how much heat required for my workshop?

[Nev Hallam]

So what your telling me is to put a 60w bulb or energy saving equivalent in to a biscuit tin with holes in, with some kind of chimney attached?

 

[devonwoody]

and rest the tin on top of your tablesaw c.i. table and the heat should radiate to the table and stop condensation forming?

Thats what I think should happen?

 

[9fingers]

Or more realistically you will get a column of warmed air that will rise above the saw, absorb some moisture from the surroundings, cool and drop down to the table which will remain cold and a possible condensation 'shadow' will be cast on the table.

Didn't you guys pay attention to your science lessons? :lol:

Put the heat source UNDER the table and you might do a little good especially if you make it a real light bulb.

Bob

 

[devonwoody]

How about a mirror to radiate the heat back?

 

[9fingers]

It will still be less effective than doing the job properly.

We put a lot of effort into our woodworking projects to get optimum results why the reluctance to look after our tools/machines properly.

I just don't understand this???


Bob

 

[Nev Hallam]

I'm seriously not going to make a heater from a biscuit tin and a light bulb mr 9 fingers, however I'm not going to rig up an electrical system to the underside of my saw bed either even thought its a great idea, It's a tad involved for me for 5 months of the year, I think i'm going to try and control the temperature of the garage on a whole using heating and such. I have the insulation in place I just need to sort out my drafty garage doors and heating.

 

[Nev Hallam]

I believe strongly in looking after ones machinery, thats exactly why I dont want to put holes in the underside of my machine beds or alter what wadkin intended, thus create a suitable environment in which to house them.

 

[devonwoody]

I would serioulsly be concerned with a biscuit heater under the table incase some sawdust fell in and then dropped on to the nice big pile of sawdust on the floor.

 

[9fingers]

Nev, I did submit a reply earlier on to this thread but it seemed to get lost on the way to the forum.

I noticed the other day that Toolstation are selling seals to help seal garage type doors. If when you are able, you were to fit something like this and then heat your workshop that will be a good solution.
The scheme for heating the machine is best suited when whole volume heating is not practical/possible for some other reason.
You also mentioned paraffin heating. Unless you can take the flue outside, these heaters produce a lot of water vapour and are best avoided.

Good Luck for a rust free winter!

Bob

 

[Benchwayze]

So what your telling me is to put a 60w bulb or energy saving equivalent in to a biscuit tin with holes in, with some kind of chimney attached?

Yes Nev. Make sure it's a big tin, with plenty of holes. The chimney convects the heat.

I will try and locate the 'Bang Goes the Science' program that deals with the cooking of a chicken, and feed the link. You will see just how much heat comes from a bulb.

At the end of the day you can use the heat from a bulb, or the light.
But not both at the same time.

Try it. If it doesn't warm your whole shop, it will at least work locally and keep your machine from condensing moisture.

HTH John

 

[Nev Hallam]

It is so trivial to implement that it should be within the scope of anyone who can use machinery. The heaters need to be in intimate contact with the metal so every fit is machine specific which makes it difficult to market as a universal solution.

It has rather surprised me that I have had such limited response/questions about it since publishing it here quite sometime ago.

In my engineering workshop, I have a cupboard in which I keep my precision tools which has a metal rear panel with low power heaters on the back and insulation behind up against a wall. The inside of the cupboard and internal drawers stays gently warm and keeps rust away from micrometers, dial indicators and other precious instruments.

A little appliance of science works wonders!

Bob

As much as I don't want to screw into the base of my saw or get my head around wiring this system up or figuring out how i'm going to power it, I do think its a real intelligent soulution to the problem, maybe it's because I have a list of projects as long as stretch armstrongs arm to get through on top of a 9 month pregnant mrs to deal with I'm reluctant to use this method. Unless of course you can mass produce this idea put it in a box, on a shelf with a battery or a plug attached and some instructions!

 

[Nev Hallam]

Nev, I did submit a reply earlier on to this thread but it seemed to get lost on the way to the forum.

I noticed the other day that Toolstation are selling seals to help seal garage type doors. If when you are able, you were to fit something like this and then heat your workshop that will be a good solution.
The scheme for heating the machine is best suited when whole volume heating is not practical/possible for some other reason.
You also mentioned paraffin heating. Unless you can take the flue outside, these heaters produce a lot of water vapour and are best avoided.

Good Luck for a rust free winter!

Bob

Thanks for the tip, I'll look into it, I didn't think about the moisture produced from paraffin heater.
It seems alot of people have this issue with rust, maybe we could just put our workshops in the house, possibly in the unused dining room spaces or the spare rooms!

