woodbloke
Established Member
I had that for Christmas from SWIMBO...very nice 8) 8) - Robwizer":3gesxsgq said:
Workshop Heaven Passaround
- Thread starter matthewwh
- Start date
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jimi43
Established Member
I want to protest that I get to be after Tom and his weedy whacks with the chisel...!!!!
I'll probably end up with a blinkin' screwdriver tip to cut mortices by the time I get it passed to me!
Only joshing with ya mate....how are you feeling?
Jim
I'll probably end up with a blinkin' screwdriver tip to cut mortices by the time I get it passed to me!
Only joshing with ya mate....how are you feeling?
Jim
jlawrence
Established Member
Just to let everyone know this passaround has arrived with me this morning.
First impressions:
dovetails marker: as Tom says there's not a lot you can say about these - yet it's a marker.
bevel gauge: it is quite small but I could see some applications when making small boxes.
flush saw: about half the length of mine, again I think it'll be useful making boxes. Cuts well and no marks. I can certainly see a use for one this size.
spokeshave - at least that's what I think it is. Never used one of these so it'll be interesting to see what it does.
mortice chisel: Never used one of these.
rasp: never used one of these but might see if it'd be any use for making knobs for small drawers.
First impressions:
dovetails marker: as Tom says there's not a lot you can say about these - yet it's a marker.
bevel gauge: it is quite small but I could see some applications when making small boxes.
flush saw: about half the length of mine, again I think it'll be useful making boxes. Cuts well and no marks. I can certainly see a use for one this size.
spokeshave - at least that's what I think it is. Never used one of these so it'll be interesting to see what it does.
mortice chisel: Never used one of these.
rasp: never used one of these
but might see if it'd be any use for making knobs for small drawers.
Never got round to posting my opinion on this stuff before sending them off to Jon, so now is as good a time as any.
TBH the Kell stuff left me largely unimpressed. Beautiful to look at and obviously well made neither felt comfortable in the hand to me. The large thumbscrew on the bevel gauge felt particularly out of place, and the dovetail marker was just a little clunky fro it's small size to get a good grip on (I'm a bit hamfisted though, I'm sure it will find a place in many tool cupboards).
The flushcut saw was nicely proportioned, cut very well and was razor sharp like all the Japanese style saws I have tried. The set was on the wrong side for me though, being right handed this meant I had to cut right to left, i.e. towards my free hand. I normally I like to place a finger or two on top of the blade to keep it flush to the workpiece, which in this instance I couldn't do. It wasn't marked up as L or R handed so I'm assuming they're all like this. If I'm going to be especially picky I also though the rivets in the handle would have benefitted from being flush rather than slightly proud of the wood.
I didn't try the mortice chisel, they're not my thing anyway but if they were I wouldn't be buying any based on this one. The handle wasn't on quite straight (to my eye at least), and the grinding was shocking - every surface was rounded, by the look of it by being linished - badly. The shoulder on the tang seemed rather unsubstantial to me, leaving a lot of endgrain exposed within the weak looking ferrule, and I wouldn't have felt very confident of it surviving much pounding. A resounding miss IMO.
The Boggs copy spokeshave however was an absolute delight. Lovely to behold and very very comfortable to hold and use, despite the adjustment requiring a bit of practice to get the hang of. Mine are Veritas with the adjustment screws so this was a bit of a learning curve for me, but it didn't take long and I soon got the hang of setting the blade slightly skewed and adjusting the depth of cut by using a different part of the blade. The blade took a keen edge, and in the small use I put it to seemed to hold it extremely well. I liked this a lot, so much in fact that if they'd been around 12 months ago Rob Lee wouldn't have got a look in :wink:
To be honest, the reason it is so good is the only problem I have with this, and that is the fact that it is clearly a direct copy of what is possibly the best 'shave on the market today. A very good copy, to be sure, and at a price not to be sniffed at, but a copy nonetheless. I'm not sure how I feel about this. On the one hand the performance/price ratio makes it very attractive indeed, and I've no doubt Matthew will sell them by the shedload, but ethically.....hmmm :? I think it sails pretty close to the wind, I have to ask myself how I would feel if Clifton (of whose kit I am a stalwart fan) went to the wall because a chinese copy at half the price were to suddenly be available. The answer, I fear, is "not very".
TBH the Kell stuff left me largely unimpressed. Beautiful to look at and obviously well made neither felt comfortable in the hand to me. The large thumbscrew on the bevel gauge felt particularly out of place, and the dovetail marker was just a little clunky fro it's small size to get a good grip on (I'm a bit hamfisted though, I'm sure it will find a place in many tool cupboards).
