard come by and once surrendered even harder to recover.

Unless I am mistaken, the only thing anyone on here so far has advocated is to enforce the rules that have been in place for decades. The same laws that you will have been taught when you were taught to drive and got a license and therefore agree to abide to.

There is no freedom to surrender, as you are not free to exceed the UK speed limits on UK public roads.

The laws that were put in place to find a balance between risk of accidents and the ability for the public to move around at will.

We bemoan that the police aren't solving crimes and the government is wasting money. Maybe they would have more time for crimes if they weren't attending RTAs quite so often. We'd spend less money on hospital treatments, emergency services and insurance. I'm sure a significant amount could be saved if people literally just drove within the laws as we currently have them.

 

[Kittyhawk]

Who’s freedom? I want my grandchildren to live to become adults without someone with small **** syndrome ‘accidentally’ killing them.
I get frustrated in the extreme with the notion that people should be free to place others at risk.

Exactly so.
I think every ambo that ever there was has said at some time or other, 'if only these id!ot drivers could do a shift on ambulance - see what we see..'
It is not nice when you get dispatched to a truck vs motorbike and your new first-ever-shift assistant loses it on scene and you have to tell her as gently as you can - I'll see to this chap here, you go and see if you can find his arm..
We are rightly appalled by the deaths on the roads but in view of the many horrific but survivable injuries that will have severe and lifelong consequences for MV accident patients, the dead from such accidents are often the lucky ones in my opinion and based on my experience. I know, it sounds harsh..
Don't speed, drive safe.

 

[Blackswanwood]

I have a 'speed limiter' warning in my car (Mazda), but it's effectively useless as you need to set it yourself for a single speed. Google maps sometimes gives the wrong limit and can be slow to update.

The idea of a speed limiter is good, but how it can be reliably implemented is a nightmare. I'm sure we've all seen overhead signs on motorways that bear no relation to actual conditions, haven't been cancelled or are in the wrong area.

The warning system (which I assume is the same decision maker for the speed limiter) is accurate in my car. It picks up temporary limits and I think is better than just relying on driver concentration even if not perfect.

I do think we’ll look back on these threads in just a few years with fond memories of manually driving cars as the driverless car will have taken over!

 

[Rhossydd]

It picks up temporary limits and I think is better than just relying on driver concentration even if not perfect.

How does it do that ? reliably ?

 

[Blackswanwood]

How does it do that ? reliably ?

I’ve attached screenshots from the user manual. It’s arguably more reliable than driver concentration alone.

 

[Rhossydd]

So that only works if roads signs are clear, always visible, complete and correct.

Opens up the possibility of people putting up their own signs and messing that system up or being stuck at the wrong speed if the camera misses one.

 

[Blackswanwood]

So that only works if roads signs are clear, always visible, complete and correct.

Opens up the possibility of people putting up their own signs and messing that system up or being stuck at the wrong speed if the camera misses one.

Yes, pretty much the same as with a human driver but less prone to lapses in concentration. Not sure what would motivate anyone to start putting up their own road signs.

For the avoidance of doubt I’m not arguing it’s infallible or perfect but my experience has been that it works. If you don’t like it you can switch it off.

 

[Rhossydd]

Not sure what would motivate anyone to start putting up their own road signs.

I've seen that quite a few times, even home made Gatso copies.

Just imagine if that technology was widely adopted and made mandatory, how much fun protestors could have draping 20mph signs on motorway over bridges/gantries.

 

[Agent_zed]

I've seen that quite a few times, even home made Gatso copies.

Just imagine if that technology was widely adopted and made mandatory, how much fun protestors could have draping 20mph signs on motorway over bridges/gantries.

I think this goes back to actually determining what is being implemented/proposed.

A system that alerts the driver that they are going over the speed limit but doesn't do anything more is quite simple and has been working for a decade on the GPS systems. We have a Tomtom satnav that will indicate that I'm over, first with an orange colour if it's a few mph over then changing to red if its significantly over. Seems to work well without too much problem, it doesn't update for things like roadworks or variable speed limits (I think it can if i tethered it) but that is what I am there for as the driver. I see it, like reversing sensors, as an addition not a replacement.

A speed limiter preventing more than 80mph, I can't see this being a problem as it would already be more than 10% over the legal limit. It should affect no-one driving legally.

A speed limiter on all road speeds I think is still too tricky, as mentioned it relies on technology being updated properly and as they can't even currently get motorway signs to update quickly when there is a problem.

 

[Sideways]

I thought my ancient first gen new mini was set to fail the mot the other day. I couldn't get the tyre pressure warning light to go out.
Surprisingly it passed.
The mechanic explained, nothing wrong with your tyres, pressures or brakes. It's just a bad sensor reporting a problem where none exists. Your car predates the year where it's mandatory that these warning systems are required / must work correctly.
More and more clutter in vehicle systems is the norm. It comes at a cost - I scrapped another perfectly safe old car because of a faulty warning system that was just not economic to repair. Waste !
So many modern driving aids are far from foolproof and also distract the driver rather than leaving them to concentrate on the road :-(

 

[Rhossydd]

A system that alerts the driver that they are going over the speed limit but doesn't do anything more is quite simple and has been working for a decade on the GPS systems. We have a Tomtom satnav that will indicate that I'm over, first with an orange colour if it's a few mph over then changing to red if its significantly over. Seems to work well without too much problem, it doesn't update for things like roadworks or variable speed limits (I think it can if i tethered it) but that is what I am there for as the driver.

Static(ie not online) GPS systems need updating and that's sometimes stupidly expensive (£200+ for my Mazda <yeah right>) and aren't always correct anyway or only updated every year or more, so can be significantly out of date.
Even 'live' systems like Google traffic can get it wrong more often than you might hope.