When did the world go mad for Festool?

[woodpig]

The last car survey I looked at wasn't talking about minor blemishes but engine failures etc.

Spot on Bob. :wink:

I think if you can charge five times the going rate for your work because you're paying five times the cost for your tools then you're in a good place. :lol:

 

[DennisCA]

I do have a festool sander (RTS-400), but I only paid 25 euros for it at a 2nd hand shop. I think it was worth the money.

 

[pcb1962]

I think if you can charge five times the going rate for your work because you're paying five times the cost for your tools then you're in a good place. :lol:

OTOH if your expensive tools increase your productivity sufficiently then they will pay for themselves.
Seems to me that the majority of pros here who do use Festool are saying that's the case.

 

[Beau]

I think if you can charge five times the going rate for your work because you're paying five times the cost for your tools then you're in a good place. :lol:

OTOH if your expensive tools increase your productivity sufficiently then they will pay for themselves.
Seems to me that the majority of pros here who do use Festool are saying that's the case.

This is the equation I am interested in.
From this thread it's clearly great for site work (which I do little of) but in the workshop where other tool options are available?

Domino V chisel morticer, Woodrat, tenoning head?

Saw on a track V Nice precise table saw with cross cut carriage?

 

[skronk]

Festool for pros = money makers.
Festool for diyers/hobbyist/gentleman woodworkers = praying the tool will make up for lack of skill.
:lol:

I know a couple of pros with Festool gear who are also praying the tool will make up for skill !! :shock:

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I know a few "pros" (in the sense that they do it for a living) whom I wouldn't allow in my house whatever they were using ...

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

Whilst it's often said jokingly on this forum, the "bloke" behind the tool is a pretty important aspect of the outcome regardless the tools. Chippendale didn't have any Festool!!

In terms of quality outcomes, the principle difference I've noticed between pro and am isn't the finish, it's the speed. I've seen fabulous examples of amateur work on this very forum. Because the maker cared. What the pro's do way better is produce the results in a profitably acceptable timeframe

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I went to school one Saturday morning (many moons ago) to be greeted by my woodwork master telling me that I had get used to working faster, and for practice I had to make a coffee table by lunchtime. As a concession I could drill out the mortices and not have to laquer it. I did it. It wasn't til long after I found out he'd promised one to a church bazaar on the Sunday.
Your point about speed is quite correct, and having the right gear is part of it, though I worked with a relative who wouldn't dream of paying someone £1000 a week - but would happily pay someone £500 a week for three weeks to do the same job. My mother years ago got rid of a gardener because he was too expensive - despite the fact that the guy who replaced him on half the money took three days to do what the first one did in a day. I suspect there are many people like them.

 

[Bodgers]

The tracksaw and the domino basically.

Add to that, decent build quality, the system based concept and you have today's end result.

A good example of a company innovating, and providing a decent quality product resulting in sales and reputation.

If I could afford the stuff. I'd buy it. The closest I came was the tracksaw, but ended up going for the dewalt as I found a factory refurb cheaper.

 

[Alex_E]

I've just invested in a festool router track saw planer and dust extract. And I must say it's 1500 well spent! The quality of the tools is amazing and they have such good fine tube adjusters you can get perfect results! For me I use them to make a living and we find many of our customers are happy to pay top money for top results but also want it doing as fast as possible. A lot of our customers have houses well into the millions and they want to be disrupted as little as possible in terms of time and mess so the festool gear ticks both box's. I've always been a makita fan and have most of the makita tools but in the last year I've found the quality has fallen massively on it and they are no longer reliable! Had problems with my plane circular saw, cordless drill and worse of all my radio!

And problems with tools cost me money not make me money so I'd rather buy higher quality and it should last. Plus the customer service of festool is much better than makita!

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

difficult to argue with that...

 

[AndyT]

difficult to argue with that...

I hope we are still allowed to agree with each other, despite the habits of a vocal few! :lol: :lol:

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

erm is this the right room for an argument
I've told you once
no you didn't
yes I did
no you didn't
er is this the 5 minutes argument or the full half hour!!

 

[n0legs]

FIGHT !!!!! :lol:

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

outside the ice cream van....20 to 4

 

[n0legs]

Bring friends :lol:

 

[Adam9453]

One of the key advantages of a number of festool tools is de-skilling the work which in a business makes it extremely attractive. I run a manufacturing company and its much cheaper in the long run to pay more for machinery or tools that require less expertise to produce the same quality results as you can get cheaper labour to carry out tasks that would otherwise require expensive labour.
I have a mixture of tools from various brands and always try to buy the best tool I can afford.
Regarding comparison, the speciality festool tools such as the domino can't really be compared with other tools because they're obviously quite different but when you compare the skill level and time taken to cut accurate mortise and tenon joints without a festool domino then you would see the dramatic 'game changing' difference others have eluded to.
A coffee table is a good example, even a skilled experienced person would take a number of hours to accurately cut all of the mortise and tenon joints required on even a simplistic coffee table but you can do all the joints with the domino in under an hour even if you're a virtual novice.
Clean up time is also an important factor and with festool tools the extraction is typically 30% better than the competition.
Suffice to say you pay your money and you do the best you can with whatever you have. If you can afford and/or justify festool tools then you'll simply find it easier, faster and cleaner IMO.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

Bring friends :lol:

ah that'd be a bundle not a fight...completely different

 

[n0legs]

Bring friends :lol:

ah that'd be a bundle not a fight...completely different

Bugger, okay make it 10 to 4 instead

 

[n0legs]

Clean up time is also an important factor and with festool tools the extraction is typically 30% better than the competition.
.

I will beg to differ on that point, granted as you say it's in your opinion.
The finest dust extractor I've ever seen and had a go of is the Rupes, I forget it's model number but it's the model around £700-800.
The rep said it creates a dustless working environment and he was right.
Closely followed by the Mirka system.
My BIL owns a bodyshop and we've had on test most of the offerings, including the Festool. It's good but there are better.
I've borrowed most of them to try at home and even on my DeWalt circular saw and 621 router the Rupes and Mirka were absolutely faultless.
Again though, IMHO.

It's horses for courses.
I personally insist on Beta and Knipex insulated tools. My last pair of side cutters cost me £35 or something, but I could buy some from Screwfix for less than a tenner and in my hands they'd both do exactly the same job. The Beta ones will last and work every day, the cheaper ones may not.
Like my mentor told me when I was an apprentice,
"If you use it every day, buy the best there is or you can afford"
"If you use it once a week, buy a good one"
"If it comes out once a month, get something that will get the job done"
"If you never need it more than once, borrow it"