The flushcut saw was nicely proportioned, cut very well and was razor sharp like all the Japanese style saws I have tried. The set was on the wrong side for me though, being right handed this meant I had to cut right to left, i.e. towards my free hand. I normally I like to place a finger or two on top of the blade to keep it flush to the workpiece, which in this instance I couldn't do. It wasn't marked up as L or R handed so I'm assuming they're all like this. If I'm going to be especially picky I also though the rivets in the handle would have benefitted from being flush rather than slightly proud of the wood.
I didn't try the mortice chisel, they're not my thing anyway but if they were I wouldn't be buying any based on this one. The handle wasn't on quite straight (to my eye at least), and the grinding was shocking - every surface was rounded, by the look of it by being linished - badly. The shoulder on the tang seemed rather unsubstantial to me, leaving a lot of endgrain exposed within the weak looking ferrule, and I wouldn't have felt very confident of it surviving much pounding. A resounding miss IMO.
The Boggs copy spokeshave however was an absolute delight. Lovely to behold and very very comfortable to hold and use, despite the adjustment requiring a bit of practice to get the hang of. Mine are Veritas with the adjustment screws so this was a bit of a learning curve for me, but it didn't take long and I soon got the hang of setting the blade slightly skewed and adjusting the depth of cut by using a different part of the blade. The blade took a keen edge, and in the small use I put it to seemed to hold it extremely well. I liked this a lot, so much in fact that if they'd been around 12 months ago Rob Lee wouldn't have got a look in :wink:
To be honest, the reason it is so good is the only problem I have with this, and that is the fact that it is clearly a direct copy of what is possibly the best 'shave on the market today. A very good copy, to be sure, and at a price not to be sniffed at, but a copy nonetheless. I'm not sure how I feel about this. On the one hand the performance/price ratio makes it very attractive indeed, and I've no doubt Matthew will sell them by the shedload, but ethically.....hmmm :? I think it sails pretty close to the wind, I have to ask myself how I would feel if Clifton (of whose kit I am a stalwart fan) went to the wall because a chinese copy at half the price were to suddenly be available. The answer, I fear, is "not very".
wizer":1ievge7p said:Spokeshave? There may have been a mix up Jon, that wasn't in this passaround #-o Are you talking about one of these:
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO....
Oh bugger, please don't say I got the stuff mixed up
:roll: Just read the first page and realized it is so, my bad. I grabbed all the stuff off Tom's bench while he was out of action and took too much. Oh well at least I said nice things about it.
wizer
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No worries. Mark. My fault for having faulty apendics
The 'shave was just meant for my own personal fetish. .and I must get around to posting my review on it.
Jon, if you can send the 'shave back to WH and I'll reimburse you for the cost.
The 'shave was just meant for my own personal fetish.
.and I must get around to posting my review on it.Jon, if you can send the 'shave back to WH and I'll reimburse you for the cost.
jimi43
Established Member
That is absolutely HILARIOUS Tom/Jon....you guys made my day!!
HEY! So do I get to review the spokeshave??? :wink:
Jim
HEY! So do I get to review the spokeshave??? :wink:
Jim
jlawrence
Established Member
ROFLMAO.
I didn't think that it was meant to be in there.
Tom, No worries. I'll send it back to Matthew. No need to worry about reimbursing. It'll be interesting to see what it does - now I'll have to look up what I'm supposed to use one for
I didn't think that it was meant to be in there.
Tom, No worries. I'll send it back to Matthew. No need to worry about reimbursing. It'll be interesting to see what it does - now I'll have to look up what I'm supposed to use one for
Auguste Gusteau
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matthewwh":2g4y1vug said:
It come from a famous north-american magazine editor and blogger.
devonwoody
Established Member
Spokeshave, funny I thought, thanks guys for returning my sanity. :wink:
jlawrence
Established Member
just to let you know this passaround is on it's way to head clansman
head clansman
Established Member
hi all
Yep i received it and tried out (most) items in the box , have pm'd localoak just waiting for his address to arrive before sending it on .
In the mean time here is MHO, In the box is a jumble of good and bad, let get the bad out of the way first .
Well the most disappointing thing I found was the size of some of the tools , but the most disappointing one was the Mortice chisel , its quality I found to be below standard , the finish to the steel blade was poor and uneven , the wrong type of handle ( not as i remember them) not enough beef for the type of work it's designed to do , plus the handle out of line with the blade and the brass ferrel very poor quality .
THATS THAT OUT THE WAY .
NOW THE GOOD
Now the adjustable bevel is a good very high quality tool , it only let down is it size i feel it should be about 100 percent bigger , however i think there is a niche for it as it is for say something along the line of perhaps a box maker etc .
