Putin is a loser

[Trainee neophyte]

Upfront admission. I didn't read past your first sentence.

Why?

I have family remaining in Ukraine as well as those who have fled.
I am currently Serving and have a good understanding of "facts" that are not in any way adulterated by "spin"

I have a really good idea of what I'm talking about and it isn't from listening to or reading anything either MSM or Social Media.

Your credentials, please?

I have none. I am nobody, from nowhere. This is the internet, after all. If you have family in the Ukraine then you ought to know all about what actually happened in 2013 and 2014, the reasons why the breakaway republics broke away, the reality as opposed to the fictional western story of the "invasion" of the Crimea. Perhaps you could share your inside knowledge with us. Unless you are actually a member of 77 Brigade or similar, in which case there really is little point.

 

[Trainee neophyte]

He claims to be former UK military but living in Moldova.

I do hope you are refering to someone other than me, because otherwise you are wrong on both counts. Sorry to disappoint.

 

[Fergie 307]

1. Why is this relevant to today's war? Other than to paint all Russians as monsters, it doesn't really have any bearing.
2. I never denied the asterisk of Berlin. As an avid war history buff, I presume you know about the German scorched earth policy, the 27 to 30 million dead Russians and the fact that those Russian soldiers had seen sufficent horrors perpetrated on their civilian population as they advanced through German occupied Russia, Ukraine etc. . While not condoning asterisk, it didn't happen in a vacuum. Interestingly, quite a number of the nazi perpetrators of horrific crimes were shipped off to Alied nations (operation paperclip, I believe), so the Alied side didn't seem to have too much of a problem with people of dubious morality. Canada was particularly enthusiastic to take Ukrainian SS members, it would seem. Quite a big expat community in Canada, and parliamentary standing ovations for ex SS soldiers.
3. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_during_the_liberation_of_France just to balance the argument.
4. Modern Russia is not the USSR. Vladimir Putin is not Joseph Stalin. Two points that seem to be problematic for some.

Well excuse me but when someone refers to something as alleged in that context it tends to indicate that they don't believe it. Glad to hear that's not the case.
And Stalin and the development of the post revolution USSR very much has a bearing on what is going on now.
We are looking at essentially the legacy of the cold war, which has shaped Soviet, and I would argue Russian, thinking ever since.
Stalin was the architect of this.
Putin has made no secret that he thinks the demise of the old order was a disaster, so extremely relevant.

And yes the allies were quite happy to ignore the often very unsavoury past of scientists and others, who's skills they wanted post war.
Disgusting I agree.
You do know that the Soviets did exactly the same, under Osoaviakhim, or are you conveniently ignoring that?
Not sure it really works as a piece of whataboutery.

And yes the Germans behaved in an utterly barbaric way.
And the commissars urged red army troops to take their revenge on the German people in kind, which they did with enthusiasm. All very civilised.
Again not really a great argument is it?

Getting back to the point, which you have completely avoided answering.

Why, if the Russians have so comprehensively thrashed the Ukrainian army, is Putin not parading through the streets of Kiev?
And why is the notorious fascist Zelensky still apparently in power?

Seems rather strange, don't you think?

Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain these apparent contradictions for us thickies.

 

[Jake]

I do hope you are refering to someone other than me, because otherwise you are wrong on both counts. Sorry to disappoint.

You have said you were former UK military (edit, can't find a reference so accept I may be wrong on that). I may have got the country wrong (Macedonia?) but it's somewhat adjacent to Bulgaria.

 

[paulrbarnard]

You have said you were former UK military (edit, can't find a reference so accept I may be wrong on that). I may have got the country wrong (Macedonia?) but it's somewhat adjacent to Bulgaria.

He said he ‘Served’. Perhaps in catering?

 

[Hypnotic Chimera]

I have none. I am nobody, from nowhere. This is the internet, after all. If you have family in the Ukraine then you ought to know all about what actually happened in 2013 and 2014, the reasons why the breakaway republics broke away, the reality as opposed to the fictional western story of the "invasion" of the Crimea. Perhaps you could share your inside knowledge with us. Unless you are actually a member of 77 Brigade or similar, in which case there really is little point.

I have no clue what you are referring to because it is utter disinformation. Utter garbage. Utter, utter BS.
I also have no clue what 77 Bgde might be?
(I did say I was currently serving g, and that label suggests a very dodgy organisation, the type that if I had an association, then my high level Security Clearance would be revoked and I'd have to move jobs.)

 

[Jake]

I also have no clue what 77 Bgde might be?

He is saying you might be British Army psyops. Eg https://www.wired.com/story/inside-the-77th-brigade-britains-information-warfare-military/

Attack is the best form of defence I suppose. And always project to deflect.

