Electric vehicles

[Delaney]

BYU releases hybrid 1.5 ltr sedan with 2000 km range for £18k - 25k
You can drive from London to Rome without refueling.
Of course if this is true, we won’t be able to buy one because the US and EU are in a trade war with China (what was that we were saying about saving the planet)?
I suppose as a Brexit bonus our government can import them without EU restrictions (joking of course) we’re not going to do that.
I’m sure that Instead we’re going to raise taxes on cars, fuel and licensing under the guise of saving the planet (not paying for the vast debt our incompetent politicians have racked up) and saving us from the ‘mildest summer since 2015’, whilst the Atlantic is cooling.

This is all a tortuous circle of constant gaslighting but I’m probably getting carried away.

Is this Sedan too good to be true?
If it is do we even need full electric cars anymore?

https://carnewschina.com/2024/08/08...000-km-range-and-3-4l-100-km-fuel-efficiency/

 

[Sachakins]

If you want to be transparent here, you should call EV’s ‘remote combustion vehicles’ as the pollution generated by burning fossil fuels, happens remotely.
Not to mention the increased pollution from the heavier vehicle and its battery

What about the fossil fuels to make petrol. It does cone straight of the ground as petrol.

 

[Sachakins]

You missed the point.

I wasn't suggesting we should drive allegro's or go back to carbs. The point was that the allegro estate carried pretty much the same amount of people and cargo and weighed 700kg less.

Even with all the things you mentioned there is no reason all that should weigh so much. The only reason it does is because people want a big car that is a living room on wheels. Even worse are the 4x4's that are not needed and cart around even more weight for no reason whatsoever, the chances of 99% of them seeing slightly muddy field is pretty slim and even then they fail in slippery conditions as most have summer tyres anyway.

Example a 1970 mini vs a 2024 mini.
I know which one I would rather be in if I crashed!

 

[Sachakins]

The issue is, you cannot provide the battery storage and infrastructure to do what you want.

Do you remember when the Uk tried to build what’s now called the ‘millennium dome’?

All of these things seem silly.
The government went in a huge motorway widening programme, increasing pollution, decreasing safety and at a huge cost, when all they had to do, was charge middle lane hoggers for hogging the middle lane.
There was no need to add an extra lane.
When someone hogs the middle lane on a 3 lane motorway, you effectively now have a two lane motorway.
It’s the same with EV’s.
Fuel is plentiful, cars are ever more efficient, reliable, cheap to buy and make, everyone can
buy one. It has great strategic importance in times of war, It can be stored safely, it can be moved around easily and used at source without the nees for complicated and or expensive technology, that will never be available to the masses.

Simpler solution for lane hogging problem is to allow undertaking on motorways.

 

[Sachakins]

The current stories around EV battery costs be extortionate,
Is already starting to wane, since manufacturers are giving longer battery pack warranties, the battery warranty on mine is actually longer than on the rest of the car.
However as the skills in technicians are advancing, so are the garages starting to come on stream with cell, packs and modular repairs. In example. https://cedarelectric.co.uk/electric-and-hybrid-battery-repairs/

There is a company up north that is also working on refurbishing and updating early Leaf battery packs, using newer cell technologies. But don't know if its just a test trial or fully fledge business yet.

There is also upcycling of battery packs no longer viable for the heavy current draw for cars, but are ideal to convert to use as storage systems for houses using solar or cheap rate charging.

Some cars are already for V2G or V2H (vehicle to grid or to house) but the big stumbling block is the charger you need is a few grand, not the few hundred a normal EV charger costs.

 

[Scruples]

As has been demonstrated earlier; More weight isn't necessarily a bad thing if it brings significant benefits. Small estate cars disappeared because too few people bought them and people prefer SUV type cars. They give better visibility and are far easier to access if you're trying to get children in or if you have mobility/flexibility issues.

One problem of perception here is that SUV is used generically, but individual cars that get described as such vary a lot in size from genuine monsters like the Range Rovers and Q7s down to small SUVs with a size and economy similar to most cars like the Dacia Duster or VW Tiguan.

You missed out one significant reason for the choice of an SUV over a smaller estate car. Some larger people think that having a large vehicle makes them feel smaller. Psychology at work, perhaps?
From my observations, it appears as difficult to get small children in and out of an SUV as a smaller car.

 

[paulrbarnard]

You missed out one significant reason for the choice of an SUV over a smaller estate car. Some larger people think that having a large vehicle makes them feel smaller. Psychology at work, perhaps?
From my observations, it appears as difficult to get small children in and out of an SUV as a smaller car.

