Anyone got a Breadmaker

[Chris152]

Yep, 5 mins ago I opened a new pack of waitrose 'freefrom' (GF) costing £2.59, looked at the fine-looking crust and nibbled a crunchy-looking bit off. It was soft and like cardboard, like all the rest.
I don't even know what stretch is! If you can find that recipe I'd like to give it a go, Steve. Tbh I'd not even thought to try making my own til I read this thread.

 

[Chris152]

Look what I've found.

That's brilliant! There's hope yet...

 

[Steve Maskery]

Stretch is what gives bread its nice open bubbly texture. It what the gluten does. So take the gluten out and so you get no stretch = cardboard.
Cake is not leavened, so no gluten develops, so you get a crumbly texture. You want crumbly in a cake, you don't want crumbly in a loaf

 

[Phil Pascoe]

a good little book is Tips for your Breadmaker by Karen Saunders ISBN 0091909120
I saw it by chance, it was recommended by an experienced professional baker. It has a gluten free recipe, albeit rather long winded. It also has a gingerbread (cake?) recipe which is quite wonderful, though I don't use a breadmaker for it.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/0091909120

 

[Dibs-h]

Even just looking at the Panasonic machines it's a bit much to figure out which one out of their machines to go for.

Found the following

http://www.asliceofbread.co.uk/panasoni ... r-reviews/

Which seems to give a reasonable breakdown of what the machines do.

Might be of use to anyone looking at a machine.

 

[rafezetter]

On the subject of breadmaking - last night I saw a re-run of Jamie Olivers program done from Southend pier and he and Jimmy were looking into the issue of "spent grain" from the boom in micro breweries - even a small one can produce more than 2 tonnes per week.

Spent grain is that's grain been used to make beer, and afterwards is just treated as waste normally going to landfill or occasionally farmers cattle.

Well 2 enterprising guys with a brewery have managed to turn it into FLOUR, which isn't quite as simple as that sounds.

A bonus of doing this is that the flour retains the flavour of the beer made from it, and making some items from flour like pasta, pie pastry and bread proved the flavour transferred.

For you master bakers - might be worth looking into.

Apparently especially good for making *ahem* beer batter.

 

[Simon_M]

Here's two loaves of bread I made earlier (UKWorkshop eat your heart out).

NB the loaf on the the LHS is white (with 10% brown flour - needs must) and on the RHS is a medium 100% wholemeal. The wholemeal loaf stands taller than the white one and is a slight "improvement" too. Most recipes will make a bigger white loaf using the same quantity of ingredients compared to a smaller wholemeal one and that's generally my experience too. The difference here, is that the white one is using a "quick" recipe (2 hours vs 4 hours) and the wholemeal is a "normal" (5 hours vs 3 hours) recipe, so waiting yields a better result.

I use a Panasonic Breadmaker (bought from Amazon recently for about £119). Before that, I had an Aldi bread maker which eventually failed - in the end it cost nothing although I bought it on promotion for £40. I used to think that all breadmakers were essentially the same however I now realise that there are small differences. They are like small imported lathes/bandsaws etc. all look very similar but there are small differences.

The Aldi was pretty decent and probably much like any other. Panasonic is well known (and may have been one of the first to "popularise" making bread with a machine e.g. about my level of cooking). When did you last say "I cooked the Sunday roast in my 'Bosch' oven" - it really doesn't matter - the Panasonic is much quieter.

The Aldi one was "free" because after 3 months, I had trouble with the paddle being a bit stiff to rotate by hand. The Help Line won't give any advice that's not in the manual, but would only offer a complete refund (and you get to keep the product) because they don't keep any spares. (Like the Aldi's bandsaw that's made by Scheppach)? I discovered that the paddle "eases" easily with 5 minute soak with washing up liquid in the bowl - about a week later!

FWIW the Panasonic machines are not all the same. As well as having a Rye paddle or a nut dispenser (even a separate yeast dispenser on some other models) there are other differences. Mine monitors the ambient temperature as well as the temperature of the bowl and varies the time of the individual steps(mid range) - but the total time is always the same specified time with a countdown to when it's done. So waiting longer yields a better result (for me). Mine leaves a hole in the bottom from the paddle - but I don't mind. The included Panasonic recipe booklet is a good source of dozens (50+) recipes - a book I also have (Linda Collister), was a gift and hasn't been used much.

