Teepeg
Established Member
The team I had in to fit my kitchen last year made it look EASY .. 
How easy is it to fit a kitchen?
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Richard_C
Established Member
The first question to ask for a diy job us "where will the new stuff go when its delivered" - especially if it is pre assembled.
I fitted my own about 12 years ago - IKEA. Big-ish Kitchen. Just counted, 25 doors and 10 drawer fronts. Full height fridge and freezer, decided on freestaning - why make it difficult to replace stuff you know won't last forever. Took about 8 days spread over 3 weeks around work comittments. Not too bad a job, I made sure the cooker, hob and power points were where they always had been and carefully planned the rest of it. Although the house was only built in 1987 not much of it was properly square so there was a bit of 'messing about' to get some things looking good.
Some things to consider. When you empty the old cupboards you end up with an astonishing amount of 'stuff' which you have to put somewhere. Same with getting fitters to do it but diy takes longer and diy you also need your shed/garage/access to tools so can't put pots and pans there. On the plus side you remain in complete control. I did mine in sections obver about 3 weeks so we were only without the hob for part of one one day and the sink for a couple of hours. I made up the flat packs in preassembled sets in the garage - essentially a walls-worth at a time - but you do need plenty of space for that. A section of old stuff came out - put on the front drive, you need space for that - new went in. Every 2 or 3 days I had an old unit smashing session apart from the few I kept for the garage. and went to the tip, happily only a 10 minute drive but disposal might be more difficult in some places. I think the biggest challenge was managing workflow and space. (And losing pencils - in the end I bougt a dozen and left them everywhere.)
Nothing overly difficult in fixing the units, I made a simple marking gauge for the top cupboards mounting holes. Took great care with levels and used loads of those little plastic wedges because the floor wan't that even. IKEA cupboards don't have a space behind so give much more useable capacity but you do need to run all the pipework that was fitted behind the old units right down to skirting board level and along the bottom of the units - well worth doing for the end result. 12+ years on they are still like new so happy with quality. The scary bit is at the very end, drilling and fitting for all the handles - no going back - but I didn't do anything stupid like putting one on the hinge side of a door or having them 'clash' when open. I made a drilling guide and checked, checked and checked again before making holes.
Tiling can be done 'at leisure' when the kitchen is back in use. Happily the family went away for 3 days soon after completion so I just sat and tiled, grouted, tiled, grouted drank tea, tiled, grouted .... etc.
If you get professional planners/fitters do take your time trying to imagine everything in use. Imagine yourself getting up and making tea, imagine making sunday lunch with visitors. A double oven - do you put it so the bottom is at worktop height in which case a shorter person may have trouble with loading the top oven, or half a unit down which might be awkward lifitng things out of the main oven. How high and how tall should the top cupboards be. Personal choice and we all differ, just think it through. Don't leave it to the salesperson. A relative has a new multi ££££ flash looking kitchen, great but if you take a heavy hot casserole out of the oven you have to carry it past the freezer and fridge and round a corner before you find a place to put it down. A pain if you are just taking it out for a stir and check. I suspect the designer had never cooked anything. My neighbour had a JL kitchen planned and installed a few years back - including one of those fancy ice making fridges. Sadly the designer (dragger of drawings round a grid to make a pretty picture to sell you stuff) neglected a water or power supply. It was on the opposite side of the room to all the plumbing, no nearby sockets. It sat empty and unloved until they came back 8 weeks later and ran a water pipe around the ceiling and stuck coving up and brought power through from the other side of the wall. "But you signed ot off sir" "But it's not my job to check your designer isn't an idiot". So think detail and think about how you will use it all every day.
I fitted my own about 12 years ago - IKEA. Big-ish Kitchen. Just counted, 25 doors and 10 drawer fronts. Full height fridge and freezer, decided on freestaning - why make it difficult to replace stuff you know won't last forever. Took about 8 days spread over 3 weeks around work comittments. Not too bad a job, I made sure the cooker, hob and power points were where they always had been and carefully planned the rest of it. Although the house was only built in 1987 not much of it was properly square so there was a bit of 'messing about' to get some things looking good.