Dovetail marker it's much the same here as well lovely high quality tool but two small, about 50 percent bigger would have been better .
Now the flush cutting saw I admit I never tried it, but i can see a need for one of these In the not to distant future ( matthew are these made sightly bigger ?) it does have a nice flexible blade with very very fine teeth which i feel will do a lovely neat job , but again i felt it needs to be about 50 percent longer in the blade.
NOW THE VERY BEST
Now I saved the best till last, ahhhh the rasp what a lovely tool you did this on purpose mate, you must have guested that i was to be making some infill planes soon and this tool when tried out is the bees knees just the tools i will be needing for those to the finishings of the shaping of the totes and handles plus the final touches before sanding , really a treat to use, I will be placing an order in the next few days for these , and possible the saw as well .
CONCULSION
all in all some really nice quality tools apart from some of there sizes but with the exception of the mortice chisel quality .
Well these are my views, this only leaves me to say, matthew thankyou for including me in the passaround I have really enjoyed taking part in it. I look forwards to the next one . hc
ps have now heard from toby (LocalOak ) matthews tools all went of in the post ealier today 2/3/2010 .
Yep i received it and tried out (most) items in the box , have pm'd localoak just waiting for his address to arrive before sending it on .
In the mean time here is MHO, In the box is a jumble of good and bad, let get the bad out of the way first .
Well the most disappointing thing I found was the size of some of the tools , but the most disappointing one was the Mortice chisel , its quality I found to be below standard , the finish to the steel blade was poor and uneven , the wrong type of handle ( not as i remember them) not enough beef for the type of work it's designed to do , plus the handle out of line with the blade and the brass ferrel very poor quality .
THATS THAT OUT THE WAY .
NOW THE GOOD
Now the adjustable bevel is a good very high quality tool , it only let down is it size i feel it should be about 100 percent bigger , however i think there is a niche for it as it is for say something along the line of perhaps a box maker etc .
Dovetail marker it's much the same here as well lovely high quality tool but two small, about 50 percent bigger would have been better .
Now the flush cutting saw I admit I never tried it, but i can see a need for one of these In the not to distant future ( matthew are these made sightly bigger ?) it does have a nice flexible blade with very very fine teeth which i feel will do a lovely neat job , but again i felt it needs to be about 50 percent longer in the blade.
NOW THE VERY BEST
Now I saved the best till last, ahhhh the rasp what a lovely tool you did this on purpose mate, you must have guested that i was to be making some infill planes soon and this tool when tried out is the bees knees just the tools i will be needing for those to the finishings of the shaping of the totes and handles plus the final touches before sanding , really a treat to use, I will be placing an order in the next few days for these , and possible the saw as well .
CONCULSION
all in all some really nice quality tools apart from some of there sizes but with the exception of the mortice chisel quality .
Well these are my views, this only leaves me to say, matthew thankyou for including me in the passaround I have really enjoyed taking part in it. I look forwards to the next one . hc
ps have now heard from toby (LocalOak ) matthews tools all went of in the post ealier today 2/3/2010 .
LocalOak
Established Member
Have arrived safe and sound, sorry should have said so earlier
toby
toby
ceparkinson9
Member
is it to late to join
charles
charles
LocalOak
Established Member
A quick review before I send it on.
OK, this is my first passaround and I am pretty much a novice woodworker, but here's my opinion on this one.
1. The dovetail marker - Shiny! Marks up dovetails, feels solid, is accurate to a much higher tolerance than I can measure. Err. that's it. If I wanted a dovetail marker I'd be happy with this one.
2. The adjustable bevel. Pretty much the same as the dovetail marker, well made, solid, elegant and nice to have. Though I tend to echo HC's comment that it's a bit small, a larger tool can be used to mark up small things (on the whole) but not vice versa. Again, a very nice tool and not much more I can say on it.
3. The mortice chisel. Nice piece of steel that took an edge pretty easily and stayed sharp for the relatively small amount of abuse I gave it. I have not used a mortice chisel before and did like the fact that I could lever out big chips from a mortise confident that the tool would take it. So I've learnt a bit about mortise chisels...
I took an offcut of kiln dried oak and just cut a mortise in it. It was quick and easy and I can see the difference a dedicated mortise chisel will make for this job. It does make me want a set and this one seems to be a good tool. [edit] NB, I don't have HC's expertise with tools and based my review on how it felt for me to use it. I bow to his knowledge on the quality of the build [edit] My only concern was that the handle felt a little small, I have relatively small hands and was concerned that I could grasp virtually all the handle in my hand. I suspect it would disappear into the paws of anyone with larger hands, and that could mean it's tricky to use.
