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from what I can gather it's just a fancy name for microbevel, I'll be putting this on ignore then, what a load of codswallop, cheers.
Pretty disingenuous. You're one of those who consistently sh*t all over any mention of DW's posts. He must have bruised your ego pretty badly to elicit this persistent negative responses. Don't you have anything better to do?
Cheers
 
Pretty disingenuous. You're one of those who consistently sh*t all over any mention of DW's posts. He must have bruised your ego pretty badly to elicit this persistent negative responses. Don't you have anything better to do?
Cheers
I put it on ignore, yes I have a business to run, good riddance.
 
One can see Tage Frid practicing the "Unicorn Method ":sneaky: in his dovetailing video, at the end, when he shows how he sharpens and then finishes on a buffer. If memory serves he even mentions the buffer making the edge last longer. That video was shot so long ago (relatively speaking) that it never made it from VHS to any other media. I still have the tape, but nothing to play it on.

We live in the era where people are "rediscovering" not too terribly old techniques and calling them their own, or outright disingenuousness and hoping nobody notices.

The chance that anybody currently living has 'discovered' anything new about working is beyond remote. The current criteria for a discovery is whether or not somebody thinks it has ever been discussed on a woodworking forum before. If you've never posted about it then you can't possibly know about it. Well, I don't post about having bowel movements, either, but I have them quite competently. And I tend to dispose of these 'new discoveries' in the same vein.
 
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One can see Tage Frid practicing the "Unicorn Method ":sneaky: in his dovetailing video, at the end, when he shows how he sharpens and then finishes on a buffer. If memory serves he even mentions the buffer making the edge last longer. That video was shot so long ago (relatively speaking) that it never made it from VHS to any other media. I still have the tape, but nothing to play it on.

We live in the era where people are "rediscovering" not too terribly old techniques and calling them their own, or outright disingenuousness and hoping nobody notices.

The chance that anybody currently living has 'discovered' anything new about working is beyond remote. The current criteria for a discovery is whether or not somebody thinks it has ever been discussed on a woodworking forum before. If you've never posted about it then you can't possibly know about it. Well, I don't post about having bowel movements, either, but I have them quite competently. And I tend to dispose of these 'new discoveries' in the same vein.
🤣
The "ruler trick" is a classic: something which everybody has been doing from the stone age onwards but without a ruler, suddenly becomes a great discovery!
Or can I claim to have personally discovered the "without a ruler trick"?
Hmm, maybe I'll have to do a vid showing how to do it without a ruler. 🤔
 
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If memory serves right, David didn't frame his unicorn posts as "look what I have discovered". You don't know what he said initially and you're just guessing that he's running around telling people he's discovered something new. He saw an effect in buffering an edge and he just run with it in his usual obsessive way and tested the hell out of it. This seems to be a recurring theme, for some reason there's this hatred that in your head David is proclaiming "he's discovered" something. Like the other guy above, with a business to run, don't you have anything better to do?

What pisses a lot of people off is that when they rebut David with just opinions they can't justify, he calls them off and demands something more than "I've been doing this 40 years". Well, good for you, but that doesn't mean there's something valuable in other methods. It bruises a lot of egos.
 
If memory serves right, David didn't frame his unicorn posts as "look what I have discovered".
Yes he did.
You don't know what he said initially and you're just guessing that he's running around telling people he's discovered something new.
I read several of his early posts somewhere. He does go on about it rather obsessively.
He saw an effect in buffering an edge and he just run with it in his usual obsessive way and tested the hell out of it. This seems to be a recurring theme, for some reason there's this hatred that in your head
What's hatred got to do with it? Just because it's a cr ap idea doesn't mean I hate anybody.
David is proclaiming "he's discovered" something. Like the other guy above, with a business to run, don't you have anything better to do?

What Zilch-Wedlock a lot of people off is that when they rebut David with just opinions they can't justify, he calls them off and demands something more than "I've been doing this 40 years". Well, good for you, but that doesn't mean there's something valuable in other methods.
It's not "another method". People have been stropping/polishing edges from the year dot. I do too.
It bruises a lot of egos.
What's ego got to do with it?
 
Yes he did.

I read several of his early posts somewhere. He does go on about it rather obsessively.

What's hatred got to do with it? Just because it's a cr ap idea doesn't mean I hate anybody.

It's not "another method". People have been stropping/polishing edges from the year dot. I do too.

What's ego got to do with it?
Jacob, I'm sure you're aware of my little piece, A Lesson in Sharpening. It's been around for more than two decades and was written a bit tongue in cheek. In it, I suspect you'll recall, is the method I was taught to sharpen bench chisels and plane irons. It's pretty simple: a stone, some lubricant, freehand honing, and finally a bit of stropping on the palm of the hand. I haven't changed anything significantly in my honing methodology since that single longish afternoon lesson back in the mists of time. I suppose one change I incorporated maybe three decades ago was the addition of a finer bench stone in order to occasionally get a keener edge than my standard combination Norton oilstone would provide. Another change was to add a a block of wood with some leather mounted on it which I charged with polishing compound. I'd sometimes use this to finally strop instead of flipping the honed tool on the palm of my hand.

