Festool C12

[Orcamesh]

Has anyone got one of these Festool C12's? I just wondered if they were as good as all Festool owners that I know have told me (thus far).

http://www.axminster.co.uk/product.asp?pf_id=376561&name=festool+drill&user_search=1&sfile=1&jump=0

It's a lot of money, so I wonder if it really is worth the extra dough?

All comments warmly received with thanks!

HM

 

[Philly]

I think Waka has one - he should be along soon.
Philly

 

[Steve Maskery]

Well only you can determine if it is worth the dosh, but yes, it is a joy to use. Changing is fast, changing the chuck is done in a second or two, it's light, powerful, has a magnetic plate on which to store your screws while you are working. It's well-balanced. It's fab.

Yes it's expensive, and I guess you could buy several others for the price but if you like quality, you won't be disappointed.

Now then, I have to do the boring bit, otherwise I'll be shot down. I'll probably get shot down anyway. If you already know what's coming, move on.

I didn't buy my C12, Festool kindly gave me one, so everything I say above might be total claptrap designed to do nothing more than repay my debt to Festool. It isn't, of course, but you have to decide how much my independent opinion has been compromised.

Everybody happy?

Cheers
Steve

 

[wizer]

My first observation is that the batteries are NiCad. I'd seriously look for Lithium Ion drill/drivers from Bosch/Hitachi. NiCads are a nightmare in my experience.

 

[cambournepete]

I bought my C12, with NiMh batteries, right-angle chuck, offset chuck and the systainer of spare bits and accessories.
It's lightweight, quiet, powerful, able to fit in tight spaces and a delight to use.
I agree with Steve; it's fab, and yes I think it's worth the money. I've never picked it up and wished I'd bought something cheaper.

 

[Orcamesh]

Thanks guys, I guess there are no surprises there, apart from the NiMH/NiCad batteries. But if those who have bought them have not had any issues with these battery types then is it really a problem? Maybe Festool will be bringing out a Lithium Ion version soon? Anybody know of this? Anyway, seems like there are no unhappy customers.

Last but not least, Steve, how did you manage to get given one!!!??? :shock: :shock: :shock:

cheers
HM

 

[Steve Maskery]

Steve, how did you manage to get given one!!!??? :shock: :shock: :shock:

Last year I made my Workshop Essentials DVDs and Festool, JSP and Woodford were very kind in offering me, either by gift or on loan, tools and machinery for use in the film. It's called Product Placement. Hence I'm not totally unbiased.

BTW, mine has the NiCd batteries and I've not had the remotest problem with them, they charge quickly and seem to last for ever. It's the first drill I pick up, and I have several other good ones too. I have a little Bosch, which is fine as a screwdriver, as it's small and light, and a hefty DeWalt, which is very good but rather heavy, and the batteries are at the end of their life. They don't last five minutes now, literally, sometimes, so it doesn't get much use. But it is handy to have several when you are doing jobs that require lots of tool-changing.

Cheers
Steve

 

[Jake]

I've played with it at a dealer, and it's nice kit, very nice, but it's too expensive for me to justify myself - especially as I only use drills to drill, and impact drivers for driving. They reputedly have great batteries, but at that price (or half of it) I would also want Li-on.

 

[Chris Knight]

Slight aside here. The batteries of my Metabo 15.6v drill/driver are in the same boat as Steve's deWalt. I guess my first question is whether or not it's worth replacing the batteries?

I have been thinking about the Festool but have been a bit put off both by the price and by the fact that I wanted Li ion batteries.

Second question is what advantage does this Festool offer over the more conventionally shaped pistol grip Festool drills?

 

[Waka]

I've got the C12 but it is the older type which has a different battery arrangement than the new one, I also have the TDK 12 and the TDK Plus 15.6, I have to say that I use them a lot and wouldn't be without them.

Now you don't have to say "he's spent a fortune on drills" the truth is that I never spentmore the £120 on either of them, they came from charity auctions and the bay.

Asto wherther they arre worth the money, only you can say that, for me I'd probably go and buy at full price. I have actually had to change one of the batteries on the C12 and got a replacement from Battery Trader for £37, not the £104 that festool are asking.

 

[Steve Maskery]

The batteries of my Metabo 15.6v drill/driver are in the same boat as Steve's deWalt. I guess my first question is whether or not it's worth replacing the batteries?

The last time I looked at it, new batteries were about £35 IIRC, so it probably would be worth one. What I would really like to do is to be able to open up the pack and replace the cells. I once did this very successfully with my TurboVisor and I had change out of a tenner or so instead of £100+ for a replacement battery pack.

The problem is that when I remove the central screw, the two halves don't come apart. I don't know if there are hidden clips to deal with or if the unit is welded too, but it remains defiantly one piece. I'm sure it would be easy to do if I could only get inside. When it dies completely I think I'll saw it apart just to see how it is fixed.

Cheers
Steve

 

[lurker]

[/quote]

Last year I made my Workshop Essentials DVDs and Festool, JSP and Woodford were very kind in offering me, either by gift or on loan, tools and machinery for use in the film. It's called Product Placement. [/quote]

Masterfull :!:

A Gloat
Advertises his CD
Advertising 3 companies

All in one sentence :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[chippy1970]

HM,

What type of use do you need the drill for ?

I am a Festool user I have the TS55 saw rails, midi vac and ehl65 planer but I have a Makita LI-ION drill and impact driver.