Some things to consider. When you empty the old cupboards you end up with an astonishing amount of 'stuff' which you have to put somewhere. Same with getting fitters to do it but diy takes longer and diy you also need your shed/garage/access to tools so can't put pots and pans there. On the plus side you remain in complete control. I did mine in sections obver about 3 weeks so we were only without the hob for part of one one day and the sink for a couple of hours. I made up the flat packs in preassembled sets in the garage - essentially a walls-worth at a time - but you do need plenty of space for that. A section of old stuff came out - put on the front drive, you need space for that - new went in. Every 2 or 3 days I had an old unit smashing session apart from the few I kept for the garage. and went to the tip, happily only a 10 minute drive but disposal might be more difficult in some places. I think the biggest challenge was managing workflow and space. (And losing pencils - in the end I bougt a dozen and left them everywhere.)
Nothing overly difficult in fixing the units, I made a simple marking gauge for the top cupboards mounting holes. Took great care with levels and used loads of those little plastic wedges because the floor wan't that even. IKEA cupboards don't have a space behind so give much more useable capacity but you do need to run all the pipework that was fitted behind the old units right down to skirting board level and along the bottom of the units - well worth doing for the end result. 12+ years on they are still like new so happy with quality. The scary bit is at the very end, drilling and fitting for all the handles - no going back - but I didn't do anything stupid like putting one on the hinge side of a door or having them 'clash' when open. I made a drilling guide and checked, checked and checked again before making holes.
Tiling can be done 'at leisure' when the kitchen is back in use. Happily the family went away for 3 days soon after completion so I just sat and tiled, grouted, tiled, grouted drank tea, tiled, grouted .... etc.
If you get professional planners/fitters do take your time trying to imagine everything in use. Imagine yourself getting up and making tea, imagine making sunday lunch with visitors. A double oven - do you put it so the bottom is at worktop height in which case a shorter person may have trouble with loading the top oven, or half a unit down which might be awkward lifitng things out of the main oven. How high and how tall should the top cupboards be. Personal choice and we all differ, just think it through. Don't leave it to the salesperson. A relative has a new multi ££££ flash looking kitchen, great but if you take a heavy hot casserole out of the oven you have to carry it past the freezer and fridge and round a corner before you find a place to put it down. A pain if you are just taking it out for a stir and check. I suspect the designer had never cooked anything. My neighbour had a JL kitchen planned and installed a few years back - including one of those fancy ice making fridges. Sadly the designer (dragger of drawings round a grid to make a pretty picture to sell you stuff) neglected a water or power supply. It was on the opposite side of the room to all the plumbing, no nearby sockets. It sat empty and unloved until they came back 8 weeks later and ran a water pipe around the ceiling and stuck coving up and brought power through from the other side of the wall. "But you signed ot off sir" "But it's not my job to check your designer isn't an idiot". So think detail and think about how you will use it all every day.
That s my point about designers don’t always get it right . The last one I was involved in was wren - the customer changed his mind a few times admittedly but the final design saw the washing machine moved to the opposite side of the kitchen to facilitate a dish washer . The designer then ran a 3 d simulation and said that everything is good and nothing clashes. Great I said but what about the cold water supply and more importantly what about the 1. 1/2 waste pipe that now has to be run around the skirting board ( on show btw ) on 2 walls .
2 tools not yet mentioned but essential are a cable/ pipe detector and a decent laser level …Depends on how big a kitchen, how good the current condition is, and how willing they are to put up with any mistakes.
My own kitchen I had fitters in as wanted it all done as close to perfect and as quick as possible as Christmas was looming.
Have fitted them for friends and the units/ worktops are all straight forward. Adjusting cupboards for pipes is fiddly - worth having a plumber get everything ready for you in the right places unless they’re really willing to learn a new skill.
Electrics and gas as everyone has said leave to the pros.
Bits like tiling and flooring are diyable. First try at tiling is going to be a bit wobbly though so again depends how good they are at living with mistakes/quirks.