The machine makes M, L and XL loaves and which I think of as small, medium and large. When cool, they get sliced and put in the freezer in bags. I use dried yeast (Allinsons) from a tin and I don't use sachet because they cost more and most recipe's want 3/4, 1 or 1 1/4 teaspoons of dried yeast depending on the size vs 7g packets. I generally only use strong flour from the supermarket - what's on offer. Stats: White is 560g and Wholemeal 620g and both are "M" loaves with same quantities of ingredients but with 20ml (20g) more water specified for the Wholemeal recipe.

I also have circular saw for bread (it's real purpose is for slicing meats) and I'm looking for my first bandsaw for bread! (homer)

 

[Steve Maskery]

I suspect that the innards are pretty much the same across the range. They can't possible recreate different machines from scratch for every model (though I take the point about things like nut dispensers).

I once worked with a guy who used to work for a company that made VCR recorders (1980s). He said that the boards inside were all the same, except that some of them had certain functions disabled and were sold as the entry-level models. The top end ones were the identical electronics but without the disabling. Go figure.

 

[Dibs-h]

FWIW the Panasonic machines are not all the same. As well as having a Rye paddle or a nut dispenser (even a separate yeast dispenser on some other models) there are other differences. Mine monitors the ambient temperature as well as the temperature of the bowl and varies the time of the individual steps(mid range) - but the total time is always the same specified time with a countdown to when it's done.

Cheers for the pics Simon. Which model do you have?

Cheers

Dibs

 

[sunnybob]

Had to get the thing out the cupboard to see the model;
its an SD 255, with the little hatch that allows you to put raisins or chocolate chips in just before the final mix.
have to admit though that I rarely use that feature.
I had pizza for tea, store bought, nowhere near as nice as home made. :roll:

 

[thick_mike]

I buy the tins of Allison’s dried yeast and once opened, I keep it in the fridge. Not sure if it prolongs the life, but it lasts well. It takes a couple of months for me to get through a whole tin.

Also, measure flour/water by mass (grammes), not volume. It’s far more accurate and easier.

 

[Selwyn]

On the subject of breadmaking - last night I saw a re-run of Jamie Olivers program done from Southend pier and he and Jimmy were looking into the issue of "spent grain" from the boom in micro breweries - even a small one can produce more than 2 tonnes per week.

Spent grain is that's grain been used to make beer, and afterwards is just treated as waste normally going to landfill or occasionally farmers cattle.

Well 2 enterprising guys with a brewery have managed to turn it into FLOUR, which isn't quite as simple as that sounds.

A bonus of doing this is that the flour retains the flavour of the beer made from it, and making some items from flour like pasta, pie pastry and bread proved the flavour transferred.

For you master bakers - might be worth looking into.

Apparently especially good for making *ahem* beer batter.

Most brewers grain goes to cattle. V little to landfill - its worth something as stock feed

 

[eezageeza]

Yet another +1 for the Panasonic machine. We make bread in ours 2 - 3 times a week, and haven't eaten shop-bought since we bought it.

Duchy organic flour (from Waitrose) is expensive, but we've found it to be the best granary flour around; our go-to loaf is 2/3rds duchy granary, 1/3 wholemeal.

We use Allinson dried yeast, but do find it ages poorly - you can tell when you're getting near the end of the tin because the bread rises less well.

The Panasonic nut / fruit dispenser is worth paying extra for (if you like fruit bread!) and the recipes in the supplied book will keep you entertained (and fed) for ages.

 

[Trevanion]

Spent grain is that's grain been used to make beer, and afterwards is just treated as waste normally going to landfill or occasionally farmers cattle.

Most brewers grain goes to cattle. V little to landfill - its worth something as stock feed

What a lovely smell when it gets dropped off for the stock! =D> The smell sometimes wafts into the workshop and it's great. Cows love it too I suppose...

Although going home stinking of beer after the smell has absorbed into the clothes isn't always great! Better than Slurry though! :lol:

 

[Simon_M]

Cheers for the pics Simon. Which model do you have?

I have the Panasonic SD-2511W Multi-Function Bread Maker. There are three very similar versions of the white unit and it's worth checking out the differences. There is also black and stainless steel versions. (homer)

This model is the first one to mention the ambient temperature sensor - but they may all have one. I did find a chart somewhere before I bought one, that compared all the features. I have not had a single batch that hasn't worked out, it's very quiet so timer overnight is OK and it's used almost everyday.

There is also a version without the seed dispenser (but you can add the seeds when it beeps and it will eventually carry on by itself) and they share the same manual. It's very unlikely that you couldn't make all the recipes in all the machines (get a Rye paddle if required).

There is also a Rye paddle to complement the first one (looks like a key) and a very small sourdough measure and a 2nd measuring container and lids. The paddle has a design that locks it on when it rotates. When the bread is finished, the paddle is always retained in the bowl - so you don't need to retrieve it from the bread or accidentally slice into it etc.