In certain things Festool are great but to me they seem a bit behind in driver technology at the moment.

Yes the C12 looks great but for £450 I bought the makita set with 3 batts about 1 1/2 years ago.

The impact driver would probably get into tighter spots than the C12 and with LI-ION batts they last for ever and I use mine on site every day.

 

[manso]

Dithering on a special offer of a C12 with 1.3 Nicads - apparently the pros want more capacity. One reason is I find it a bit odd to use my middle finger as a trigger finger - the other is the dosh!
FWIW I believe that Festool are averse to Li-ion batteries, (and if you had to judge from the wiki articles, that's no surprise), but may introduce lithium polymer batteries at some point.
Regards

 

[Jake]

FWIW I believe that Festool are averse to Li-ion batteries, (and if you had to judge from the wiki articles, that's no surprise), but may introduce lithium polymer batteries at some point.

They were similarly slow to move from NiCad to NimH, which they've now embraced, so I'm not sure that isn't a bit of sales-speak.

 

[Oryxdesign]

I've got quite a few Festool tools so I'm not biased against but I think Panasonic are really hard to beat on the cordless drill front, I think it's mainly down to the quality of their batteries. My oldest drill must be over 10 years old and gets used hard, it still on it's original NiMh batteries and it performs pretty much as it did when I bought it. The festool does look nice and has some good features but they are all very expensive.

 

[ivan]

I got mine (C12) just after the brushles motor came out; it reminded me of the difference between a cheap and a professional camera. It is as concentric as a good mains drill and has even less play in the bearings. The quick change fittings have none of the wobble of the original hex chuck design. I think it's about as powerful as my 14V Hitachi combi which is now reserved for rough work. It's also one of the few (only?) drills that you can hold in line with your forarm, so it stays steady when you have to pile on the pressure for a stubborn screw - excellent ergonomics and balance (but I don't like T handles on a drill)

 

[Dan Clark]

I have the C12 plus chuck kit plus depth-stop chuck. I bought mine and have no affiliation with Festool other than as a customer. (I do however post on the Festool Owners Group a lot.)

I think it's a great drill - very high quality and powerful for it size and voltage. This is probably because of the brushless motor.
With the chuck kit, it is very flexible. With all these chucks, you can get into places not possible with other drills.

Although it takes some getting used to, I actually like the design. When you slide your hand up the grip and pull the trigger with your middle finger, it puts your arm inline with the chuck. This allows you press directly in line with the chuck and not torqued as you do with most drills.

Another nice feature is that both the drill AND the charger have overheating alarms. If you overuse the drill and the drill and/or battery become very hot, the drill will beep at you and wait until it cools down. If you stick a very hot battery in the charger, the charger will wait until the battery has cooled down before charging it. I know this because it occurred to me multiple times. These features saved the drill and batteries several times after driving 65-70 3" X 5/16" lag screws into tough lumber as fast as possible. Even after doing this many times, the drill is still in great shape with no damage.

The C12 has two downsides that I can think of. First, it doesn't use LiIon batteries like my Makita impact driver (I'll get to that in a minute). The 2.4 Milliamp, NiCd batteries on my drill have performed for two years and are still going strong. But they do take longer to charge and are heavier than LiIon batteries.

The second downside is cost. They are pricey buggers. Whether the higher quality and flexibility is worth it to you is entirely personal. It was to me.

I also have a new, black and white Makita impact driver. It's a gem. It drives huge screws without transmitting torque to your wrist. I find that amazing. Also, it is very light and the batteries charge in 15 minutes flat.

However, it too has a couple of downsides. First, while it functions well and is a joy to use, the quality and flexibility is no where near as high as Festool. It's still very good , but a notch below Festool. Second, I'm having some problems with either the batteries or the charger. When I leave a battery in the charger for more than a couple of weeks, it's dead when I try to use it. If I take it out and reinstall the battery into the charger, it starts charging and seems fine in 15 minutes. It works, but it's a bit disappointing.

Regards,

Dan.

 

[Orcamesh]

Well thanks to everyone who has shared their experiences, much appreciated. I currently have no cordless drill/driver, I used to have a Bosch DIY-user cheapo type but it ran out of legs. I suppose I am trying to go that bit better on my next purchase, and all the Festools have attracted my attention. I like quality engineered tools (not that all of my tools are top notch!), so wherever possible I am trying to bit by bit replace with better ones. I am a hobbyist so it shouldn't really matter what I buy, I am not going to be drilling thousands of holes every day. The cordless drill/driver is one tool which you will use a lot though compared to others I could mention, so I think it is justified from this viewpoint.

For the C12 I like it's short body for getting into small places (this may prove useful if I ever get round to doing the kitchen!). I also like the brushless motor and offset chuck, etc. It's just the cost.

My other drills are a really old corded Hitachi and a recently bought Bosch GBH 2-26 DFR, which is a corded SDS drill. The Bosch I am really pleased with, it has done everything I have asked of it so far. Only real niggle is the lack of speed control on the trigger. It sort of controls it but it is very rough, it is mostly on and off. Both these are not suitable for driving, so a small portable drill/driver is still needed.

If I can get the funding I think I will go for a C12, if the Makita's can't tempt me away (this is now another option based on your comments), thanks all!

HM/Steve

 

[cambournepete]

...doing the kitchen...

I used mine for my new kitchen.
It got into the narrowest cupboards easily and the fine torque control means you can drive screws without threadings the chipboard carcases.