If they do start and then give up will likely cost more to have someone fix than it would to get a pro in at the beginning. A friend always wants to try to do things himself first- I wish he’d just let me do it as working with rounded out fixings pieces with bits missing and holes in the wrong places is a recipe for creative problem solving that could have been avoided.
My own kitchen I had fitters in as wanted it all done as close to perfect and as quick as possible as Christmas was looming.
Have fitted them for friends and the units/ worktops are all straight forward. Adjusting cupboards for pipes is fiddly - worth having a plumber get everything ready for you in the right places unless they’re really willing to learn a new skill.
Electrics and gas as everyone has said leave to the pros.
Bits like tiling and flooring are diyable. First try at tiling is going to be a bit wobbly though so again depends how good they are at living with mistakes/quirks.
If they do start and then give up will likely cost more to have someone fix than it would to get a pro in at the beginning. A friend always wants to try to do things himself first- I wish he’d just let me do it as working with rounded out fixings pieces with bits missing and holes in the wrong places is a recipe for creative problem solving that could have been avoided.
So many variables here. However, I wouldn't discourage anyone from trying to fit their own kitchen so long as they're aware that it's a big undertaking and to be prepared for lots of hiccups along the way. There are lots of required skills, but if they have the time to work on it, it's a great feeling to know you've done it yourself. Is it a simple remove and replace, or are they going all in with plastering, electrics, plumbing etc. YouTube is an amazing resource too.
I've installed only 2 myself, my first house around 19 years ago, and the one I have now earlier this year. The first one was an off the shelf deal at MFI IIRC. At that time, I had zero experience with anything of the kind, but i still managed to complete this to a satisfactory standard. This also included a masons mitre. It was far from a professional finish, but the cost saving was well worth it.
The recent one i installed was from DIY kitchens. They would certainly be my recommendation for price vs quality by a long way. I have used b&q, wickes and howdens for other small projects, and they're not even close to DIY kitchens. Their online planner is a little clunky, but perfectly usable. The benefit is the price is on there and each time you add an item, you can see the running cost.
Be nice to know how they get on with this project
I've installed only 2 myself, my first house around 19 years ago, and the one I have now earlier this year. The first one was an off the shelf deal at MFI IIRC. At that time, I had zero experience with anything of the kind, but i still managed to complete this to a satisfactory standard. This also included a masons mitre. It was far from a professional finish, but the cost saving was well worth it.
The recent one i installed was from DIY kitchens. They would certainly be my recommendation for price vs quality by a long way. I have used b&q, wickes and howdens for other small projects, and they're not even close to DIY kitchens. Their online planner is a little clunky, but perfectly usable. The benefit is the price is on there and each time you add an item, you can see the running cost.
Be nice to know how they get on with this project
xy mosian
Established Member
If DIY is attempted:-
Don't drill handle mounting holes until the doors are fitted to the units.
Don't put the units too far back from the front of the worktop, you will lose effective access to the draws.
done both too often *****
geoff
Don't drill handle mounting holes until the doors are fitted to the units.
Don't put the units too far back from the front of the worktop, you will lose effective access to the draws.
done both too often *****
geoff
glenfield2
Established Member
A big vote from me for DIY Kitchens. (diy-kitchens.com). They manufacture all their own stuff and have a big showroom on site in W Yorkshire. Well worth a day out to.
To my mind the quality is excellent - the come fully built and with doors pre-fitted which was a big help for a diy-er like me. Prices also very good.
I fitted our last kitchen from there. It was wrecked by flooding and the insurers insisted on a Howdens replacement which is not a patch on it in quality. Also Howdens pricing is completely opaque and hides behind this ‘trade only’ nonsense.
The only downside of DIY Kitchens is you have to plan and order yourself on line but that’s not too tricky. You could get it planned elsewhere of course.
(I don’t work for them by the way!)
To my mind the quality is excellent - the come fully built and with doors pre-fitted which was a big help for a diy-er like me. Prices also very good.
I fitted our last kitchen from there. It was wrecked by flooding and the insurers insisted on a Howdens replacement which is not a patch on it in quality. Also Howdens pricing is completely opaque and hides behind this ‘trade only’ nonsense.
