Worn Chipbreaker from a type 6

[Dovetaildave]

Just bought an old Stanley type 6 (flebay), and the chip-breaker of 1888's has been well used and fettled many times and the curve is well worn.

As well as having a surprisingly large diameter head on the screw, a lot of light shows between the (new) blade and chip-breaker when fully tightened.

Did I read somewhere here (Jacob?) that I can bend it over a bit so it will make better contact, if so any one done it and willing to share their experience good or bad ?

I'm secretly hoping this might a opportunity to get my dead blow/shot filled mallet out of retirement (hammer), I don't have bending bars, but do have record no3 engineers vice.

Regards,
Dave

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I've bent them before without any difficulty or problems whatsoever. You'll probably find it easier and more consistent in a vice with some sort of former than with a hammer.

 

[ED65]

Clamping the leading edge in a vice (pad jaws if using a metalworking vice) and bashing with a mallet low down, near where you want it to bend, can increase the bend in a cap iron but it's difficult to get a nice even smooth curve. There doesn't have to be much bend at the front of a cap iron for it to work though, remember some cap irons are basically flat, so after evening up the front sweep maybe fettling the underside of the lip is all it needs?

I've dealt with a couple of heavily worn cap irons (from woodies used for site work to judge by their condition) and one or two which had something weird going on with the curve at the front and I've only had to re-bend once IIRC.

Can you post pics of yours? Front, top and bottom.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Before doing anything drastic with hammers, it might be worth putting the blade and cap-iron into the plane, and clamping them under the lever-cap, as in working condition. The lever cap pressure can be enough to bring the cap-iron into correct contact with the blade - some careful checking with the plane upside-down and an exploratory poke or two with a feeler gauge or piece of kitchen foil will soon reveal all.

Obviously, if the above check shows any gap between blade and cap-iron under lever cap pressure, the advice posted in previous comments holds good!

 

[custard]

Before doing anything drastic with hammers...

+1

Once you start bashing and bending a cap iron there's no going back, the metal will stretch and deform so, if you're unhappy, you can't precisely re-trace your steps.

Start with the basic stuff, flattening the back of the iron and truing the edge of the cap iron. Only after exhaustively exploring those options should you think about alternatives.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Certainly. The couple I've done haven't even touched properly at the front with the rear done up flat to the iron. :?

 

[David C]

How much light is showing?

I would not bend unless necessary.

The underside edge is best worked on a stone, to produce a flat surface with small clearance angle.

David Charlesworth

 

[Dovetaildave]

it's been so long that i cant remember how to quote lots of people replies.

Over the years have read and fettled my fair share of planes and CB's, but haven't seen, tried or read, anything pertaining to bending a CB, so thought I'd post and see what comes back generally.

First-off was really trying to find out tried and tested methods and others experiences of this type of work if it should be required.

The non reversible and hammer beating I agree isn't the best course in the first instance, I suppose I just wanted an excuse to use the funny emoticon again, sorry

Embarrassingly I forgot to bring plane home from work ( #-o ), so I haven't got the plane here, (so not photos or assesment this weekend), didn't have my best glasses with me at the great unwrapping and virgin strokes, so can't answer questions pertaining to how much at this moment, but there was light.....honest!

1, "levercap and feeler gauges", seems like a very good method of a first assessment route, just gonna have to find the feeler gauges first.

2, "vice with some sort of former " seems like a sound methodology and if required will be the way I'd probably try in first instance (if so much bend is actually going to be required), some well placed dowel(s) maybe would provide an even distribution of pressure. across its width, repeatable thereafter.



Thanks for the replies, any other people experiences of this will be well received.
Regards,
Dave

 

[Dovetaildave]

Well searched high and low and couldn't find feeler gauges anywhere, but thought I should push on regardless.

Turned into a serious days work as there was a lot more to do than simply sort the CB, as I would need to take a shaving to test the CB-to-blade contact.

Had a go at flattening the sole;

I reversed my hands, reversed my stance, reversed the plane, and every permutation thereafter, with basically the same three high spots showing each time.
Funnily enough, when I continued working the same piece of 80 grit, all the blue ink was removed as happened on the first attempt and I was very relieved, thought it was too easy, so re-inked and went at it a second time, and a third, and a fourth and......... it still wasn't flat....(My kingdom for a linisher).

I thought I'd better move on to the CB / blade combo.
Flattened the back of the blade, ground and honed the blade (don't ask me about un-boxing and setting up the slow grinder with its inadequate rests grrr !).

Squared up one side and the leading edge, and rounded the leading edge of the CB. then Inked the CB;

Nearly flattened the length of it, but barely had the arm strength to keep going, also had the thought in the back of my mind that the more I remove the bigger the gap would be, then the more lightly that it would need bending and a different angle for the next attempt, so settled for a nearly full width to test it.

Assembled the combo and didn't have gauges but could easily see the now slightly larger gap;

.

Set up the combo with approximately 1.5mm of blade showing.

Viewed from front shows the gap in question.

 

[Dovetaildave]

Wacked it into the body, checked the mouth;

And it performed nearly as well as my QS 41/2;

So I didn't need to bend the CB on this occasion, maybe in another 100 years time :wink:

 

[Ttrees]

Wacked it into the body, checked the mouth;
View attachment 10

And it performed nearly as well as my QS 41/2;
View attachment 11

So I didn't need to bend the CB on this occasion, maybe in another 100 years time :wink:

If you intend to plane without any tearout you will need to bend that cap iron, I find I need quite a bit more undercut of the cap iron
edge than is mentioned frequently, as dust will get underneath when you set it to have full effect
This means no tearout ever.
You wont notice a problem with a well fitting cap iron until you get to a proper PITA of a board, where it needs to be setcloser again one maybe two hairs distance from the cutter, no more!

But you will need to work through those wildly ground edges of your cutter, to get back to a straight iron to use the cap iron effectively.
I would keep that as a scrub plane till I got past that relief of the edges

Cap iron fettling
Sort the twist out first if it exists, bend it in a vice with hardwood jaws
This will be a matter of focusing on the lesser bent edge to make the bend even, that and some more if the bend is not sufficient.
I often find, as I have a plane designated for stage one paint/varnish/crud removal, to rehone the cap iron regularish
as I work with reclaimed iroko, hence the need for the caps influence from the get go.
so a 50 degree angle on the top side, and a good undercut on the underside.
A problem that can occur is when each edge has a gap and its touching in the middle.
I use the corner of the hone to make a hint of a hollow first, before setting the entire length of the edge on the hone.
And with the no 8 which I've recently improved (not enough undercut) I found I needed to have ALL OF MY FINGERS on the edge as it wasn't making uniform contact with the cutter.

Good luck
Tom