looking for a chisel set, what should i get

[Reggie]

I've now done about 7 practice mortices, first one was junk, same as the 2nd (really dreadful bent chisel), didn't bother doing any more until I'd been given 7 random-ish be chisels by my dad and sharpened them. The next 5 mortices have gotten progressively better, with my technique getting better as I go along, I'm recognising how to hold the chisel correctly, staying within my lines and getting faster as I'm doing it. The only money I have spent on this is £11, for a honing guide, stone and oil kit. I still have a couple of things to pay attention to but overall I am happy with my progress so far, at this rate I can only see me buying expensive chisels out of desire rather than necessity. only 2 of the chisels are branded but 5.

I've also been messing around with the record no.4 smoothing plane, took it apart, got to grips with all the parts, learnt how to adjust it and have no issues with using it at all now, getting nice wide shavings, I'm able to know which way the grain goes, how to use that to my advantage and have managed to true up a couple of lengths of 3x3 pine that didn't have a 90degree angle between them.

Out of everything that I've learnt, I'd say the technique of using them has been learnt from video tutorials, everything else has been learnt from forum members. I basically decided that I would try and borrow as many tools as I could to try out first, along with asking as many relevant/stupid questions as possible, every single opinion is valid, even those with vested interests/obvious bias, it's down to you to filter the information from the motive.

Once I'd had some experience of using *any* tools then I had a basis to start making purchasing decisions on. My current purchasing decisions with regards to chisels is to buy a mallet and nothing else, for planes, I like the idea of a number 5 jack but I have proved that I don't necessarily need one just yet, so I will hold fire on that until absolutely necessary.

 

[tobytools]

I've now done about 7 practice mortices, first one was junk, same as the 2nd (really dreadful bent chisel), didn't bother doing any more until I'd been given 7 random-ish be chisels by my dad and sharpened them. The next 5 mortices have gotten progressively better, with my technique getting better as I go along, I'm recognising how to hold the chisel correctly, staying within my lines and getting faster as I'm doing it. The only money I have spent on this is £11, for a honing guide, stone and oil kit. I still have a couple of things to pay attention to but overall I am happy with my progress so far, at this rate I can only see me buying expensive chisels out of desire rather than necessity. only 2 of the chisels are branded but 5.

I've also been messing around with the record no.4 smoothing plane, took it apart, got to grips with all the parts, learnt how to adjust it and have no issues with using it at all now, getting nice wide shavings, I'm able to know which way the grain goes, how to use that to my advantage and have managed to true up a couple of lengths of 3x3 pine that didn't have a 90degree angle between them.

Out of everything that I've learnt, I'd say the technique of using them has been learnt from video tutorials, everything else has been learnt from forum members. I basically decided that I would try and borrow as many tools as I could to try out first, along with asking as many relevant/stupid questions as possible, every single opinion is valid, even those with vested interests/obvious bias, it's down to you to filter the information from the motive.

Once I'd had some experience of using *any* tools then I had a basis to start making purchasing decisions on. My current purchasing decisions with regards to chisels is to buy a mallet and nothing else, for planes, I like the idea of a number 5 jack but I have proved that I don't necessarily need one just yet, so I will hold fire on that until absolutely necessary.

smart idea, i should do same but i want it all, if i think ill need it i get it or if i see something i could use or try out ect ect i do so as, its better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it. good luck with your work
TT

 

[G S Haydon]

Reggie, I would really like to see you set up a blog. You write very well indeed and I'm sure Reggie's Woodwork Diary could prove to be a valuable recourse to people picking up tools for the first time.

 

[Reggie]

I think we all want everything we'll need Toby It's just identifying what's necessary and what is fluff. I'm not for one second suggesting that your chisel choices are fluff, chisels are good and necessary.

G S Haydon, http://randmfu.blogspot.co.uk/2013/08/i ... rking.html

It's a bit long but I think it pretty much sums up the last few months for me, no bench yet but I've learnt a lot, how the basic tools are used, marking up, sharpening, grain, mortices, tenons, power tools, fettling smoothing planes, sketchup, tons of stuff about routers and jigs, so much that I once I do get my bench built and the router table/fence setup that there really will be no stopping me

 

[dj.]