Oh, like sports cars make other bits look bigger?

 

[Rhossydd]

Simpler solution for lane hogging problem is to allow undertaking on motorways.

Possibly worth a separate thread, a bit off topic.
Potentially very dangerous as drivers are taught to watch for overtaking traffic coming past their off side. Changing that behaviour wouldn't be easy.
Yes, overtaking is allowed on the inside on one way roads, when turning left and in congestion, but nearly all those situations are at slower speeds than motorways.
What's realistically needed is much tougher enforcement and punishment for offenders. It ought to be possible to automate this in black spots, like speed cameras, and have a well publicised campaign with punitive fines to bring the issue to public attention.

 

[Terrytpot]

Possibly worth a separate thread, a bit off topic.
Potentially very dangerous as drivers are taught to watch for overtaking traffic coming past their off side. Changing that behaviour wouldn't be easy.
Yes, overtaking is allowed on the inside on one way roads, when turning left and in congestion, but nearly all those situations are at slower speeds than motorways.
What's realistically needed is much tougher enforcement and punishment for offenders. It ought to be possible to automate this in black spots, like speed cameras, and have a well publicised campaign with punitive fines to bring the issue to public attention.

As an HGV driver who travels everyday up and down the M1 I’ve found that the issue isn’t so much a deliberate act to hog a lane but seems to be more one of individuals having absolutely no idea of :
1- what the speed limit actually is
2- their immediate surroundings
3- how to maintain speed or proximity
4- what lane they should actually be in
5- what technology their vehicle has or how to use it

Bearing in mind that during the normal working day the majority of vehicles I see trundling along are less than 5 years old, it’s not beyond reason to guess that a large percentage of them have cruise control but I’d swear fewer than 10% of people use it so we all have to plod along at 42mph because the muppet at the front isn’t sure how fast they should be going , doesn’t want to use the “slow/lorry lane”, is having a chat with their passenger or some other unfathomable reason. The sooner ALL motorway users have adaptive cruise control that is implemented upon joining a motorway the better…**** you could even do something like the M4 bus lane and say you can only overtake if you have it…
As for expansion of the motorway network, I wasn’t convinced using the hard shoulder as an active lane was a good idea but it was so effective when they introduced it on the M42 around the bottom of Birmingham I could see why it gained traction but it’s use elsewhere has been nothing short of disastrous. I remain convinced the solution is to have elevated stretches where freight and emergency vehicles travel “downstairs” and all the idiots go up top, just dig holes, plant the pillars and drop on prefabricated sections of road as you go much like they do now with new bridges.

 

[MikeJhn]

Selective power cuts may become a thing, but with smart meters and lots of batteries sitting connected to the grid, better power management is possible, so a plus for EVs...

Only if you can afford lots of batteries and have the room, where do you put them if you live in a flat?

Simpler solution for lane hogging problem is to allow undertaking on motorways.

And introduce the American traffic law of "Unsafe lane change"

 

[Spectric]

Simpler solution for lane hogging problem is to allow undertaking on motorways.

Or 3 points and £60 per mile whilst lane hogging.

 

[Terry - Somerset]

At the risk of alienating any HGV drivers on the forum, the principal impediment to progress is when three lanes become two as one HGV with an imperceptible speed advantage over another hogs the middle lane in an overtaking manoeuvre at ~60mph.

 

[Cobbs]

Only if you can afford lots of batteries and have the room, where do you put them if you live in a flat?

And introduce the American traffic law of "Unsafe lane change"

I was referring to the batteries in all the EVs...

 

[woodieallen]

Possibly worth a separate thread, a bit off topic.
Potentially very dangerous as drivers are taught to watch for overtaking traffic coming past their off side. Changing that behaviour wouldn't be easy.
Yes, overtaking is allowed on the inside on one way roads, when turning left and in congestion, but nearly all those situations are at slower speeds than motorways.
What's realistically needed is much tougher enforcement and punishment for offenders. It ought to be possible to automate this in black spots, like speed cameras, and have a well publicised campaign with punitive fines to bring the issue to public attention.

And tail-gaters. I would keep a special place in **** for them.

 

[Sachakins]

Just a note to all all the doomsday sayers about the electricity grid can't cope.... here a couple of facts for you.

The UK's electricity consumption has been declining since 2005, when it peaked at 357 terawatt-hours. In 2023, the UK's electricity consumption was 266 terawatt-hours, its lowest level of the century

 

[paulrbarnard]

I remain convinced the solution is to have elevated stretches where freight and emergency vehicles travel “downstairs” and all the idiots go up top, just dig holes, plant the pillars and drop on prefabricated sections of road as you go much like they do now with new bridges.