The only downside of DIY Kitchens is you have to plan and order yourself on line but that’s not too tricky. You could get it planned elsewhere of course.
(I don’t work for them by the way!)
No-one has mentioned free-standing units. These would simplify the cabinetry side of things. I think someone with moderate DIY skills would be able to attach wall cupboards and connect up some free-standing units. This would leave the plumbing and electricals to a pro. Then the decoration can again be done by DIY.
porker
Established Member
Another vote for DIY kitchens. Fitted a new kitchen over lockdown and painstakingly compared a few companies. Some were having supply issues at the time but been really pleased with ours.
Would echo the above comments having fitted a few kitchens and done all the work myself, plumbing, plastering, flooring etc. I have an electrician mate who helps with the
electrics (I'm an electrical engineer just not a spark so we help each other out)
Fitting the units isn't usually the most time consuming part ime but it depends how much of a refit you are doing. In my cases there have always been building work associated. Having said that we all did our first kitchen once.
Still always takes longer than you think and the issue on storing your new kitchen before getting rid of the old can be an issue.
One tip if you go for a painted kitchen is to get some matching paint mixed up (they can match really well these days) and make all the trim and finishing pieces yourself as they charge a fortune for end panels, infills etc. You can save a fortune and make the kitchen your own by some neat customisation
Would echo the above comments having fitted a few kitchens and done all the work myself, plumbing, plastering, flooring etc. I have an electrician mate who helps with the
electrics (I'm an electrical engineer just not a spark so we help each other out)
Fitting the units isn't usually the most time consuming part ime but it depends how much of a refit you are doing. In my cases there have always been building work associated. Having said that we all did our first kitchen once.
Still always takes longer than you think and the issue on storing your new kitchen before getting rid of the old can be an issue.
One tip if you go for a painted kitchen is to get some matching paint mixed up (they can match really well these days) and make all the trim and finishing pieces yourself as they charge a fortune for end panels, infills etc. You can save a fortune and make the kitchen your own by some neat customisation
Diver Fred
Established Member
For wall cupboards you can buy hanging rail - much easier to get level and stronger on stud walls.
I've now done 3 kitchens for myself. Except for a couple of custom made cabinets every time I've bought the cheapest cabinets from B&Q and made the doors myself. In the end it's getting the cabinets in line and level before fixing in place. I always add 50mm to the back of floor cabinets. I usually 'stand' wall cabinets on a 3x2/2x1&1/2 rail that get hidden behind the kitchen splash back and a long 'hanging' rail* to stop them falling away from the wall.
*rather than using the little fixing brackets supplied with the wall cabinets.
I've now done 3 kitchens for myself. Except for a couple of custom made cabinets every time I've bought the cheapest cabinets from B&Q and made the doors myself. In the end it's getting the cabinets in line and level before fixing in place. I always add 50mm to the back of floor cabinets. I usually 'stand' wall cabinets on a 3x2/2x1&1/2 rail that get hidden behind the kitchen splash back and a long 'hanging' rail* to stop them falling away from the wall.
*rather than using the little fixing brackets supplied with the wall cabinets.
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IMO the two most important things are to buy 18/19/20mm thick cabinets not the 16mm usually offered, think carefully about the height of the bottom of the kitchen sink, if you or anyone using this is tall the normal height of these units means you are bending over all the time, all the kitchens I have fitted have 150mm plinths not 100mm no one has ever complained or even commented.
Get B&Q to survey the kitchen for ideas of layout, you don't have to buy from them, most kitchen cabinets are 150mm tray space, 200mm, 250mm, 300mm, 400mm, 450mm some, and 600mm so easy to work out on plan, draw to scale, cut out some squares in the above size's and play around with the drawing, don't forget doors and windows.
Get B&Q to survey the kitchen for ideas of layout, you don't have to buy from them, most kitchen cabinets are 150mm tray space, 200mm, 250mm, 300mm, 400mm, 450mm some, and 600mm so easy to work out on plan, draw to scale, cut out some squares in the above size's and play around with the drawing, don't forget doors and windows.