I also, at a time I don't recall precisely, switched to ceramic stones for most plane iron and bench chisel honing needs, primarily because I didn't like getting my hands oily when I had to go straight after sharpening to working on whatever I was working on. I didn't like the idea of oil contamination of the wood if I didn't wash my hands after honing. Having said that I do still sharpen with oilstones primarily with my 'on-site' kit where it's simple enough to carry a stone, some oil and a rag compared to the faff of ceramic stones, their ponds, plant sprayer, rag, etc.

Anyway, to the point about stuff that David Weaver talked about at great length, specifically the horribly named 'unicorning' using polishing compound on a hard polishing mop. I thought it was interesting and decided to have a go at final buffing by sticking a mop in a cordless drill and loading it with some compound, after which I did a quick five or ten second fizz on both sides of plane irons after honing on a stone. What I did find was this final buff did have a very positive effect on sharpness and even, I think, contributed to edge longevity.

All I'm saying is that it can sometimes be useful to listen to people who appear and promulgate a 'new idea', even if, in reality, it's an old trick that's been forgotten or somehow become, over time, ignored.

I like to think I know my way around woodworking techniques having been bashing wood around for a long time, but I'm always conscious of the fact that I'm sadly lacking in a lot of woodworking skills, knowledge and methods outside my primarily craft furniture specialism, and I do rather like to see, hear, discuss and/or read what other woodworkers might have to say. There's always the chance I'll learn something, but I think I'm experienced enough to generally be able to quickly spot the blowhards, the ignorant twonks and the chancers.

I'm trying to think when I last got involved in a sharpening thread, and this one seems to have evolved into such a discussion, and I can't recall when it might have been, but possibly years ago. I've entered this one and it's showing all the characteristics of sharpening threads that put me off the subject. I strongly suspect this post of mine in this thread will be my only contribution. Slainte.
 
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If memory serves right, David didn't frame his unicorn posts as "look what I have discovered". You don't know what he said initially and you're just guessing that he's running around telling people he's discovered something new. He saw an effect in buffering an edge and he just run with it in his usual obsessive way and tested the hell out of it. This seems to be a recurring theme, for some reason there's this hatred that in your head David is proclaiming "he's discovered" something. Like the other guy above, with a business to run, don't you have anything better to do?

What Zilch-Wedlock a lot of people off is that when they rebut David with just opinions they can't justify, he calls them off and demands something more than "I've been doing this 40 years". Well, good for you, but that doesn't mean there's something valuable in other methods. It bruises a lot of egos.
There isn't one scintilla of information that David Weaver and his cronies have ever posted that represented a bona fide breakthrough in anything. That it's new to you is fine, but that does not make it new to the rest of the world. I'll give David the benefit of the doubt that it's not a rank rip-off and rebranding, but simply a poor/lackluster review of already existing literature and other sources.

Buffers of all kinds and various firmnesses, leather wheels, leather gouge cones, etc., etc., are not new in the workshop. I'd be willing to bet there are at least ten or more articles in Fine Woodworking (not to mention other woodworking magazines) from Issue 1 all the way to today discussing the use of buffers when honing and finishing woodworking tools. Even the notion that it had been "forgotten" is a huge, huge stretch.

And it's not even limited to woodworking. American Farriers Journal:

https://www.americanfarriers.com/ar...hrough the hoof with a minimum of resistance.
Ernie Conover has done essentially this same article for every U.S. woodworking magazine in print for the last thirty years:

https://www.woodworkersjournal.com/sharpening-grinding-jig-buffers/
Knife sharpening with paper wheels:

https://sharpeningmadeeasy.com/paper.htm
Here's a paper wheel sharpening kit:

https://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/6-x-58-Paper-Wheel-Sharpening-Kit-P1145.aspx
There is nothing new under the sun. Nothing.
 
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........ What I did find was this final buff did have a very positive effect on sharpness
So you now do it the "unicorn" way every time? If not why not?
Stropping is as old as the hills.
I found that autosol on an mdf disc on my lathe works well. Spit on leather works well. It even seems to work well just stropping on ones hand.
They all work well! The more you do it the better you get at it!
and even, I think, contributed to edge longevity.
You don't sound convinced!
There's a clue here in what it's all about: "contributing to edge longevity" is a pseudo technical expression of "stays sharp longer".
All I'm saying is that it can sometimes be useful to listen to people who appear and promulgate a 'new idea', even if, in reality, it's an old trick that's been forgotten or somehow become, over time, ignored.
It hasn't been ignored it's been in continual use, one way or another, with variations, since the stone age.
 
