looking for a chisel set, what should i get

[tobytools]

Sorry Jacob U may of misunderstood me I will flatten the old chisels and hone them! The new ones when I get them I will still do a few passes on the backs and bevel of them just to make sure they are at 100%, im no pro but im sure that an edge is made from two straights meeting (still learning terminology)
I may be wrong but it the backs arnt straight the chisel should either be sorted or uses to open tins lol.
Any help on this would be great.

Ps. I'm sure I've even seen people flatter LN irons fresh from the box

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Sorry Jacob U may of misunderstood me I will flatten the old chisels and hone them! The new ones when I get them I will still do a few passes on the backs and bevel of them just to make sure they are at 100%, im no pro but im sure that an edge is made from two straights meeting (still learning terminology)
I may be wrong but it the backs arnt straight the chisel should either be sorted or uses to open tins lol.
Any help on this would be great.

Ps. I'm sure I've even seen people flatter LN irons fresh from the box

Toby, you've got the general idea spot on. A sharp edge is the meeting of two smooth and polished surfaces.

About 18 months ago, the family bought me a selection of Ashley Isles b/e chisels for a 'significant' birthday (following my dropping a broad hint or three and directing them to the Workshop Heaven website). They are absolutely superb, and I wouldn't part with them for a big gold clock. Flattening the backs (well, more just polishing the back right behind the cutting edge) using the finest sharpening stone you have, and a similar lick of two on the bevel, was very quick and easy. The set of eight took me about half-an-hour to prepare in total. As Jacob says, good chisels are made with a very slight hollow in length (about 3 thousands of an inch, so very slight indeed), so it's easy to just polish right by the edge.

The technique I used was to place the back of the chisel on the edge of the sharpening stone, with the edge up in the air and the handle below the stone, then bring the handle up so that the back laid on the stone, then with finger pressure directly downwards on the chisel blade, draw it back. Repeat several times, and check for a polish across the whole cutting edge for about a milimetre or two behind the edge. Once you've got that, polish the bevel as in normal sharpening, turn over again and put the flat side to the stone, and draw back to turn the wire-edge. You may need to go bevel-back-bevel-back a few times to completely remove the wire edge, or draw the edge through the endgrain of a piece of softwood. Once that's done, your chisel as about as sharp as you will ever get it from that stone.

Be careful with narrower chisels when preparing and sharpening them. Keep finger pressure directly down - it's quite easy for a narrow chisel to tilt and allow you to dub off a corner if you aren't careful enough.

Once the flat side has it's initial polish, you never need to repeat. The act of removing the wire edge during normal sharpening will maintain (and gradually improve) the polish on the flat. Just be sure NEVER to allow the cutting edge on the flat side to contact the stone before the rest of the back does - get into the habit of lowering the handle before putting the flat side to the stone so that a point a couple of inches back from the edge contacts the stone first. That way, you'll never dub over the cutting edge on the flat side.

Enjoy you new AI chisels. Keep them for 'best' work, and they'll serve you well for the rest of your woodworking days!

Edit to add - with the older chisels, if you keep a few for 'rough' work, it isn't essential that the flat sides are absolutely dead flat. Chisels used for heavy chopping and removal of 'bulk' waste just need a sharpish edge, and provided you can 'draw off' the wire edge when sharpening them, a few minor hollows or bumps won't hurt much. Dead flat chisels are only really needed for very fine work, fitting tight cabinetmaking joints and the like.

 

[tobytools]

Thanks Cheshirechappie for the tip they should serve me well if I apply myself and do it properly. Thanks every one also for help and advice. When I've recieved these bad boys I'll give a full review.
Cheers everyone
TT

 

[G S Haydon]

paul sellers is happy using a £7.95 set from aldi.

I'll bet he's not!

Mike.

http://paulsellers.com/2011/03/ally-pally-show-questions/ !!

What I very much like about the Aldi chisels and someone who is willing to say they are a decent tool, is that it removes the potential inferiority complex about cheaper but still appropriate tools. I have no view I wish to ram down peoples thoughts on budget vs premium, how much of a difference they make, most people can work this out for themselves. But it's a really valid contribution when people say how pleased they are with a cheaper tool.
Could be worth a new thread (unless I have missed one) on great cheap tools.

Tobytools, enjoy the Ashley Isles, they look to be wonderful tools.

 

[Reggie]

I think you have to be curious enough to find out whether there is a real difference between good enough, good and exceptional to want to spend money on the expensive kit. Personally, all I've ever known is the hand me downs my Dad gave me a few weeks ago, 2 are definitely stanley, not entirely sure about the other 5, I'm still at the stage where I'm learning technique and how wood behaves, so right now I have no interest in expensive chisels myself.

 

[bugbear]

I...a real difference between good enough, good and exceptional to want to spend money on the expensive kit.

The difficulties for a beginner are knowing which is which (because price is not a truly completely reliable guide to quality) and knowing wether the difficulties you're having are down to inadequate kit or inadequate skills (or, for the truly unfortunate) both.

One advantage of buying definitely-good-or-better kit is that it eliminates that quandry. And they tend to be beautiful, which is always a bonus.

BugBear

 

[Jacob]

...

One advantage of buying definitely-good-or-better kit is that it eliminates that quandry......

Yes that's the answer!
BTW how do you identify "definitely-good-or-better kit"?
If you don't know I'd suggest buying cheapest. It's probably OK (all chisels are OK all of them are usable) but if not you won't have wasted too much money and it's all part of the learning curve. Might as well learn how to sharpen by spoiling some cheapos rather than an expensive matching set.