I then took a piece of 10mm oak dowel and drove it into the mortise so I could try out the flushcut saw.
4. The flushcut saw. I was surprised at quite how delicate this tool was and was initially rather hesitant using at as a result. But I found as soon as I started using it you could saw quite vigorously and it went through the oak dowel effortlessly. I wouldn't mind one of these in my tool kit but for me it would be a bit of a luxury (no obstacle to the slope of course :lol and there are other things higher up my list. It did leave a very nice finish and didn't touch the planed surface around the dowel. Pretty impressed with it actually.
5. The cabinet rasp. I've never really seen the need for a rasp before, have only used one occasionally. However, I now realise that I wasn't using a proper rasp, I was using an ikea cheese grater on a stick. I tried shaping a bit of reclaimed oak floorboard, 25mm thick and don't know how old but certainly very well seasoned. It cut it swiftly, cleanly and controllably. I was very impressed and can now start to see a lot more places where I could use this. The thing that impressed me the most was the speed of cut, it just zipped through the wood. I'd like a set please.
Thank you Matthew and I'll be sending this lot on as soon as I can get to a post office.
Toby
OK, this is my first passaround and I am pretty much a novice woodworker, but here's my opinion on this one.
1. The dovetail marker - Shiny! Marks up dovetails, feels solid, is accurate to a much higher tolerance than I can measure. Err. that's it. If I wanted a dovetail marker I'd be happy with this one.
2. The adjustable bevel. Pretty much the same as the dovetail marker, well made, solid, elegant and nice to have. Though I tend to echo HC's comment that it's a bit small, a larger tool can be used to mark up small things (on the whole) but not vice versa. Again, a very nice tool and not much more I can say on it.
3. The mortice chisel. Nice piece of steel that took an edge pretty easily and stayed sharp for the relatively small amount of abuse I gave it. I have not used a mortice chisel before and did like the fact that I could lever out big chips from a mortise confident that the tool would take it. So I've learnt a bit about mortise chisels...
I took an offcut of kiln dried oak and just cut a mortise in it. It was quick and easy and I can see the difference a dedicated mortise chisel will make for this job. It does make me want a set and this one seems to be a good tool. [edit] NB, I don't have HC's expertise with tools and based my review on how it felt for me to use it. I bow to his knowledge on the quality of the build [edit] My only concern was that the handle felt a little small, I have relatively small hands and was concerned that I could grasp virtually all the handle in my hand. I suspect it would disappear into the paws of anyone with larger hands, and that could mean it's tricky to use.
I then took a piece of 10mm oak dowel and drove it into the mortise so I could try out the flushcut saw.
4. The flushcut saw. I was surprised at quite how delicate this tool was and was initially rather hesitant using at as a result. But I found as soon as I started using it you could saw quite vigorously and it went through the oak dowel effortlessly. I wouldn't mind one of these in my tool kit but for me it would be a bit of a luxury (no obstacle to the slope of course :lol
and there are other things higher up my list. It did leave a very nice finish and didn't touch the planed surface around the dowel. Pretty impressed with it actually.5. The cabinet rasp. I've never really seen the need for a rasp before, have only used one occasionally. However, I now realise that I wasn't using a proper rasp, I was using an ikea cheese grater on a stick. I tried shaping a bit of reclaimed oak floorboard, 25mm thick and don't know how old but certainly very well seasoned. It cut it swiftly, cleanly and controllably. I was very impressed and can now start to see a lot more places where I could use this. The thing that impressed me the most was the speed of cut, it just zipped through the wood. I'd like a set please.
Thank you Matthew and I'll be sending this lot on as soon as I can get to a post office.
Toby
TobyB
Established Member
Interesting to see the real things after the reviews. Tried to approach them with a completely open mind (empty is fairly normal for me really) ... and I can't claim that much experience to base opinions on ... but, here goes ...
Flush saw. Felt really flimsy and fragile. worked really well. Probably better than the larger Veritas item I have - more delicate, and might have conformed better to the curves of the moulded stool seat I last used one of these in anger on when trimming the wedged legs off. But I might have broken it? If I didn't have one already, might buy this. Not yet convinced myself I need both ... but early days!
Dovetail and Adjustable bevel. Nicely made bits of brass. Sure they are good tools. Seemed very small. If I only/mainly made (or wanted to make, to be more realistic) smallish things like jewellery boxes they'd probably be great. Think I can manage without for now ...