With this machine, you put the yeast in first and it's covered by the flour before you add water and press "go". On other machines you add the yeast last to keep it separate. The ingredients are listed using a measure for yeast, salt and sugar (which is very accurate because not much is required). The water measure is very accurate although I usually weigh the water e.g. 300g for 300ml. My final check is the total weight including the bowl and paddle with all ingredients - then it's "chocks away, chaps".

 

[Lons]

Another Panasonic user, we have an SD255 and on our second machine, 1st lasted 10 years.
We don't use it as much these days as the missus has been on a diet since January and I don't want to eat her share as well as mine.

Wife swears by Allinsons flour and dried yeast but you can't keepeither too long without affecting bread quality. I thought it was broken one morning when the bread resembled a pancake, turns out some eegit had fogotten to add the yeast.

what I like best is setting it up to cook overnight and coming down to the smell of freshly baked bread, doesn't half make the dog drool though.

Just one thing, the machines are damn noisy when mixing!

 

[John Brown]

I suspect that the innards are pretty much the same across the range. They can't possible recreate different machines from scratch for every model (though I take the point about things like nut dispensers).

I once worked with a guy who used to work for a company that made VCR recorders (1980s). He said that the boards inside were all the same, except that some of them had certain functions disabled and were sold as the entry-level models. The top end ones were the identical electronics but without the disabling. Go figure.

That was certainly the case with digital camcorders from Sony, Canon, and Panasonic IIRC. Recording from a digital input was disabled on the cheaper models, but could be enabled if you knew how. I think it's a fairly common thing. Remember the Tesla that were "upgraded" mileage wise a few years back, when folks in the US were fleeing hurricanes/earthquakes/forest fires? Can't remember which right now...

It's also true that certain Japanese video game producers used to release "pirate" copies of PCBS at lower prices to gain market foothold.
And companies like Intel and AMD use to leak grey market CPUS for similar reasons.

Or so I've been told. I know the camcorder stuff is true from personal experience.

 

[rafezetter]

On the subject of breadmaking - last night I saw a re-run of Jamie Olivers program done from Southend pier and he and Jimmy were looking into the issue of "spent grain" from the boom in micro breweries - even a small one can produce more than 2 tonnes per week.

Spent grain is that's grain been used to make beer, and afterwards is just treated as waste normally going to landfill or occasionally farmers cattle.

Well 2 enterprising guys with a brewery have managed to turn it into FLOUR, which isn't quite as simple as that sounds.

A bonus of doing this is that the flour retains the flavour of the beer made from it, and making some items from flour like pasta, pie pastry and bread proved the flavour transferred.

For you master bakers - might be worth looking into.

Apparently especially good for making *ahem* beer batter.

Most brewers grain goes to cattle. V little to landfill - its worth something as stock feed

Jamie and Jimmy did some research on this as you would expect and said that as quite a few microbreweries (which is what I'm talking about, not big firms who are without the capacity to transport it themselves) are in cities rather than closer to the source of grain in the countryside, selling it to farmers becomes problematic as it goes mouldy very quickly.

I just though ppl talking about bread might be interested in this rather unique flour, if they hadn't heard of it *shrug*.

 

[Inspector]

I had a genaric bread maker that I used a lot when I was single. The new spouse didn't like it and wouldn't use it nor let me. She used her KitchenAid mixer with a dough hook and made great bread. The bread maker got left behind when we moved. Now she won't make bread because she is on a low carb kick. I wish we kept it.

What I don't understand why you guys have any bread past the next morning? :? I ate the whole loaf by myself and if I treat myself to a fresh loaf at the bakery now it's gone in 24 hours too. =P~

My favourite book is Bread & Bread Machines by Christine Ingram and Jenni Shapter Published by Hermes House in London. ISBN 1-84477-319-1 Has both bread machine and oven recipes.

Pete

 

[gog64]

Another Panasonic fan here (after trying other brands). We’ve got a large and hungry family, so the breadmaker is used most days, often twice a day at the weekend. The last one lasted for at least 5 years, current one is 3 ish and still going strong.

On the flour & yeast, it really does make all the difference what you use (and there is a big difference in prices). We’ve settled on the Dove’s Farm organic (obviously the strong bread flour), bought from their online shop. Middle of the road price, consistent high quality.

As mentioned, you can make different size loaves, but of course you are varying the height, so the largest is a bit big for most toasters (I just use the grill). Next you get sucked into the search for the perfect toaster