Chemical paint stripper-good at stripping back an old piano?

[markwithey]

Hi guys

I'm brand new so hope i'm doing this right. I'd like to know whether chemical paint stripper would be effective at stripping layers of varnish (or whatever it is exactly) from a 75 year old piano.

I was given the piano for free so there aren't too many consequences if it doesn't work.

I was going great guns using an orbital sander from Wickes...until I started to feel REALLY sick and a blood test showed I had lead poisoning from the continuous exposure to, what I now know to be, leaded varnish!!

Stupid mistake, I know, but i'd never done anything like this before and didn't even consider the stuff was toxic. After a bit of research I felt like a total div. So...I purchased a few face masks and goggles and carried on but started getting ill again. Turns out you need more than just those as protection!

I'm now recovered and about half way through the job. Can anyone tell me if chemical paint stripper would be any good for the rest? Just to get the horrible leaded layer off. Is there a particular brand that might be best?

I look forward to some decent advice! Thanks in advance,

Mark

 

[Steve Maskery]

Mark, welcome!

I did once restore a piano. In principle it is no different frm any other pice of wood work, All the bits come off, so you can strip one piece at a time, although I would recommend refinishing it all in one go.

What's the wood? The one I did was all mahogany. Any tropical wood is likely to be more of a problem than pine!

If yo are sanding, use a sander with good dust extraction - it really does make a big difference.

I you use a chemical stripper you will have the problem of making sure that the is all removed.

<y piano project was Ok but not excellent. I sprayed it black, but I didn't really understand the importance of good spray kit, etraction and even the quality of thinners (they are not all the same). But it was 25 years ago, so that's my excuse

My biggest regret is giving it to my brother. When we got married we had two pianos (which given that neither of us really played was something of an extravagance) and mine was the one to go. It didn't look as good as SWMBO's but it was a better instrument. It went to my brother, who kept it in an a UPVC conservatory for 6 months and then took it to the tip, because it had warped so much.
:evil: :evil:

Good luck with your restoration project.

Cheers
Steve

 

[neilyweely]

Mark.
I would try sanding with a good dust extractor, and perhaps using a little
chemical stripper on the more intricate parts. But someone will probly tell me why I shouldn't do that, so...

Steve M.
eeuurrgghhhh That IS a horror story. I hate to see stuff like that going to waste. I saw a piano,( upright, decent looking, played ok to my ears,) sell at auction for 2 pounds, plus costs (4quid).

Oh, welcome Mark.

Neil

 

[markwithey]

Hi Steve

Thanks for the welcome. It's great to meet someone else who's tried restoring a piano.

I took off all the panels I could and finished them all separately, just so I could experiment and make mistakes on the bits that won't be seen.

I've read up on extraction methods and the bag on my sander, according to my research, doesn't offer a great deal of protection as most of the lead still escapes into the air! I work outside when I get the chance as it makes one helluva mess inside!!

As for the wood, that's a good question. I really don't know! Have you any advice as to how I can tell? When sanding I notice the varnish layer comes off to reveal a darkish wood with lighter and darker lines running up and down. When I sand further I get to a very light wood with a visible grain. Smells kinda pine-like but I never want to sniff it too much!!

Black - classic choice, and the same as mine! I know i'm not going to get the finish of a pro job but it's amazing to see how much work and expertise goes into, say, a Yamaha.

It's one hell of a learning curve and sometimes I could burn it, but i'm really really looking forward to the day I can actually play it.

I'm considering getting a gold decal made up for the front panel. Somethin cheesy with my name on it or somethin!

If there's any advice you can think of at all i'd be very grateful to hear it.

All the best and thanks again,

Mark

 

[davin]

Hi there.
I worked for a piano restorer when I was studying. Quite an interesting workshop - not many noisy machines - just lots of strange tuning implements and dismantled grand pianos sitting around.
I had to strip the pianos. Not very subtle work. Plenty of nitromores, scrapers and wire wool will do the job. You can really slap the stripper on (there has to be a joke in there somewhere) leave it a few minutes then gently wire wool or scrape away. Even very delicate veneer work was done like this.
After the old polish or varnish is removed we washed the panels down with plenty of meths. (just wear rubber gauntlets maybe goggles and leave the window open)
Can't remember what was done to the surfaces before the polisher did his magic. But the end results were stunning - If they let me loose on a £20 grand Bluchstein grand piano it can't be that hard..

 

[neilyweely]

well there you go.

This forum is pretty cool, no?

And if its any good to anyone, poundland in Bedford are sellin aerosol cans of nitromors for a quid a go!!!! I stocked up, so I hope it don't go off!!

learnin, learnin, learnin!!!

 

[markwithey]

This is indeed a cool forum. It's a pleasure to hear from nice people who openly share their experiences and give good advice.

I checked out a few other forums beforehand and a few actually have quite bitchy comments on them.

Quite how you can 'bitch' about wood is beyond me so i'm really pleased to have signed up to this one.

Davin - I think you've hit the nail on the head (pun apologised for), it seems quite a delicate skilled job to even take the stuff off the instrument whilst the finishing demands a LOT of perfectionism if you're aiming for the best result.

I'll get some of this Nitromores stuff as it's sold in B&Q near me. I guess if I get it right i'll get the majority of stock off and sand any little bits back by hand.

Neil - you're totally right. I check Ebay a lot and about 80% of them never sell, and most start at 99p. It's because you've got to go and pick up the thing and a piano mover will charge at least £100. I hired a van for £30 and picked up two locally so i've got backup in case I set fire to this one or somthing, which is entirely possible!!

Cheers for all your help guys. I'll put some pics up when I work out how.