Mortice Chisel. Confess I didn't use this ... but only because I have been using another (slightly larger at 8 mm) one from a set of 4 I bought off Matthew at the beginning of the year. And unlike other posters, I've been really impressed by my tools ... never properly cut mortices before ... made a table (pictures in Projects) and pleased with results as a first try. Having read Jeff Gormans pages (ref'd in current "mortice help" thread), done even better. I liked the size and feel of the handle on mine, and it helped me accurately line up the chisel for successive cuts back and forth, in my hands. I think the pass-around item might be a pre-production model, or has suffered in resharpening, as the geometry (I now understand thanks to Jeff) and edges are less crisp than my own set. I'm very impressed with my tools - don't think the pass-around model does Matthews stock justice ...
Rasp. Like others I'm afraid ... I've played with rasps (got a couple) and thought they were rubbish tools ... but ... a bit like only having used a sureform or a cheap'n'nasty plane ... then you use a decent (sadly expensive) plane and you think "wow! " ... well this rasp was similarly impressive. I don't think I need one at the moment (what has "need" got to do with it some of you will be asking, isn't "want" the word?) ... but I'm realising that those references to Auriou (and now Bahco?) tools are completely different beasts. If I decided I want to make mandolins or any similar scrolls etc, I'll be after these ... I know a set of carving chisels will do much the same ... but ...
So ... I'll be passing the parcel on next week - tube loaded but not sealed or addressed yet ...
Thanks Matthew - enjoyed playing with the toys!
Flush saw. Felt really flimsy and fragile. worked really well. Probably better than the larger Veritas item I have - more delicate, and might have conformed better to the curves of the moulded stool seat I last used one of these in anger on when trimming the wedged legs off. But I might have broken it? If I didn't have one already, might buy this. Not yet convinced myself I need both ... but early days!
Dovetail and Adjustable bevel. Nicely made bits of brass. Sure they are good tools. Seemed very small. If I only/mainly made (or wanted to make, to be more realistic) smallish things like jewellery boxes they'd probably be great. Think I can manage without for now ...
Mortice Chisel. Confess I didn't use this ... but only because I have been using another (slightly larger at 8 mm) one from a set of 4 I bought off Matthew at the beginning of the year. And unlike other posters, I've been really impressed by my tools ... never properly cut mortices before ... made a table (pictures in Projects) and pleased with results as a first try. Having read Jeff Gormans pages (ref'd in current "mortice help" thread), done even better. I liked the size and feel of the handle on mine, and it helped me accurately line up the chisel for successive cuts back and forth, in my hands. I think the pass-around item might be a pre-production model, or has suffered in resharpening, as the geometry (I now understand thanks to Jeff) and edges are less crisp than my own set. I'm very impressed with my tools - don't think the pass-around model does Matthews stock justice ...
Rasp. Like others I'm afraid ... I've played with rasps (got a couple) and thought they were rubbish tools ... but ... a bit like only having used a sureform or a cheap'n'nasty plane ... then you use a decent (sadly expensive) plane and you think "wow! " ... well this rasp was similarly impressive. I don't think I need one at the moment (what has "need" got to do with it some of you will be asking, isn't "want" the word?) ... but I'm realising that those references to Auriou (and now Bahco?) tools are completely different beasts. If I decided I want to make mandolins or any similar scrolls etc, I'll be after these ... I know a set of carving chisels will do much the same ... but ...
So ... I'll be passing the parcel on next week - tube loaded but not sealed or addressed yet ...
Thanks Matthew - enjoyed playing with the toys!
jimi43
Established Member
Tube received Chez Jimi.
I have to go to work at 3pm so will review over the weekend and post some thoughts....
First impressions...couldn't wait to test out the rasp....seems like something I would buy...more delicate that my monster blunt one or my neighbours large one.....could be just what I need!
Bevel...nice but whilst the build is good...the tightening is not adequate.
Chisel...mmm...I have nicely sharpened old ones and this one looks no different...tests will tell.
Flush saw...appears to have a kerf.....mmmm need to test that as I thought it should not have ANY kerf.....seems very sharp though...like a tiny clone of my bigger Japanese Ryoba....
Later guys and gals.
Jim
I have to go to work at 3pm so will review over the weekend and post some thoughts....
First impressions...couldn't wait to test out the rasp....seems like something I would buy...more delicate that my monster blunt one or my neighbours large one.....could be just what I need!
Bevel...nice but whilst the build is good...the tightening is not adequate.
Chisel...mmm...I have nicely sharpened old ones and this one looks no different...tests will tell.
Flush saw...appears to have a kerf.....mmmm need to test that as I thought it should not have ANY kerf.....seems very sharp though...like a tiny clone of my bigger Japanese Ryoba....
Later guys and gals.
Jim
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