My current purchasing decisions with regards to chisels is to buy a mallet and nothing else,

Just get yourself some hardwood Reggie, Beech is good but most hardwoods will do, you can cut a mortise & use a No4 that covers most of what you need to know to make your own mallet. It`s so much more satisfying to work wood with tools you`ve made yourself & it`s all good practice.

Regards.


dj.

 

[G S Haydon]

Great stuff Reggie

 

[Reggie]

Too late Dj, I ordered the mallet on friday. I might still go ahead and make one though at some point in the future.

GS, thanks, I'll be writing up chisels and other stuff over time too, just thought I'd get my blog up to speed on what I've been doing to get where I'm at with the first post.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Make sure you soak your mallet in linseed for a few days before you use it.

 

[Reggie]

Awwww, come on, linseed oil, days....... The one bit of chisel research that eluded me was about hammers, typical, I knew I should've gone with the thor 710/712 or one of their deadblow hammers instead of a traditional mallet.

Phil, is the soaking process to add weight or protection or both?

 

[G S Haydon]

On mallets, I have often (nearly always) been a very bad man and used a claw hammer on my chisels. I used a mallet recently but I missed the sharp blow of a metal hammer. I have seen brass hammers but decided to buy a rawhide & copper headed hammer to try. I appreciate it's an automotive tool (at least I think it is) but it seems nicely weighted and offers that sharp blow I'm used to.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Awwww, come on, linseed oil, days....... The one bit of chisel research that eluded me was about hammers, typical, I knew I should've gone with the thor 710/712 or one of their deadblow hammers instead of a traditional mallet.

Phil, is the soaking process to add weight or protection or both?

Protection mainly, although it probably adds a little weight. It's probably insignificant, though. It soaks in quicker if warmed up (not over a flame!). I was lucky, I bought eight litres of good linseed at a car boot for £4, so if I know I'm not using wooden (handled) tools for a week or two for some reason, I tip it in a bucket with the tools and leave it.

 

[Reggie]

GS Haydon,I wasn't entirely convinced about buying a mallet, the thought of prepping a hammer for a few days seems wrong somehow :-D I caved in to parental pressure on that purchase

Phil, how much linseed oil is this hammer going to take do you think? Clearly I need it in a container large enough to take the mallet, I wonder if I could do something genius like put it all in a sealable food bag or something?

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I suppose you could use a bag, but if you find a container that the head of the mallet fits in quite closely, you shouldn't need much oil - it's an upfront expense, but you'll find other things to use the oil for afterwards. There's very little waste.

 

[Jacob]

A quick wipe over with linseed is enough?

Mallet - I made this one the other day , my bought beech one having split (but I've stuck it back together).
It's hedgerow ash. I cut a few bits a couple of years ago. It doesn't split if small enough diameter, left full length and dried slowly. Brilliant for tool handles of all sorts, long and short, from chisel to scythe. Comes in all sizes, usually straight grained, it even has a central hole (the pith) already in place.

No time to pull apart another of woodbrains' dense texts above but one thing stands out: the notion that a craftsman can't work with inferior tools.
This is nonsense and the complete opposite of the truth. A competent craftsman will not be fazed by a Chinese chisel or a second-rate plane. They would not hold up the job - except for the extra fiddling/sharpening time required at the start - but this usually does not need repeating and is an investment in itself.

It's the beginner who (is encouraged to believe he edit) needs the perfection outa the box; can't freehand at 30º but needs a jig and a flat plate, can't do a quick hone and needs expensive steel which will hold and edge longer, can't eyeball a line and needs a guide, can't sharpen a saw and needs disposable blades, can't do "the ruler trick" without a ruler (which ruler to buy? Starrett? What about getting a bit of steel machined to the "correct" thickness? etc) and so on (and on).

Incidentally if no-sharpen disposable blades are the point of Jap saws what is wrong with western hardpoint saws? They are a lot cheaper and work very well. Is it just a fashion thing?

The major selling point of the posh planes is not that "craftsmen" need them - it's that they are ***** proof (as near as you can get). Someone who can't mitre with an old 5 1/2 might just be able to do it with two opposite handed skew mitre panes (if he can afford them or can raise a mortgage). Someone who can't work an old 4 might be OK with an LV LA smoother, and so on.
This isn't a value judgement, just an observation. By all means buy the best you can afford.

