Who is in and who is out?

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stuartpaul":3q2x92vt said:
And the arrse falls out of the pound

see thats what happens when the greedy bankers work through the night to manipulate it to an all time high for 2016 spreading the word that their secret polls have a remain win, then they suddenly realise they are wrong and sell like buggery, cheaper and cheaper, chances are they have made a killing ................ every thing can have a "spin".

What is done is done, Britain is a great country, the people are great, lets get on with it. The people have decided, full stop.
 
doctor Bob":6w497gaj said:
................ every thing can have a "spin".

What is done is done, Britain is a great country, the people are great, lets get on with it. The people have decided, full stop.

Ummm.... I think you'll find that the 'people' were in fact 52% of 72%.

Spin is a dreadful thing isn't it?! :D :D
 
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If its a leave, I hope David Cameron stays, it would be wrong for a change right now, stability is most important.
 
stuartpaul":1319mgen said:
doctor Bob":1319mgen said:
................ every thing can have a "spin".

What is done is done, Britain is a great country, the people are great, lets get on with it. The people have decided, full stop.

Ummm.... I think you'll find that the 'people' were in fact 52% of 72%.

Spin is a dreadful thing isn't it?! :D :D

The "people" were 100% of 100% - everyone had the chance to vote and some didn't. They don't count. It doesn't mean they agree with the status quo ante, it means they are happy to go with the tide ... otherwise they'd vote, wouldn't they? :D
 
doctor Bob":3td5ny2d said:
stuartpaul":3td5ny2d said:
And the arrse falls out of the pound

What is done is done, Britain is a great country, the people are great, lets get on with it. The people have decided, full stop.

I have to agree. Whichever way we voted, suck up the result if you have to, and let's get together and and get on with mending whatever might have been broken. Whichever way individuals think, Britain is still Great. It's up to us to make it Greater.
 
Well I voted and now all I can do is hope that Cameron doesn't enforce it.

It seems a shame that, going by turnout demographics, the majority of leave voters won't have to live with the results of the decision for as long as their children or grandchildren.

Sent from my LG-H815 using Tapatalk
 
Sorry Rhoss, whilst you might be correct, I can't really see it. It's usually the case that instability needs change, to steady the figurative ship. And I have literally steadied enough ships in my time, by changing course; usually in midstream.
 
Du you have some extra space up in Scotland for a few million Swedish and Finnish immigrants who want to leave the EU but aren't allowed to bring our countries with us?......;-)
I think EU was a very good idea from the beginning but over time it all turned into a bureaucratic empire ruled by a small elite without democratic control and without any considerations for ordinary people's lives.
There are two ways to fix this problem. Reform EU completely or dismantle it. The ultimately best choice from a Finnish point of wiew would have been to reform the EU completely from the bottom up into a democratic people's union. After you Brits deciced to leave us it is too late for that choice because nobody else is allowed to spearhead such a project.
There is a great risk is that now when the only country where open critisim is allowed by the establisment is leaving us the rest of EU will come even closer to one state governed by an elite completely disconnected from the people. A neoliberal undemocratic Fourth Reich.
I don't want to be a part of that. I want Finland to leave EU. That would be a second best choice.
 
... =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>
 

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I'll have to live with it Phil, a lot longer than you.

Perhaps 28% weren't happy to go with the flow, but rather felt that they were too daunted and uninformed to be responsible for such a decision. I'd bet that a similar proportion cast their vote based on an uneasiness about people from countries they don't know much about, and vague ideas about jobs that they overheard at the pub.

The campaigns were a shambles on both sides (I didn't even receive my 'impartial guide to voting, might reflect why my area's turnout was one of the worst in the country) and I think that even if it somehow does work out for the best, the last couple of months have been fairly shameful.
 
Personally, although I expected exactly this*, I don't think this is a good result for many reasons.

It's mainly because a referendum was not the right way to do this. Constitutionally, the UK parliament at Westminster is the expression of the sovereignty of the British people. We should have elected a pro-Brexit parliament, not had a referendum. This divides rather than unifies the country. Farage bears a heavy responsiblity, as he decided years ago that making UKIP electable at Westminster was not a priority. The electorate have had nowhere to turn to.

We know from many recent elections, national and local, that people are fed up with an elite making decisions for them. Many laws recently have been passed despite the population, not in expression of their will. Now we have what I believe will become a full-on constitutional crisis - democratically elected parliament versus a plebiscite.

I'm not fussing about Scotland - they'll grudgingly follow whoever funds their lifestyle (I'm part Scottish!). If the funding issue becomes centre stage, and the SNP have been at best disingenuous about this, we may look back on this as the SNP's high-water mark. Time will tell.

I am, however, worried about the return of extremism in Northern Ireland, and about a rush for the entrance at British borders. I'm not even sure we'll have a tough negotiation with the EU - they can't afford to be too nasty (although they'll certainly try!).

But shortly, France, Greece and other countries' elites will be facing the EU's real existential crisis. It has to be said that Britain hasn't caused it. The creation of a new oligarchy, bypassing of democracy and massive economic mismanagement have been the problems.

The euro has been the biggest dogmatic stupidity of all - (there are many contestants for that title!). It typifies the attitude of EU-crats - hang the common people, the Project will move forward. Remember: it's entirely your fault if you live in Greece or Spain and are aged under 25.

Greece in particular won't appreciate it if the EU puts extra tax on Intaglio printing presses.

The European peoples are now rejecting this worldview. We shouldn't be smug: we are just the first group to point at the emperor's nakedness. We have to leave, simply because the downside risks of staying are too enormous.

But make no mistake: the UK is in crisis. There isn't a party that really reflects the views of the people. That is clear now, more than it's ever been. I see no leaders now on the scene capable of uniting the country through this process. If history judges Boris and Nigel (and Cameron and Corbyn, and Milliband and ) harshly, it may seem unfair, but it will be justified.

Personally, I'm not proud of any of them.

E.

*rural areas and "urban poor" areas voting leave.
 
I bet that a similar proportion cast their vote based on what they heard from pro EU politicians, who told them all the good bits. Older people voted mostly out because they have seen what the EU has done and does - the young still regard it through rose coloured spectacles and think that it can be changed. It can't be - if it could be, this wouldn't have arisen. You are doing exactly what others who voted in are doing - saying that everyone who disagreed with you is an uninformed idiot.

"Perhaps 28% weren't happy to go with the flow, but rather felt that they were too daunted and uninformed to be responsible for such a decision."?
So therefore they were responsible for such a decision.
Edit - Incidentally, I agree with the Australian system - you have to turn up to vote but there is a box that doesn't commit you (or you could spoil a paper if it irritates you that much).
 
Incidentally - I disagree with everyone who votes Labour in a general election - does it make them uninformed idiots - does that work in the same way? Does that make them wrong?
 
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