Has the added advantage of preventing sun burn on one arm of lorry drivers but vitamin D tablets may be required.

+1 for compulsory cruise control. I would also like the legalisation of machine guns for use on people who pass you then slow down.

 

[paulrbarnard]

Or 3 points and £60 per mile whilst lane hogging.

Charging by Lane is an interesting idea. 1.5p per mile, middle lane 3p per mile, outer lane 6p per mile. Using this same charging model for all roads would amount to the same for the average car with average driving per year as the current VED.

 

[llywmog]

As an HGV driver who travels everyday up and down the M1 I’ve found that the issue isn’t so much a deliberate act to hog a lane but seems to be more one of individuals having absolutely no idea of :
1- what the speed limit actually is
2- their immediate surroundings
3- how to maintain speed or proximity
4- what lane they should actually be in
5- what technology their vehicle has or how to use it

Bearing in mind that during the normal working day the majority of vehicles I see trundling along are less than 5 years old, it’s not beyond reason to guess that a large percentage of them have cruise control but I’d swear fewer than 10% of people use it so we all have to plod along at 42mph because the muppet at the front isn’t sure how fast they should be going , doesn’t want to use the “slow/lorry lane”, is having a chat with their passenger or some other unfathomable reason. The sooner ALL motorway users have adaptive cruise control that is implemented upon joining a motorway the better…**** you could even do something like the M4 bus lane and say you can only overtake if you have it…
As for expansion of the motorway network, I wasn’t convinced using the hard shoulder as an active lane was a good idea but it was so effective when they introduced it on the M42 around the bottom of Birmingham I could see why it gained traction but it’s use elsewhere has been nothing short of disastrous. I remain convinced the solution is to have elevated stretches where freight and emergency vehicles travel “downstairs” and all the idiots go up top, just dig holes, plant the pillars and drop on prefabricated sections of road as you go much like they do now with new bridges.

Love my ACC. Makes motorway driving so much easier and less tiresome.

 

[Delaney]

Not sure what your point is?

There are already electricity tariffs which enable you to charge at a lower cost when demand is lower for which you need a smart meter. If you need to charge immediately you still can but obviously you pay more. Everyone is a winner.

As a further burden is put on the grid, they will ha e to stagger charging times, likely by location. You will then find that there will no longer be a cheaper tariff time as all times, will be considered peak.
The price to charge at home will end up as expensive as the stations.

You can’t cheat the system. The argument today that you’re saving money will soon upset those who need to raid your little piggy bank.

 

[Delaney]

As an HGV driver who travels everyday up and down the M1 I’ve found that the issue isn’t so much a deliberate act to hog a lane but seems to be more one of individuals having absolutely no idea of :
1- what the speed limit actually is
2- their immediate surroundings
3- how to maintain speed or proximity
4- what lane they should actually be in
5- what technology their vehicle has or how to use it

Bearing in mind that during the normal working day the majority of vehicles I see trundling along are less than 5 years old, it’s not beyond reason to guess that a large percentage of them have cruise control but I’d swear fewer than 10% of people use it so we all have to plod along at 42mph because the muppet at the front isn’t sure how fast they should be going , doesn’t want to use the “slow/lorry lane”, is having a chat with their passenger or some other unfathomable reason. The sooner ALL motorway users have adaptive cruise control that is implemented upon joining a motorway the better…**** you could even do something like the M4 bus lane and say you can only overtake if you have it…
As for expansion of the motorway network, I wasn’t convinced using the hard shoulder as an active lane was a good idea but it was so effective when they introduced it on the M42 around the bottom of Birmingham I could see why it gained traction but it’s use elsewhere has been nothing short of disastrous. I remain convinced the solution is to have elevated stretches where freight and emergency vehicles travel “downstairs” and all the idiots go up top, just dig holes, plant the pillars and drop on prefabricated sections of road as you go much like they do now with new bridges.

That is all very well and your experience is valid but think of the principle next time you see it.
If you have someone hogging a middle lane of a three lane motorway, you no longer have a three la ne motorway as all traffic has to go into the outside lane to over take.
This means you now have a dual carriage way and the traffic responds accordingly.

Watch it in motion and how it causes huge congestion in the middle and fast lane with the slow one being essentially empty.

It is single handedly the biggest cause of congestion on motorways and the government decided to spend hundreds of millions putting in extra lanes (mostly by taking sway the hard shoulder) for the same behaviour to go on.