 

[G S Haydon]

+1 on hardpoint disposable saws, super value and so sharp. Would not be without one

 

[Reggie]

That's a nice looking harry potter mallet Jacob, do you wave it around shouting 'fitogetherous' before you hit stuff with it? As for beginners needing perfection, I disagree, we just need a decent starting point to be able to judge whether its us or the tools.

I chose a guide because I don't have the time and energy to learn to do it by hand/eye quickly enough, I needed to use the chisels and getting them done by eye will be something for the future. I didn't chose expensive steel though, just borrowed some tools, I do see your point on craftsmen and tools though, once you know how to handle a tool, as long as the chisel isn't made of jelly, you should be able to knock a hole through wood, you might need to hit it harder or sharpen it more often but it shouldn't stop you making a hole. I think though that that is the crux for a lot of people, the time spent overcoming a tools weakness vs money spent buying a tool that is without deficiency in the first place.

As for saws, you seem stuck in your ways Jacob, which works for you and that's absolutely fine, however, for someone like myself who really doesn't care what the tool is as long as it does the job then the japanese saws are intriguing enough to give them a try. I don't know much about saws but I do know that the japanese flush saw gives a nice fine cut that requires little finishing, as opposed to the tenon saw I bought first, that was all I cared about.

I'm put off the hardpoint saws over here simply because of the poor marketing, far too many corny names like 'laser shark chubby cleaver saw', far too many garish colours and they seem more interested in making distinctive shaped handles to make them stand out, they're the wood working equivalent of toothpaste or washing powder.

With japanese saws the internet plays a big part, you can find out about products from all over the planet, see videos of how to use them and then order one, dropped straight to your doorstep, it's easy to try stuff out, so people do.

I think it's great myself, I love the idea of people like Jacob who are passing on old skills and tools to people like me, who are also gathering tools and knowledge from different cultures, a tradition that I'm sure has been going on for thousands of years, whenever those cultures have met, the difference is these days we don't have to jump on a ship and sail for 3 years to find that culture, we can access it in the blink of an eye.

 

[lanemaux]

Hi Reggie , just an aside on the subject of pull type saws. They need be neither Japanese nor expensive. I have an Irwin version which works well and cost me about 20 dollars Canuckian. It is filed rip on one side and crosscut on the other and while not a "traditional" model , it cuts beautifully. Easy to control , straight as can be and for me at least cutting pull stroke is very easy and relaxing. Re: chisels , got some plastic handled jobs from a yard sale , no name , no clue as to manufacturer and adequate for my needs 5 bucks for 8 of them . The steel looked good to my eye and I carry a small stone with me most of the time so a tryout told me they would do. A quick hone tells you a lot in a short time ,trust me. For me it is all about having fun... a "hobby" as it were. Not advice , just how I see things.

 

[MIGNAL]

I remember the time when Japanese saws suddenly became all the rage. You had to hide your western Saws out of fear of being ridiculed. :shock: Folk would ps. themselves if they caught you with an oil stone. :?

 

[G S Haydon]

This one was called jack http://www.wickes.co.uk/fine-cut-hand-s ... vt/167586/ very cheap and awfully good. You are right though reggie, some of the names make me smile, my favorite right now is the "predator"

 

[riclepp]

...im by no means a rich man but those LN are winking at me

C'mon guys, Toby wants to splash out on some new ones (we all like a bit of bling in the shed), and it's our job to help grease the slope 8) :tool:

Ashley Iles chisels - some e-retailer in the States was even selling them with London pattern handles - but I think you'll have to fit your own.
:idea: I think you can even buy AI chisels without the handles if you buy them direct from the manufacturer (could be wrong)

Lie-Nielsen's socket chisels just wouldn't look right with London pattern handles

Cheers, Vann.

+1 for what Vann has said about the Asley Iles. I have just bought the Mk2 BE set of 11 cabinet Makers chisels. I am still polishing the backs, but boy they are sharp and hold thier edge for a while too, in addition the cut really nicely. I have also been to the foundary, really interesting place and yes you can just buy the metal parts and put your own handles on, or for extra they will put on the LP handles for you.

HTH