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I live in a flat with a small galley style kitchen. I wanted a full size washing machine and dishwasher but couldn't make the dimensions work out with standard size flat pack. I used, and I apologise in advance for blaspheming, Ikea units. Dirt cheap carcasses, and units all 30 to 40mm narrower, good range of doors and a great range of neat little accompanying fittings.
A tip for you. If you're putting electrical sockets in make sure they are at leat 150mm up from the work top surface as most modern kitchen gadgets' plugs, have strain relief glands that don't appreciate being bent at right angles if the sockets are too close to the work top. Ask me how I know
.
Good luck
A tip for you. If you're putting electrical sockets in make sure they are at leat 150mm up from the work top surface as most modern kitchen gadgets' plugs, have strain relief glands that don't appreciate being bent at right angles if the sockets are too close to the work top. Ask me how I know
.Good luck
Diver Fred
Established Member
May I suggest rather than 150mm/6inch up from the worktop place them 100mm/4inches down from the underside of the wall cabinets. You will always be able to get to them when the worktop get filled up (it will!).>>snip<<
A tip for you. If you're putting electrical sockets in make sure they are at leat 150mm up from the work top surface as most modern kitchen gadgets' plugs, have strain relief glands that don't appreciate being bent at right angles if the sockets are too close to the work top. Ask me how I know
Good luck
It's also worthwhile fitting the sockets for washing machine/dryer/dishwasher under the worktop as unstitched sockets but with individual switches above the worktop.
I would say a lot depends on the format. If it's a galley kitchen then it's a lot easier. If it has one or two corner returns then best left to the pro's. Small kitchens are harder to fit than big kitchens - in a small kitchen almost every cabinet will need something done to it rather than just put in place.
alex robinson
Established Member
I am surprised given the enthusiasm for second hand tools on here that nobody else seems to think the second hand kitchen option is worth considering. Of course I don't know where they are based or the style they are after, but a very quick eBay search throws up:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/167047484475?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/375552675687?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/205071566966?
2 of those are less than £1k, and 2 come with appliances.
If budget will stretch a bit, why not a specialised second hand kitchen shop like: https://usedkitchenhub.com/kitchen-category/ex-display-and-used-kitchens/
You will still be paying about 15 - 30% of new price.
Don't be scared of the worktops. I was terrified before I tried, but it was easy. (just needed patience and was quite damp!) Tools cost around £200 for the stone cutting and polishing stuff.
Personally 2nd hand kitchens would give the novice installer even more work as there will no doubt existing cutouts and doors that have been hung the on the opposite side to what they req . These issues will need to be addressed . They will also be trying to match up units that may not fit where they want them and end up with a odd mismatched kitchen worse than what they have atm,, seems a bit we weird to rip out one old kitchen to replace it with another old 2 nd hand one .. As mentioned above it’s the layout and size of the kitchen that can make or break novice install .. they could also end up buying a trashed, water damaged kitchen that is no longer fit for purpose and won’t have the experience to spot the faults ..
If you're an experienced DIYer then yes, do it but, be prepared for it to take a while. If you are inexperienced, the (reasonably high) risk is that you will come across something(s) in the course of the job that are problematic and that you cannot solve, or find a way do do it that seems ok at first but will fail after some time. I'm a handyman by trade, I wouldn't take on a full kitchen install
We could all go on and on giving advice, some you will need some you don't, like I would advise putting kitchen appliance sockets in the back of a tray space between one or two units, fridge and freezer sockets in adjacent units not behind them, I would personally put all kitchen appliances on their own radial and not part of a final ring circuit, but do put in a separate final for the kitchen, also everything on individual RCBO"s at best or at least the kitchen on its own RCD.
Have a look at these: https://www.screwfix.com/p/space-pl...xtra-large-45-80mm-x-2mm-x-30mm-50-pack/3427h
Have a look at these: https://www.screwfix.com/p/space-pl...xtra-large-45-80mm-x-2mm-x-30mm-50-pack/3427h
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