One-*** efficacy questions

[rwillett]

I have followed this thread with interest. It's noticeable that it has stayed a lot more closer to the target and hasn't strayed away into some of the more conspiracy orientated ones that have had to be stopped.

I also recently discovered that I can block certain people. That has significantly improved the quality of the thread. I would suggest other people check it out.

Please keep posting as this is helpful

Rob

 

[RobinBHM]

We have a disease that is not serious at all for 99%+ of people that catch it

Untrue.

The vulnerable have been shielding for most of the pandemic period, so the data is not based on a random sample of people.

That's the problem with those advocating herd immunity....they base their arguments on Covid death rates which occurred despite extensive NPIs.


If you want to try the "Covid isn't that dangerous" let's see the data based on allowing Covid to rip through the community without any interventions.

 

[RobinBHM]

I have followed this thread with interest. It's noticeable that it has stayed a lot more closer to the target and hasn't strayed away into some of the more conspiracy orientated ones that have had to be stopped.

I also recently discovered that I can block certain people. That has significantly improved the quality of the thread. I would suggest other people check it out.

Please keep posting as this is helpful

Rob

There are some really informative posts on this thread from people like Jonm.....it's really interesting to read his posts because they written from a scientific perspective avoiding emotive arguments and confirmation bias.

 

[Jonm]

I have followed this thread with interest. It's noticeable that it has stayed a lot more closer to the target and hasn't strayed away into some of the more conspiracy orientated ones that have had to be stopped.

I also recently discovered that I can block certain people. That has significantly improved the quality of the thread. I would suggest other people check it out.

Please keep posting as this is helpful

Rob

Good post, we need to try and stay on topic. I got dragged in to a slanging match with d_w, now sorted, case of mistaken identity, but no doubt bored everyone else. Once we start arguing from entrenched positions and slinging mud the post becomes pointless.

 

[Jonm]

There are some really informative posts on this thread from people like Jonm.....it's really interesting to read his posts because they written from a scientific perspective avoiding emotive arguments and confirmation bias.

Thank you, I try to be objective and yes my background is science but not biology. I am a retired engineer, mostly design.

 

[Peterm1000]

Surely the sobering thing about the Indian situation should be that it is an illustration of what happens when your health system has no more capacity. For most people the virus appears to be survivable IF you have access to medical facilities. We never experienced that in the UK.

 

[RobinBHM]

Surely the sobering thing about the Indian situation should be that it is an illustration of what happens when your health system has no more capacity. For most people the virus appears to be survivable IF you have access to medical facilities. We never experienced that in the UK.

Healthcare spend per capita (2019)

USA $11,000
United Kingdom $4,600
India $275

India is among the countries having the lowest public healthcare budget in the world, with the public healthcare system in the country merely getting 1.26% of the total GDP.

 

[Rorschach]

Robin you never fail to disappoint

I wonder how you would feel if you lived in Sweden, would you be following the governments path then? Interesting thought experiment, how much of your views are based on what you are told to think by the BBC et al?

 

[D_W]

IF you have access to medical facilities.

Steroids and oxygen being the two most important and a doc who isn't afraid to keep you alive by thinking they need to follow typical steroid script indications to "keep you healthy". Healthy doesn't amount to much if you suffocate.

Two very cheap things to supply, but deadly when not available.

 

[Spectric]

we are so entangled with our so called rights

See it's phrases like this that worry me so much.

Why?

Yes we all have certain rights but we have to accept there is a limit, they are not endless and at times they may need to be curbed for the greater good. But in times of crisis we just have to accept that these rights may have to be compromised along with our freedom.

Personally I cannot see anything wrong with all humans being chipped, it would save the country billions of pounds, reduce fraud, allow a fairer political system and drastically reduce crime. The only people who would object are those who are corrupt or criminal, imagine the unsolved murders we currently have, if people were chipped then you would know everyone in the vicinity and those close enough to have commited the murder, could be the start of a crime free country and with the saved cash used to offset poverty and address so many other social issues.

 

[D_W]

Good post, we need to try and stay on topic. I got dragged in to a slanging match with d_w, now sorted, case of mistaken identity, but no doubt bored everyone else. Once we start arguing from entrenched positions and slinging mud the post becomes pointless.