 

[RogerS]

Mark...you don't need to use Nitromors. Sodium hydroxide (caustic soda) works just as well. If you mix it with wallpaper paste then it will stick to the piano and not fall off.

Roger

 

[markwithey]

Hi Roger

That's interesting. It looks cheaper to buy the soda and paste. What sort of ratio should I mix that at?

The only thing i'd be worried about is something like Nitromars would come with instructions and be designed for the use. What do you think?

I'd welcome comments from anyone who has tried this though.

Cheers,

Mark

 

[OPJ]

With something like Nitromors, I think you generally have to brush it on liberally, leave it for a few minutes, brush on some more and then test to see if it will now begin to scrape off.

Once you've got all the old finish off, you need to clean it off with white spirit - don't use water on wood, it'll raise the grain - and then you should be able to start applying the new finish.

I think some people also use meths instead of white spirit?

 

[markwithey]

Sounds like I could manage that. What does this 'raise the grain' thing mean? I've heard it a few times.

Cheers,

Mark

 

[bob_c]

If you use caustic soda,you would have to mix it with water.Also you would have to wash it off ,which isnt that easy unless you do it over a drain.It will also loosen the joints if theres any animal glue used.It will also darken the wood.But its a very effective stripper if used carefully.Ive always found nitromors a pain to use unless the project was on the small size.

 

[markwithey]

As I type, Nitromores is bubbling away on my old piano. I have to do NOTHING. I sit here, then scrape it off.

No lead dust, no accidentally sanding off bits that matter, no having to move a piano OUTSIDE so I don't get dust on everything - I can just do the work next to the french doors (wide open obviously).

So far, so brilliant! Admittedly it's not going to do all the work for me, but it's such a nice way to work compared to screaming electric sanders. I think i'll still have to wet and dry for a good finish but that I can take!

Thanks to all the guys on this site that suggested it.

Cheers,

Mark

 

[ike]

Hi Mark,

I've stripped a fair bit of varnished stuff with Nitromors, after giving up with sanding. To make it even easier, after scraping the bulk of the goo off, work over the surface again with coarse wire wool dipped in Nitromors, and an old toothbrush for the mouldings and fiddly bits. Wipe off remaining residue with white spirit. Best to leave for a day or two to dry before sanding - saves clogged paper.

cheers,

Ike

 

[markwithey]

Hi Ike

Ah, leave it dry after white spirit? Excellent timing cos I was jst about to sand straight after putting it on.

So far this Nirtomores stuff has been a total blessing. I've got a black bag half full of brown crud that would have ended up around the garden, in my lungs or inside the house if i'd been sanding.

Thanks again for the advice - it's all been taken on board and used!

Cheers,

Mark

 

[frugal]

I was going great guns using an orbital sander from Wickes...until I started to feel REALLY sick and a blood test showed I had lead poisoning from the continuous exposure to, what I now know to be, leaded varnish!!

Stupid mistake, I know, but i'd never done anything like this before and didn't even consider the stuff was toxic. After a bit of research I felt like a total div. So...I purchased a few face masks and goggles and carried on but started getting ill again. Turns out you need more than just those as protection!

I am sure I have heard that lead is one of the poisons you can absorb through the skin.

I think it was from the gas man when he discovered that some cowboy had soldered 2' of lead pipe between the gas main and the boiler when they ran out of copper pipe !

 

[frugal]

Neil - you're totally right. I check Ebay a lot and about 80% of them never sell, and most start at 99p. It's because you've got to go and pick up the thing and a piano mover will charge at least £100. I hired a van for £30 and picked up two locally so i've got backup in case I set fire to this one or somthing, which is entirely possible!!

Plus the cost of then getting a tuner in to turn it up after the move and then once a year after that.

With the cost of a good digital piano under 300 quid these days it is no wonder that few people are willing to pay to rehome a real piano.

A friend of ours is looking to get rid of hers to free up the space and SWMBO is trying to convince me that we need one to encourage musical ability in the children.

 

[kityuser]

Neil - you're totally right. I check Ebay a lot and about 80% of them never sell, and most start at 99p. It's because you've got to go and pick up the thing and a piano mover will charge at least £100. I hired a van for £30 and picked up two locally so i've got backup in case I set fire to this one or somthing, which is entirely possible!!

Plus the cost of then getting a tuner in to turn it up after the move and then once a year after that.

With the cost of a good digital piano under 300 quid these days it is no wonder that few people are willing to pay to rehome a real piano.

A friend of ours is looking to get rid of hers to free up the space and SWMBO is trying to convince me that we need one to encourage musical ability in the children.

get em a guitar!! far more easy to store, and more "trendy" too :wink:

Steve

 

[markwithey]

Hiya Frugal

Luckily I can tune myself. I'm tight as hell so taught myself a few years back. You're right about the digitals though - they're superb value. However it's just never the same as the real thing. I've checked out some £10k+ digitals that use laser strings and they're amazing, but there's still something missing that I find with real hammers, strings and wood.

Maybe it's the idea of the instrument creating it's own sound, not emulating the sound of another. I dunno. However, I teach a bit of piano and always advise a keyboard or digital piano to start off. You can't make an acoustic piano sound like strings, or drums, or planes!!!

Steve - he he, nah! I strum a bit too and it's definitely the piano that gets more girls. Admittedly it's the blind ones that get trapped behind it but it still counts ;-)

 

[kityuser]

Steve - he he, nah! I strum a bit too and it's definitely the piano that gets more girls. Admittedly it's the blind ones that get trapped behind it but it still counts ;-)

No way ho-say!

:shock: :wink:

Steve