Buying used bandsaw?

[ondablade]

Having done some digging to understand the blade induced drift issue recently posted i found a very comprehensive Minimax MM 16 bandsaw demo video http://www.minimax-usa.com/index.php?op ... tlink&id=7

A bit of an eye opener - the ease with which that thing sails through thick resawing is incredible. It seems there's a whole world of (essentially industrial level) high performance bandsaw capability out there with major implications for how ripping of heavy timber and re-sawing (to produce wide boards) can be handled.

I'd almost go so far as to say that i've realised it's one of the most fundamental capabilities you could have for furniture making. You can rip on a panel saw, but depth of cut limitations and the amounts of dust and bother make it very limited by comparison.

So i've been doing some (fairly idle) digging to see what would be involved in upgrading from my Basato 5-4 (a decent enough saw, but not in the same space at all due partly to its size, but especially to its inability to really tension up, power and control a blade) to a higher end saw.

It seems like the heavier duty 16 - 18 in models by Agazzani, Centauro, SCM or Minimax might be the space to aim for - the Minimax comes in single phase with a decent motor too.

What do you guys reckon? A new machine unless very heavily discounted would be rather expensive. Do they come up used in single phase, and if so how might one run one to earth? Are dealers discounting significantly these days? There are other UK brands about like Wadkin etc, and of course Felder (actually a re branded Italian i gather) but it's hard to find user info on these. Do they occupy a similar space?

 

[big soft moose]

So i've been doing some (fairly idle) digging to see what would be involved in upgrading from my Basato 5-4 (a decent enough saw, but not in the same space at all due partly to its size, but especially to its inability to really tension up, power and control a blade) to a higher end saw.

I like the look of the wadkin BZB that jonny (or was it matty, hmm cant remember) got lately - its an absolute beast of a thing but likely to meet your bandsaw needs forever and a day - and they arent that expensive on ebay

 

[tjwoodms]

the wadkin bzb is a very good bandsaw but 30 or 36" wheel is bigger than the 18" mentioned but can be had quite cheeply. The wilsons are also worth looking at if you can find a good one they tend to be cheep because parts are an issue but being a simple machine parts can be copied with ease

 

[tjwoodms]

the company i sell machines for has a wadkin 20" fuly rebuilt for £1300 i dont know how that compares but its seeems like a good offer to me

 

[big soft moose]

theres one here http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/WADKIN-BZB-20-BAN ... 3caeb29fcf

currently at 495 but they usually go for about a K so you are in the ball park

 

[ondablade]

:? Thank you for the leads guys, that's putting it up to me as so far it's more a case of exploration.

On the Wadkin BZB of which i have zero knowledge. It lists as having about 2hp which by some standards is rather low power. (my present Scheppach claims 3hp) On the other hand i seem to be picking up the hint elsewhere that some sellers claim far more HP than is actually available - with mutterings of tendencies to overheat and amps drawn in use being the giveaway/definitive test.

It also seems that in the Italian models that there is usually a standard duty, and a HD/heavy duty bandsaw, and that the standard duty machines can be little flimsy/underspecced. (e.g. Minimax have two lines)

Finally on size. I've been in the habit of regarding the vertical cutting height available as being the 'size'. You seem to be taking it as wheel diameter TJ. have i got it wrong, or what is the practice?

 

[JonnyD]

Hi heres a link to my bandsaw https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/the- ... 41253.html I am pretty sure the motor on mine is 3hp 3 phase and on a lot of the older machines that is probably output power. Although i havent had it long it seems to be capable of doing everything i need a bandsaw for and is incredibly solid. The bzb linked too is a 20 inch model fabricated from sheet steel wheras the 24 and 30 inch models are cast iron frame beasts.

Most bandsaws are listed as wheel diameter as the main measurement and then height under guides as the cutting height.

Matty also bought an old robinson Bandsaw and has been very happy with it as far as i know.

cheers

jon

 

[Benchwayze]

I couldn't be without my bandsaw Ian.

It's only a small Startrite 351, but it has an 8" depth of cut. A 1/2" skip-tooth, 3tpi blade waltzes through hardwoods. It really does open up all kinds of possibilities for book matching, and using veneers that you cut yourself and can actually plane afterwards.

Having no tablesaw, worthy of the name, I use my bandsaw for preliminary ripping too. If it ever died I would buy another without a moment's thought.

John

 

[ondablade]

That BZB is one huge piece of kit Jon. Not the sort of machine you nudge around the floor with your hip to adjust the space around it!

Which feeds into my space issue - getting rip cut lengths from 1.25m upwards off the bandsaw needs temporarily moving it sideways (LH) into space that a 2.5x1.25 sheet angled at 45 deg on the panel saw slider will get into on the (rare) occasions. It's at least a straight line move, so some sort of wheeled sled must be an option - even for a very heavy saw like that.

Makes the more compact footprint of one of the Italian saws sound attractive - though at the price of reduced clearance to the column.

What's interesting about all of this bearing your post in mind John is that it's possible to get by with a lot less saw too. The existing Scheppach Basato 5-4 should by its numbers/spec sheet (300mm depth of cut, 450 wheel dia, 2.3kW S1 - though the listed 7.1A places it at more like 1.6kW) should on the face of it be able to do the job. (resawing in hardwood up to say 10in, long rips)

Maybe the Tuff Saw blades on the way will up its game - it'll be time for some deep rip/resawing trials.

The $1,000,000 question becomes what all that cast iron buys you (e.g. a Minimax S 600P has only a bit more vertical capacity, but is built much more heavily) - whether in an Italian stallion, or old British iron.

It maybe loses you some stuff too, in that bigger saws it seems can depending on the guide system be hard to set up for small blades. (no, not two saws!!)

??????

 

[ondablade]

PS a few trials this afternoon on the Scheppach at about an 11 1/2 in depth of cut using the 1/2 in 3 tpi Timberwolf blade mentioned before trying to resaw some red pine were not too inspiring.

Slow as hell, blade tracking changing with every tension adjustment, a continuous squealing vibration when cutting, cut bowing vertically (2 humps), as a result next to impossible to back the blade out of the cut, max tension.

It's very effective on lighter cuts, but no way does it feel like a runner for resawing blanks for e.g. cabinet door panels..

No doubt i'm doing something wrong....

 

[Mattty]

PS a few trials this afternoon on the Scheppach at about an 11 1/2 in depth of cut using the 1/2 in 3 tpi Timberwolf blade mentioned before trying to resaw some red pine were not too inspiring.

Slow as hell, blade tracking changing with every tension adjustment, a continuous squealing vibration when cutting, cut bowing vertically (2 humps), as a result next to impossible to back the blade out of the cut, max tension.

It's very effective on lighter cuts, but no way does it feel like a runner for resawing blanks for e.g. cabinet door panels..

No doubt i'm doing something wrong....

I had a Basato 5-2 and even with decent blades it was still underpowered and just not capable of re sawing in any quantity. My setup was bang on how i was trained. Even this bigger machine couldn't tension the wider blades enough.
There are loads of cheap cast iron saws if you can find the space. My Robinson only cost me about £400, it breezes through 12" of any timber and is about 60 years old! It is big though.