There's a term in pro-wrestling, "in a shoot, the fans always lose."

A shoot in wrestling being what happens when two guys don't like each other and they use the cover of a match to have a real fight. Two wrestlers beat each other and nothing interesting to the fans happens.

Again, my apologies - I do pick steadily in debates, but I never try to falsely accuse anyone of something - it's not an excusable tactic.

 

[D_W]

we are so entangled with our so called rights



Why?

Yes we all have certain rights but we have to accept there is a limit, they are not endless and at times they may need to be curbed for the greater good. But in times of crisis we just have to accept that these rights may have to be compromised along with our freedom.

Personally I cannot see anything wrong with all humans being chipped, it would save the country billions of pounds, reduce fraud, allow a fairer political system and drastically reduce crime. The only people who would object are those who are corrupt or criminal, imagine the unsolved murders we currently have, if people were chipped then you would know everyone in the vicinity and those close enough to have commited the murder, could be the start of a crime free country and with the saved cash used to offset poverty and address so many other social issues.

I suspect 95% of the time, chipping will result only in curbing rights of people for things they have no control of, but someone will step up in the other 5% and show us why it's a really bad idea with something more closely related to genocide or eugenics (politically motivated or idealistic).

We'll lose our humanity and some people who think of themselves as just will go along with it if it happens a little at a time.

 

[Rorschach]

Surely the sobering thing about the Indian situation should be that it is an illustration of what happens when your health system has no more capacity. For most people the virus appears to be survivable IF you have access to medical facilities. We never experienced that in the UK.

It's an illustration of spending your money on a space programme and nuclear programme instead of healthcare, amongst other things. India is not a poor country, it just chooses to spend it's money in different ways.

 

[Rorschach]

we are so entangled with our so called rights



Why?

Yes we all have certain rights but we have to accept there is a limit, they are not endless and at times they may need to be curbed for the greater good. But in times of crisis we just have to accept that these rights may have to be compromised along with our freedom.

Personally I cannot see anything wrong with all humans being chipped, it would save the country billions of pounds, reduce fraud, allow a fairer political system and drastically reduce crime. The only people who would object are those who are corrupt or criminal, imagine the unsolved murders we currently have, if people were chipped then you would know everyone in the vicinity and those close enough to have commited the murder, could be the start of a crime free country and with the saved cash used to offset poverty and address so many other social issues.

Ahh I am so glad that your thoughts are (hopefully) in a small minority and most value freedom even if it does come at some risk.

 

[D_W]

to be fair, their GDP is $2k per capita or just slightly over that, but they do have the means to provide health care given they probably manufacture a majority of the world's drugs and plenty of medical equipment.

English friend here had to go to the outer regions there for work and said "there's one good thing about india. If you're suicidal, you'll visit and come home feeling like life is a lot better than you thought it was. Other than that, no reason to go there. ".

Looks like they chose political rallies despite increasing covid numbers. It'll be interesting to see if their leadership gets re-elected anyway. I have a feeling that in Russia, they could make a covid outbreak into a patriotic thing to rally behind putin.

 

[Blackswanwood]

English friend here had to go to the outer regions there for work and said "there's one good thing about india. If you're suicidal, you'll visit and come home feeling like life is a lot better than you thought it was. Other than that, no reason to go there. ".

Your friend is pretty small minded if that’s his summary. India is an amazing country which makes what is happening at the moment all the more sad.

 

[Rorschach]

Your friend is pretty small minded if that’s his summary. India is an amazing country which makes what is happening at the moment all the more sad.

Side note, do you think there are any countries that are not amazing in their own way? I like to think everywhere has it's charms.

 

[Blackswanwood]

Side note, do you think there are any countries that are not amazing in their own way? I like to think everywhere has it's charms.

I agree ... although I did once have to remind myself on a wet Wednesday in Prestatyn

 

[Spectric]

English friend here had to go to the outer regions there for work and said "there's one good thing about india. If you're suicidal, you'll visit and come home feeling like life is a lot better than you thought it was. Other than that, no reason to go there. ".

Why go all the way to India, you can get the same feeling by visiting the west coast of Cumbria in the Copeland district.

 

[Jameshow]

Why go all the way to India, you can get the same feeling by visiting the west coast of Cumbria in the Copeland district.

Bradford ... !