 

[devonwoody]

My resistor fitting problem is that my motor and saw trimball is attached to the c.i. table (under) so weight and accessibility are restricted. Also I have got around 6 cu.ft of hardwood stored under the side table so not just able to tilt the whole saw to get under easily.

But thanks 9fingers for your suggestion which I am sure for others is a good solution.

 

[Benchwayze]

It will still be less effective than doing the job properly.

We put a lot of effort into our woodworking projects to get optimum results why the reluctance to look after our tools/machines properly.

I just don't understand this???


Bob

Hi Bob,

I like your solution, it's simple, and of course it will work.
But maybe I am lucky as I don't really have a rust problem. My garage-shop is only half outside. The remainder is integral with the house. Also the metal door faces due south, and even today, it is far warmer than the ambient temperature.

So I can only conclude that the door acts as a dehumidifier and keeps my shop dry. Truly, I rarely have a problem and then it's the lightest coat of rust, on stuff near the door. This is easily kept at bay with a coat of wax.

As for my light-bulb solution, I used it for my brewing-cupboard, and to keep my car-engine warm in the bad old days of flat batteries. Now, it does heat my shop. (I can still buy tungsten bulbs at the moment.)

The low energy bulbs I am using run as hot as any tungsten bulb and almost caused a fire in my bedroom. Maybe they just take a little longer to reach those temperatures. :?
Regards
John

 

[9fingers]

Nowt wrong with the light bulb solution but I bet you put it underneath the engine not on top!

As tungsten bulbs become more precious, you might want to consider using pairs in series. each bulb will only give 1/4 of the heat but they will last almost indefinitely.
So 4 bulbs two pairs in series will give the same heat as one but notionally forever!

Be kind to your bulbs!

As for the low energy waste heat, it is difficult to credit what you say but you clearly had a problem in the past and that I accept.

Bob

 

[big soft moose]

maybe we could just put our workshops in the house, possibly in the unused dining room spaces or the spare rooms!

good luck selling that idea to swimbo - i suggestted it to my MBGitW when we first moved in here - but got "the look" so it never happened - the spare bedroom bacame the "office" instead

mind you my shop is in an integeral garage and I dont (touch wood) have a rust problem anyway

 

[big soft moose]

That was in the days when bulbs didn't use as much power as is claimed today. 8) Therefore much less expensive than using paraffin or a proper heating element.

Huh - surely a 60W bulb requires 60W and always has done - its hard to see how they could have used less than 60W in the past yet remained 60W bulbs :duno:

as to the fire in your bedroom i would suggest that your bulb was deffective - I have an 18W energy saver in the 'shop and even after four or five hours it is still cool enough to hold in the hand - certainly you couldnt cook a chicken with that one

 

[Benchwayze]

That was in the days when bulbs didn't use as much power as is claimed today. 8) Therefore much less expensive than using paraffin or a proper heating element.

Huh - surely a 60W bulb requires 60W and always has done - its hard to see how they could have used less than 60W in the past yet remained 60W bulbs :duno:

as to the fire in your bedroom i would suggest that your bulb was deffective - I have an 18W energy saver in the 'shop and even after four or five hours it is still cool enough to hold in the hand - certainly you couldnt cook a chicken with that one

I was being sarcastic Moose. Today, the message is that it is wasteful to leave a light-bulb burning, because they use so much power. Hence more emissions.

Not so long ago, the cry was, 'Leave a light burning as a deterrent to burglars. You can leave a light-bulb on for a year and it will cost less than a pound!' (Crime Prevention promotion)

Hence my remark that they must use more power than they used to! )

Also, all of my 60w energy saving bulbs get too hot to hold. Any less wattage than that and I run the risk of falling over things I can't see.

Regards
John

 

[Tim Nott]

My son and I just fitted a little woodburning stove, which was 'given' to us. It's not a turbo, but it burns all the scraps and sawdust. And it keeps us warm. I thing the workshop is around 70 cu m.
This site sells them, and works out how big you need. The flue stuff is expensive!

 

[Nev Hallam]

My son and I just fitted a little woodburning stove, which was 'given' to us. It's not a turbo, but it burns all the scraps and sawdust. And it keeps us warm. I thing the workshop is around 70 cu m.
This site sells them, and works out how big you need. The flue stuff is expensive!

Woodburners Great but cant leave it on whilst im at work, insurance won't look to kindly on it!
I think I sorted my rust issue, combination of 75mm celotex a coulple of oil heaters on energy efficiency mode, and some liberon lubricating wax.
Then when I'm in there me trusty woodburner!