 

[Grahamshed]

I went to Workshop Heaven yesterday ( Matthew is a great bloke ) with the probable intension of getting some Narex chisels but wanting to get a good look at the Ashley Iles as well.
The AIs were beautiful. A perfectly balanced work of art. Matthew told me they are still ground by hand but they gave me the impression the were rolled on a dusky maidens thigh like a good cigar.
They would have been totally wasted on me so I came away well pleased with a lot of Narex.

Incidently, Matthew was showing me the Scary sharp method. He actually wacked a good chisel with a hammer to show me how to get nicks out.

 

[AndyT]

I wish it was the case that all cheap chisels are ok. May I offer an example of what to avoid?

I bought these about 15 years ago when I was getting into woodturning. They came from a shop selling cheap tat imported from China, which was a novelty at the time. I can't remember the price but they were probably about £3 for a set of 4 sizes.

I don't think anyone should try and use these as chisels.

This shot shows the curve:

You can see for yourselves the random shaping of the blade and handle and the fresh-from-the-belt-sander finish. You'll have to trust me that the blades are not in line with the handles and that the steel is very soft - "mild" is probably about right.

(I actually bought them to re-shape into scrapers; one is a hook shape for doing the insides of captive rings. This is very gentle work and did not put any scary forces on the steel. I did have to re-sharpen them each time I used them.)

They would also be suitable for opening tins of paint.


Oh, and if anyone wants to swap them for a set of Ashley Iles or Lie-Nielsen, that's fine by me! ;-)

 

[bugbear]

...

One advantage of buying definitely-good-or-better kit is that it eliminates that quandry......

Yes that's the answer!
BTW how do you identify "definitely-good-or-better kit"?

Recommendations from people who's skill and judgement you trust would seem the obvious answer.

BugBear

 

[iNewbie]

That top one has some E A Berg-ness about it... :shock:

I wish it was the case that all cheap chisels are ok. May I offer an example of what to avoid?

I bought these about 15 years ago when I was getting into woodturning. They came from a shop selling cheap tat imported from China, which was a novelty at the time.

 

[t8hants]

That's an insult to A.E. Berg. Oh for a set of those, I've only got one, paid a whole 10p for it!

G

 

[toolmaniac]

I bough a secondhand set of Marples splitproof chisels in 1987 - the ones with the red and yellow handles.
I earned my living with them for 25 years, and still have them. I appreciate the old makes, and the box handles and brass ferrules, but if you want a good practical chisel, you can't beat Marples.

I know it's fashionable to turn your nose up at plastic handles, but they are practical, don't split, and east to clean.

 

[bench_monkey]

I'll go with tool maniac on this one, simply for prolonged use in trade. Myself and the majority of chaps in our workshop use the blue/yellow handled Irwin/marples chisels with metal ends. They hold a good edge, don't cost the earth and get pummelled day in, day out, and still come back for more. If I were at home I'd consider a more 'prestige' chisel based on having time to find my wooden mallet!

 

[Jacob]

I wish it was the case that all cheap chisels are ok. May I offer an example of what to avoid?

I bought these about 15 years ago when I was getting into woodturning. They came from a shop selling cheap tat imported from China, which was a novelty at the time. I can't remember the price but they were probably about £3 for a set of 4 sizes.



I don't think anyone should try and use these as chisels.

Why not? Getting them working, finding out the strengths and weaknesses, a lot of sharpening - all good exercise. And the simple fact is - for most purposes they will be good enough, once sharpened. These obviously haven't been used a lot - actually using them would improve them no end, as they are sharpened and face flattened a bit every time to take the burr off.
Something tells me these are not as bad as you think!

 

[James C]

Sometimes a beginners time would be better spent not having to mess around with lots of fettling of chisels and jump straight into learning how to use them well. After all it's not about the tools.

 

[Reggie]

Sure but you're going to have to learn to sharpen them sooner or later, you can limit it to one at a time as you use them if necessary.

 

[Jacob]

Sometimes a beginners time would be better spent not having to mess around with lots of fettling of chisels and jump straight into learning how to use them well. After all it's not about the tools.

Beginners shouldn't be discouraged from having a go with whatever tools they have. It's just too easy to blame the tools and it's doubly discouraging when expensive and supposedly perfect new tools don't instantly transform performance. "Outa the box" is all very well but its a very short lived advantage and no use at all to the unskilled.
I think getting started with cheap wood, average tools and simple sharpening regimes (oil stones) is an extremely good idea.
The opposite view is all about selling stuff.
It's not about the tools, it's not about shopping either!

 

[James C]

Hey as long as they get used to create things in wood!

As far as sets go I have been taking mental note of the ones that I use the most often and outside of the 1/2" and 1 1/2" chisels that I use quite often I tend to find myself reaching for 1/4" and 3/8" every now and again.

I think that if I went back to the beginning I wouldn't buy a cheap set or expensive set but just the best chisels I could afford or find at the car boot as and when I needed them. Which Is pretty much what I did anyway being limited in funds.

 

[AndyT]

Jacob, let me reassure you that I did once hang a door using a chisel just like that, as a favour for a friend. I had no tools with me but she had bought a brand new chisel for the purpose, not knowing that it would not be ready for use. Fortunately we were in Yorkshire so I was able to hone the chisel on the stone doorstep!


The edge lasted just long enough to cut one hinge mortise before it needed to be resharpened for the next. Yes, it was an educational experience - I learned not to rely on cheap Chinese chisels!