 

[Jacob]

just a reminder I've already linked, but Adam Curtis is essential viewing and brilliantly filmed. https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episodes/p0d3hwl1/russia-19851999-traumazone

 

[Jake]

He said he ‘Served’. Perhaps in catering?

You recall that too?

 

[Trainee neophyte]

You have said you were former UK military (edit, can't find a reference so accept I may be wrong on that). I may have got the country wrong (Macedonia?) but it's somewhat adjacent to Bulgaria.

My profile tells you exactly where I am. The location is stated quite clearly at the bottom of my avatar, on every post. Back in the day I even posted photos of my house.

And yes, I am only two border crossings from the U,raine, hence my desire to work out what is actually going on.

;-)

Why, if the Russians have so comprehensively thrashed the Ukrainian army, is Putin not parading through the streets of Kiev?
And why is the notorious fascist Zelensky still apparently in power?

Seems rather strange, don't you think?

Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain these apparent contradictions for us thickies

"Patience, Grasshopper".

Firstly, I don't actually know, I can only guess. I'm not privy to either Russian or Ukrainian defence intelligence. However, as far as I can tell, Russia invaded with far too few soldiers to actually take and hold ground - it was more of a lightning strike to make a point, followed by negotiation to get what they wanted. The ukranian side seemed to agree to a compromise, and even went as far as to initial some documents but then Boris turned up to put a stop to all that. As far as I can tell, the plan seems to have been to get Russia to overextended themselves by taking too much territory, then have them suffer a 20 year Afghanistan insurgency style war of occupation - NATO knows exactly how much that hurts.
Once Russia worked out they had been duped (yet again) by the agreement non-capable West, they did something that seems to have baffled NATO: they went into a ww1 trench warfare, stalemate style war of attrition. It has sucked in all the old Warsaw pact equipment, all the old NATO equipment (Challenger tanks being a fine example), and artillery is the lynchpin. Russian (ie. USSR) doctrine always had far more artilliary than NATO, because NATO has shiny jets for air supremacy, so Russia has a 10 to 1 superiority in artillery. Russia also seems to have a casualty ratio commensurate with their artillery superiority, unless you take Ukranian official pronouncements at face value.

Current tactics appear to be shell the bejesus out of a Ukrainian trench until everyone seems to be dead or disabled, then send 4 guys on motorbikes to take said trench. Only 4, because drones have changed the entire landscape of war.

So, first Ukrainian army, trained and supplied by NATO from 2014 to 2022 (after rebuilding following various embarrassing episodes involving angry Donbas miners and airports) gets taken apart pretty quickly in the first few weeks of chaos following the initial invasion by Russia in 2022. The Ukrainian counterattack and retreat/retrenchment by Russia led to a stalemate and actually pretty wobbly moments for Russia, once it became clear the Ukraine wouldn't go belly up immediately. Russian troops numbers were far too low to do the job, but they managed to hold on into 2023 and a partial mobilisation gave them more to work with. 2023 was the great Ukrainian counterattack - a whole new army, tra8ned abroad and fully equipped with shiny NATO kit (run out of Soviet toys by this point) smashed itself to pieces repeatedly on the Surovikin defensive line. I freely admit to being baffled by the NATO/Ukranian tactics here - perhaps you were involved in the disaster, and can give more details as to what the generals were thinking.

2024 is the great second battle of Kirsk - same as 2023: oodles of NATO equipment smashed to pieces for absolutely no purpose, other than to confirm to the Russian people that this is an existential war against the entirety of the Western world. Russia proper under attack, by people driving German tanks and wearing WWII German helmets. Again, baffling strategy that serves no immediate purpose other than to kill many, many Ukrainians while trying to take some strategically irrelevant cow pasture.

Tldr version:
2022 Warsaw pact equipped Ukrainian army destroyed. Russia retrenches for defensive, attritional war.
2023 new NATO equipped Ukrainian army destroyed on Surovikin line - no gain for Ukraine
2024yet another new NATO equipped Ukrainian army destroyed in Kursk - no gain for Ukraine.

Currently all the good kit is still being sent to Kursk, where it gets exploded. In the meantime, the Ukrainians on the rest of the front are struggling badly because there are no longer any reserves. Russia doesn't seem interested in taking ground, they seem very interested in killing Ukrainian soldiers, and they seem to be very good at it. The various fronts appear to be slowly collapsing due to lack of reserves, but Russia has endless patience it would seem, and are content to keep the casualty ratio somewhere around 6-8 dead Ukrainian for every dead Russian.

That's my personal take - please show me where i might be wrong.

 

[Jake]

My profile tells you exactly where I am. The location is stated quite clearly at the bottom of my avatar, on every post. Back in the day I even posted photos of my house.

