When did the world go mad for Festool?

[Phil Pascoe]

Add knowledgeable, certainly.

 

[DiscoStu]

I'm still a relative newbie at all this but I do own two Festool products:

The TSR55 and a Domino.

The TS55 isn't much different in cost to Makita, Dewalt or Bosch options so I was keen to go Festool as I have been impressed with my Domino and I really like the Systainers (call me OCD)

The Domino seems to be somewhat unique in its abilities and to me it meant I saved a lot of time. I am 40 with 3 children and most days I leave home at 5.30 and get home around 7.30 so I don't have a lot of free time. Therefore when I do get a few hours at weekends etc to do some woodwork, I can spend what little time I have making one or two joints. I know for many of you this is what you enjoy and that's completely fine but I want to see things progress more quickly and a domino is brilliant for me.

Yes it's a cuffing expensive but if kit and so far it's probably made about 50 joints in a year, but my time is short and I'm holding my own financially so why not?

As for the general addiction to Festool. I would like an OF1400 router but I can't see me spending £700 on a drill and a centrotec bit set for it when I think my Ryobi 18v drill and impact driver are brilliant.

It all depends on individual choices and cash! As I said above I like the Systainers and the organisation that they bring and I will no doubt end up with a few more Festool products. I'd like to think I won't get too carried away with it all. Can a Festool random orbital sander really be much better than my £80 Bosch?

 

[SteveF]

Good question about the sander

i am looking for one at the moment (another thread on here)

I have a cheap ryobi that is still turning but the pad is worn and i cant get one..not even direct
i am now looking at a festool or mirka for 2 reasons
the 2 i am looking at are so small and lightweight..can't seem to find that unless u go to the really cheap stuff (maybe an option)
the top brands appear to have better support and although crazy price i suspect i could still get a pad in 10 years time

p.s. wish I knew about pad savers earlier as i probably wouldnt be replacing my ryobi
but now i am looking it seems the quality does go with the price

Steve

 

[DiscoStu]

My Bosch is one of the higher end Green ones and is a standard 125mm so I don't envisage an issue getting pads. I've not tried a Festool Rotex but as much as I like the Festool brand I can't see that it can do much more that my Bosch? I don't think either will fall apart quickly and in terms of what it actually does (make a bit of sandpaper whirl about) I can't see how the Festool gives more. With things like the Domino and MFT and routers etc I can see that Festool gives you accuracy but a sander doesn't need that sort of thing.

As always this is just my view and you're welcome to tell me I'm wrong - I probably am!

 

[pcb1962]

My Bosch is one of the higher end Green ones and is a standard 125mm so I don't envisage an issue getting pads. I've not tried a Festool Rotex but as much as I like the Festool brand I can't see that it can do much more that my Bosch? I don't think either will fall apart quickly and in terms of what it actually does (make a bit of sandpaper whirl about) I can't see how the Festool gives more.

Vibration is an issue for those who use sanders in their employment ( http://www.hse.gov.uk/vibration/hav/index.htm ).
Your green Bosch is likely designed with little attention to this, whereas a 'pro' tool will certainly have been designed with vibration as a key factor.

 

[RogerP]

My Bosch is one of the higher end Green ones ..........

The "higher end" Bosch professional tools are blue.

 

[SteveF]

The latest festtool EC has a built in anti vibration \ wobble brain
it will slow down if it gets out of control

Steve

 

[woodpig]

Vibration is an issue for those who use sanders in their employment ( http://www.hse.gov.uk/vibration/hav/index.htm ).
Your green Bosch is likely designed with little attention to this, whereas a 'pro' tool will certainly have been designed with vibration as a key factor.

That's a very good point. I wonder if you can reduce the vibration without affecting the efficiency of the tool though. I'm also wondering if there's any data published about individual makes?

In this case then I can see it would be worth spending extra money on a tool if it prevents or reduces injury.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

My Bosch is one of the higher end Green ones and is a standard 125mm so I don't envisage an issue getting pads. I've not tried a Festool Rotex but as much as I like the Festool brand I can't see that it can do much more that my Bosch? I don't think either will fall apart quickly and in terms of what it actually does (make a bit of sandpaper whirl about) I can't see how the Festool gives more. With things like the Domino and MFT and routers etc I can see that Festool gives you accuracy but a sander doesn't need that sort of thing.

As always this is just my view and you're welcome to tell me I'm wrong - I probably am!

I'm with you on the sander. I've got a Bosch blue that I've had many years and its been great. But a mate of mine who moved to a barn conversion in France had to sand 80 million original oak beams above his head so for him he got the Festool because of its light weight and good extraction.

I will say...I also have the Domino and love it...as you say a unique tool thus far. But the MFT, £500 for a piece of precision hole drilled MDF and a clamping frame. Am I missing something there?

 

[pcb1962]

That's a very good point. I wonder if you can reduce the vibration without affecting the efficiency of the tool though. I'm also wondering if there's any data published about individual makes?

In this case then I can see it would be worth spending extra money on a tool if it prevents or reduces injury.

The ROS I have ( http://www.bosch-professional.com/gb/en ... 653-ocs-p/ ) quotes this for vibration:
Vibration emission value ah 2.5 m/s²
Uncertainty K 1.5 m/s²

ETS150/5 quotes this:
Vibration emission level
(3 directions) ah = 5,0 m/s2
Uncertainty K = 2,0 m/s2

and ETS125 this:
Vibration emission level
(3 directions) ah = 4,5 m/s2
Uncertainty K = 2,0 m/s2

I specifically chose the Bosch over a Festool on the basis of those figures as I have the beginnings of a carpal tunnel problem, the Bosch design seems to isolate the body from the motor more effectively than others I've looked at. Mirka are probably same or better than the Bosch but I can't find any figures.