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So you now do it the "unicorn" way every time? If not why not?
Stropping is as old as the hills. I found that autosol on an mdf disc on my lathe works well. Spit on leather works well. It even seems to work well just stropping on ones hand. They all work well!

You don't sound convinced!

It hasn't been ignored it's been in continual use, one way or another, with variations.
I think we're supposed to believe that briefly touching both sides of the edge to the wheel is the part that made it something 'new.'

Somebody can take something so utterly intuitive and put a little window dressing around it, and lemmings go weak in the knees over the whole thing.

What sad commentary.
 
I'm not sure how you map these turning tool sharpening techniques to sharpening bech chisels or plane irons. I dare you find anyone writing articles about applying buffers to bench chisels.

The Bench chisel was the initial focus of David's posts at woodcentral: grind a shallow bevel followed by the buffer at a steeper angle. Hardly rocket science. David, however, took the time to see if it made a difference.

His sin seems to be that he dared to post the results and come up with a dumb name. How terrible.

Were you using the buffer all along? Did you prove it doesn't work? Do you even know if it works or not? This attitude doesn't make look good at all.
 
This thread is one of the weirdest in a long time.

It’s not even about sharpening … it’s about what someone once may or may not have said about sharpening.

David was/is very passionate about his research. Whether he invented something new or was/is adding evidence why something already around worked he isn’t here to tell us and It doesn’t really matter imho.
 
Just to be clear, the Unicorn Method (yes, horrible name) is not about stropping, per se. It is about creating a high angle edge. And this edge must be extremely tiny - nano tiny - so as not to interfere with the blades entry into wood. In other words, it is not a scraper-like action. The angle at which one holds the bevel to the wheel is different (much higher) than when stropping at a wheel in the traditional manner. If you do not know this, then you are not comparing apples with apples.

Earlier, Jacob linked to my article on it. In this I discussed “preparing” (I’d rather call it that than “sharpening”) chisels. Beforehand, these chisels could not cut as well as a banana. The Unicorn raised the bevel angle and helped it improve edge durability, and without impacting on the cutting action.

Do I use it? No. The Unicorn was designed for crappy steel, and my blades do not need it. Further, I prefer to hone on a hollow grind, which is predictable, and the Unicorn is not a predictable result for re-sharpening. “Re-sharpening” is probably more important than sharpening once.

Regards from Perth

Derek
 
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This is the article David published at the Woodcentral forum. The link may work only temporarily. That site is undergoing re-design and some of its old content is missing.

Anyways, here's the article, you can judge for yourself what was claimed and tested. The article was published around August of 2020.

https://www.woodcentral.com/articles_raw/newarticles/articles_958.shtml
There was a very interesting discussion at the time in that forum about edge failure. Why and how does an edge fail? Edge failure is what ultimately sends you to your fancy 5 stone "sharpening station".

One of the conclusions of the article was that it mitigates edge failure. That is why it makes an otherwise "crappy" steel chisel work better, as well as improve the performance of good steels, like the famous PM-V11.
 
This is the article David published at the Woodcentral forum. The link may work only temporarily. That site is undergoing re-design and some of its old content is missing.

Anyways, here's the article, you can judge for yourself what was claimed and tested. The article was published around August of 2020.

https://www.woodcentral.com/articles_raw/newarticles/articles_958.shtml
There was a very interesting discussion at the time in that forum about edge failure. Why and how does an edge fail? Edge failure is what ultimately sends you to your fancy 5 stone "sharpening station".

One of the conclusions of the article was that it mitigates edge failure. That is why it makes an otherwise "crappy" steel chisel work better, as well as improve the performance of good steels, like the famous PM-V11.
So does everybody now use this system? And if not, why not?
 
Jacob said: So you now do it the "unicorn" way every time? If not why not?
No. Perhaps you should follow the advice you so frequently offer to others, i.e., read more attentively (what I wrote).
Jacob said: You don't sound convinced!
There's a clue here in what it's all about: "contributing to edge longevity" is a pseudo technical expression of "stays sharp longer".
No, I'm not convinced, hence the hesitant "I think". I guess the hesitancy didn't project through the lack of audible tone, lack of facial expression, and perhaps an invisible to see, to readers here, the slight shrug of the shoulders. Maybe I should have written 'possibly appears to contribute to edge longevity'.

There's nothing pseudo technical in 'contributing to edge longevity' as opposed to writing 'stays sharp longer': they're simply different selections of words to say essentially the same thing.
Jacob said: It hasn't been ignored it's been in continual use, one way or another, with variations, since the stone age.
I know. I've been flipping honed blades on the palm of my hand since I was taught to sharpen. I've also, as I said in my first post in this thread, used polishing compound on leather attached to a block of wood. More recently I've experimented with a hard polishing mop plus polishing compound.

As Adam said somewhere up this thread, "Meanwhile, the earth continues to rotate about its polar axis," and I think I'll take the hint and no longer circulate around the axis of this thread. Slainte.
 
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