Yes now deleted like a lot of stuff. You definitely were not in Greece before. You claimed Macedonia.

 

[RobinBHM]

I have none. I am nobody, from nowhere. This is the internet, after all. If you have family in the Ukraine then you ought to know all about what actually happened in 2013 and 2014, the reasons why the breakaway republics broke away, the reality as opposed to the fictional western story of the "invasion" of the Crimea. Perhaps you could share your inside knowledge with us. Unless you are actually a member of 77 Brigade or similar, in which case there really is little point.

Usual trolling from Neophyte.

What happened in 2013 and 2014 was that Putin sent in Wagner to annexe Donbas.

Also Putin funded and armed Russian supporting separatists….many of which came from Russia.

Azov and Ukraine general army began fighting them


And no people of Crimea did not want to become part of Russia

 

[RobinBHM]

I have no clue what you are referring to because it is utter disinformation. Utter garbage. Utter, utter BS.
I also have no clue what 77 Bgde might be?
(I did say I was currently serving g, and that label suggests a very dodgy organisation, the type that if I had an association, then my high level Security Clearance would be revoked and I'd have to move jobs.)

I wouldn’t bother he is a nasty troll

 

[TRITON]

This is a good source of on the spot info, and the guys tells it as it is. Language is as you'd expect a bit colourful

https://www.youtube.com/@BigMakBattleBlog/videos

It's an interesting take on things and how things actually are in the real world, and not what we armchair generals might think, or might like to think. But this vid is from 6 months back and are painting a bleak picture to the 2nd vid, where he's looking a bit more relaxed, but the worry is still there and the pragmatic view from the ground still speaks more truth than anything.
Send him 50 quid if you can.
.

.

 

[Trainee neophyte]

Yes now deleted like a lot of stuff. You definitely were not in Greece before. You claimed Macedonia.

Now you're just being weird. I know where I live - I have an identity card and everything. I speak Greek. No idea what language they speak in Moldova (presume Russian?) but i probably wouldnt get very far there. Trying to force me into being something I am not says a great deal more about you than it does about me.

 

[Trainee neophyte]

Usual trolling from Neophyte.

What happened in 2013 and 2014 was that Putin sent in Wagner to annexe Donbas.

No, what happened was that we in the West helped overthrow the democratically elected government using the only tool we had to hand - a bunch of psychopathic football hooligans with delusions of 3rd Reich connections to their grandparents' SS membership. Ethnic Russians in the Donbas region objected to being treated as Untermench, being forced into buildings and set on fire, etc, and tried to d3clare independence. Putin spent years NOT supporting them, not allowing them to join Russia despite their demands, trying Minsk agreements to get a peaceful resolution without breaking up the Ukraine (which Angela Merkel has confirmed was just a ploy to give the Ukraine time to rearm) and generally trying to avoid a war with NATO.

Also Putin funded and armed Russian supporting separatists….many of which came from Russia.

Most Ukrainians have Russian family. This is a civil war between cousins. This is an entirely synthetic, artificial conflict, created by the usual suspects for the usual reason - must destabilise Russia, and way we can.

Azov and Ukraine general army began fighting them

Do you know about Odessa? Do you know about the Ukrainian airforce bombing a market? Why did they declare independence? Why did they "break away"? Just because Putin demanded it? He has a funny way of not supporting what you claim he engendered, but then reality iis mostly opti9n in the West these days.

And no people of Crimea did not want to become part of Russia

Sigh.
Yes, the people of the Crimea really, really did want to be Russian. The had a referendum and declared independence from the the USSR, initially as part 9f the Ukraine but then they wanted their independence. You probably didn't know that. Somehow, despite overwhelming support for joining Russia it never happened. They also had another referendum after Russia allegedly "annexed" the Crimea, but no Russian soldiers were transported to the Crimea because they were already there! It is Russia's warm water port, where the Black Sea Fleet is based, and is chock full of Russian servicemen and their families, and all the support services to provide for them. Saying the People of Crimea didn't want to be Russian is about as silly as suggesting that Gibralta desperately wants to rejoin Spain. Flies in the face of reality.

https://culturedarm.com/the-crimean-referendums-of-1991-and-1994/

Perhaps more controversially – and as the refworld.org link details – in May 1992 the Crimean parliament established a Crimean constitution, and in September-October 1993 it established the post of President of Crimea. But in early 1994, after a polarising election campaign, Crimeans elected as their President a strongly pro-Russian candidate, Yuriy Meshkov. A power struggle between the Ukrainian parliament and the Crimean parliament commenced. Another Crimean referendum in March 1994 asked three questions: ‘1.3 million voted, 78.4% of whom supported greater autonomy from Ukraine, 82.8% supported allowing dual Russian-Ukrainian citizenship, and 77.9% favored giving Crimean presidential decrees the force of law’. Yet after more political turbulence – with the Crimean parliament voting to oust Meshkov in September – in March 1995 the Ukrainian parliament unilaterally abolished the post of President of Crimea, and scrapped the Crimean constitution. The Crimean parliament was forced to define a new constitution, which the Ukrainian parliament finally ratified in 1998.