 

[chippy1970]

I've not tried a Festool Rotex but as much as I like the Festool brand I can't see that it can do much more that my Bosch? I don't think either will fall apart quickly and in terms of what it actually does (make a bit of sandpaper whirl about) I can't see how the Festool gives more.

Best thing to do is try one

I had Bob the festool demo guy come out to my workshop to try the 90 and 150. I was surprised how powerful they were. They are gear driven which as far as I know no one else does I stand to be corrected.

In rotex mode it eats through material really quick which my old metabo 450 couldn't do. The bumper is a great idea too , I sanded up some manky old purlins in a loft recently that had painted plaster either side and they came up lovely in no time with no marks on the paint.

 

[SteveF]

That's a very good point. I wonder if you can reduce the vibration without affecting the efficiency of the tool though. I'm also wondering if there's any data published about individual makes?

In this case then I can see it would be worth spending extra money on a tool if it prevents or reduces injury.

The ROS I have ( http://www.bosch-professional.com/gb/en ... 653-ocs-p/ ) quotes this for vibration:
Vibration emission value ah 2.5 m/s²
Uncertainty K 1.5 m/s²

ETS150/5 quotes this:
Vibration emission level
(3 directions) ah = 5,0 m/s2
Uncertainty K = 2,0 m/s2

and ETS125 this:
Vibration emission level
(3 directions) ah = 4,5 m/s2
Uncertainty K = 2,0 m/s2

I specifically chose the Bosch over a Festool on the basis of those figures as I have the beginnings of a carpal tunnel problem, the Bosch design seems to isolate the body from the motor more effectively than others I've looked at. Mirka are probably same or better than the Bosch but I can't find any figures.

Mirka 5650 is 3.4 1.5 but it does have a 5mm orbit

Steve

 

[petermillard]

I've not tried a Festool Rotex but as much as I like the Festool brand I can't see that it can do much more that my Bosch? I don't think either will fall apart quickly and in terms of what it actually does (make a bit of sandpaper whirl about) I can't see how the Festool gives more.

Best thing to do is try one...

Yep, Rotex are totally different animals from regular RO sanders - try and get a demo.

But the MFT, £500 for a piece of precision hole drilled MDF and a clamping frame. Am I missing something there?

Perhaps you're missing a precision hole drilled MDF worktop and a clamping frame? Oh, and a guiderail that drops down to make perfect right-angle cuts, then lifts up out of the way when you don't need it. Mine completely replaced a RAS that was for the most time, just a big lump that was in the way, slap in the middle of a small workshop. Are there alternatives - absolutely! Doesn't make the MFT a bad product though. Just sayin'

Pete

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

I get that it's useful...it's just that price tag again.....is it reasonable?? I guess to those willing to afford it the answer is yes.

 

[Roughcut]

Really enjoying using the Festool Ts55 at the moment.
However I was cutting 45 degree bevels with it yesterday but noticed because the bulk of the saw was tilted over to align the blade at 45 degrees the saw felt as if it wanted to tip off of the track, so I had to use my left hand to hold the base plate down when performing a cut.
Am I doing something wrong or have other users noticed this too?

 

[Doug B]

Having witnessed someone have their saw lift off & cut through the the track as they stretched out towards the end of a cut I tend to have one hand on the base pushing down on to the track at what ever angle I'm cutting.

 

[chippy1970]

Really enjoying using the Festool Ts55 at the moment.
However I was cutting 45 degree bevels with it yesterday but noticed because the bulk of the saw was tilted over to align the blade at 45 degrees the saw felt as if it wanted to tip off of the track, so I had to use my left hand to hold the base plate down when performing a cut.
Am I doing something wrong or have other users noticed this too?

Yeah when doing bevel cuts always keep your other hand pressing down on the base plate to keep the saw located on the rail. When bevelled the weight of the saw naturally wants to fall over. Best to clamp the rail down too.

 

[Roughcut]

Ok thanks for replies Doug and Chippy I just wanted to make sure I wasn't making some school boy error but common sense says to hold the base plate down with the other hand I suppose.
And yes the track was clamped down with Festool quick lever clamps.

 

[MMUK]

Really enjoying using the Festool Ts55 at the moment.
However I was cutting 45 degree bevels with it yesterday but noticed because the bulk of the saw was tilted over to align the blade at 45 degrees the saw felt as if it wanted to tip off of the track, so I had to use my left hand to hold the base plate down when performing a cut.
Am I doing something wrong or have other users noticed this too?

Yeah when doing bevel cuts always keep your other hand pressing down on the base plate to keep the saw located on the rail. When bevelled the weight of the saw naturally wants to fall over. Best to clamp the rail down too.

Funny, don't have that issue with the Makita :wink:

 

[chippy1970]

Really enjoying using the Festool Ts55 at the moment.
However I was cutting 45 degree bevels with it yesterday but noticed because the bulk of the saw was tilted over to align the blade at 45 degrees the saw felt as if it wanted to tip off of the track, so I had to use my left hand to hold the base plate down when performing a cut.
Am I doing something wrong or have other users noticed this too?

Yeah when doing bevel cuts always keep your other hand pressing down on the base plate to keep the saw located on the rail. When bevelled the weight of the saw naturally wants to fall over. Best to clamp the rail down too.

Funny, don't have that issue with the Makita :wink:

Lol

The makita has plenty of its own issues to worry about like that stupidly designed scoring function where the rubber button keeps falling off . Then every time you go to plunge it scores instead.


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