 

[Scruples]

This was a direct consequence of their attempts to implement free-market neoliberal economics, including selling off state run enterprises. Listening to the west was a big mistake.
There's a brilliant film to watch https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-...-ingenious-essential-viewing-from-adam-curtis

We'll never know that. All we know is that there was a change of power in the USSR that caused instability and unrest. The population, unused to any form of real freedom, couldn't handle it and saw that the future was becoming very uncertain.
Now, in the places away from the cities, life carried on as usual. That's a lot of people for whom politics meant nothing.
I suppose you had to be there to see it and understand...

 

[Fergie 307]

No, what happened was that we in the West helped overthrow the democratically elected government using the only tool we had to hand - a bunch of psychopathic football hooligans with delusions of 3rd Reich connections to their grandparents' SS membership. Ethnic Russians in the Donbas region objected to being treated as Untermench, being forced into buildings and set on fire, etc, and tried to d3clare independence. Putin spent years NOT supporting them, not allowing them to join Russia despite their demands, trying Minsk agreements to get a peaceful resolution without breaking up the Ukraine (which Angela Merkel has confirmed was just a ploy to give the Ukraine time to rearm) and generally trying to avoid a war with NATO.

Most Ukrainians have Russian family. This is a civil war between cousins. This is an entirely synthetic, artificial conflict, created by the usual suspects for the usual reason - must destabilise Russia, and way we can.

Do you know about Odessa? Do you know about the Ukrainian airforce bombing a market? Why did they declare independence? Why did they "break away"? Just because Putin demanded it? He has a funny way of not supporting what you claim he engendered, but then reality iis mostly opti9n in the West these days.

Sigh.
Yes, the people of the Crimea really, really did want to be Russian. The had a referendum and declared independence from the the USSR, initially as part 9f the Ukraine but then they wanted their independence. You probably didn't know that. Somehow, despite overwhelming support for joining Russia it never happened. They also had another referendum after Russia allegedly "annexed" the Crimea, but no Russian soldiers were transported to the Crimea because they were already there! It is Russia's warm water port, where the Black Sea Fleet is based, and is chock full of Russian servicemen and their families, and all the support services to provide for them. Saying the People of Crimea didn't want to be Russian is about as silly as suggesting that Gibralta desperately wants to rejoin Spain. Flies in the face of reality.

https://culturedarm.com/the-crimean-referendums-of-1991-and-1994/

Perhaps more controversially – and as the refworld.org link details – in May 1992 the Crimean parliament established a Crimean constitution, and in September-October 1993 it established the post of President of Crimea. But in early 1994, after a polarising election campaign, Crimeans elected as their President a strongly pro-Russian candidate, Yuriy Meshkov. A power struggle between the Ukrainian parliament and the Crimean parliament commenced. Another Crimean referendum in March 1994 asked three questions: ‘1.3 million voted, 78.4% of whom supported greater autonomy from Ukraine, 82.8% supported allowing dual Russian-Ukrainian citizenship, and 77.9% favored giving Crimean presidential decrees the force of law’. Yet after more political turbulence – with the Crimean parliament voting to oust Meshkov in September – in March 1995 the Ukrainian parliament unilaterally abolished the post of President of Crimea, and scrapped the Crimean constitution. The Crimean parliament was forced to define a new constitution, which the Ukrainian parliament finally ratified in 1998.

Interesting that you choose to leave out certain bits of the article linked to.
For example, this observation from the author.

"I wouldn't depict the 1991 referendum as crimeans voting to restore their ties with Russia".

Can't really see much point in continuing any debate with you.
You are so far beyond delusional that if I were standing at delusional I would need a telescope to see you.

 

[Jacob]

We'll never know that. All we know is that there was a change of power in the USSR that caused instability and unrest.

But we can make surmises.

.......
I suppose you had to be there to see it and understand...

Next best thing is to watch the Adam Curtis films https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episodes/p0d3hwl1/russia-19851999-traumazone

 

[ey_tony]

Can't really see much point in continuing any debate with you.
You are so far beyond delusional that if I were standing at delusional I would need a telescope to see you.

So in effect what you're saying is that anyone who disagrees with you or has a different perspective on a subject to your own is delusional in your eyes?