What Oil stone to get?

[bp122]

I am after a medium or fine oil stone. Doesn't have to be combination, in fact I prefer it not to be.

The most common ones I've seen are Norton India ones. But even they vary in price. So don't know which ones are genuine. The prices on eBay are ridiculous for old ones as they have the "vintage" status (seriously, they charge anything they like these days) and not far off from new ones.

Then there are some natural oil stones. Workshop Heaven has one called Rozsutec. Once again, don't know what is their advantage over man made ones.

I have heard of Arkansas as well, but again don't know why it is good or bad.

Can you guys share what you use and why, please?

 

[acxlll]

Can't beat an old washita.
My sharpening routine- grind with a grinder, hit it with washita, than a quick strop on leather with green compund. Done. Hair popping sharpness
I think you could even skip the strop and go to work straight from washita.
They are a bit more expensive than india stones, but well worth it.
India are slower and get less sharp results than a good washita.

Translucent or black arkansas are a bit too slow for me and too expensive for what they do. They are slower than washita, but get the blades a bit sharper.
The vintage ones are bought up by russian guys who slice them up and use in some sort of knife sharpening gizmos, waste of decent stones imho and they drive the prices up a lot. (I frequented a russian knife enthusiast forum, these stones were all the rage there.)

 

[Jacob]

The Norton IB8 is the best beginners and general purpose stone - coarse and medium fine.
£25 or so, new. India IB8 Bench Stone 200mm x 50mm x 25mm - Combination
The "8" refers to the length 8" - there's also a 6" - IB6
I'd also add one more finer stone if you do finer work and basically that's all you will ever need.
There's a massive sharpening craze going on which I would avoid like the plague - you can end up spending huge amounts on all sorts of useless kit. I've done it myself and learned the expensive way! I wake up in the middle of the night wondering why on earth I spent £200 on 3 diamond plates which work no better than the Nortons and similar, but wear out a lot faster.
PS Rozsutec stone only 6" and not cheap. I wouldn't bother.
The Norton combi or similar (there are/were lots of other brands) were the standard stones everywhere, schools, training establishments, industry.
PPS Had a look on ebay - seem to be plenty there at OK prices under £20. Avoid the very cheap grey carborundum offerings.
I've noticed that our well known tool boutiques don't sell normal oil stones they only sell fancy kit for enthusiasts. No profit I guess - buy one oil stone and thats it for life!

 

[Cabinetman]

Absolutely agree about the diamond plates, I bought one and it was more than I really wanted to spend and it just didn’t last very long at all, and I can’t say it did the job any better than my oil stone.
A friend of mine wanted to sharpen his chisels and I said I would look for a stone for him, I’ve always used a Norton combination oil stone but the packaging has long long gone so I don’t know what the grit sizes are, The problem that occurs is that most of the stones offered don’t tell you what the grit sizes are either and the ones that do vary quite dramatically, so I made an educated guess and the stone is perfectly good for what he wants but the smooth side is a lot more coarse than mine, now I hear on here people saying they use 4000 grit, but that’s just silly, so for somebody like me that makes furniture for a living and sharpens probably every day and hasn’t got time to mess about with "scary sharp"what grit size should I have been looking for?Ian

 

[Jacob]

Absolutely agree about the diamond plates, I bought one and it was more than I really wanted to spend and it just didn’t last very long at all, and I can’t say it did the job any better than my oil stone.
A friend of mine wanted to sharpen his chisels and I said I would look for a stone for him, I’ve always used a Norton combination oil stone but the packaging has long long gone so I don’t know what the grit sizes are, The problem that occurs is that most of the stones offered don’t tell you what the grit sizes are either and the ones that do vary quite dramatically, so I made an educated guess and the stone is perfectly good for what he wants but the smooth side is a lot more coarse than mine, now I hear on here people saying they use 4000 grit, but that’s just silly, so for somebody like me that makes furniture for a living and sharpens probably every day and hasn’t got time to mess about with "scary sharp"what grit size should I have been looking for?Ian

A finer combi is the Norton "0". I've had one for years and didn't realise it had a number until I cleaned the gunge off the end! Works really well side by side with the IB8. Probably only available 2nd hand, I don't know. I've had several no-name fine synthetic stones which were light brown colour and seemed to be same fine quality. Lots of them around on ebay.
Sharpening is a big money spinner and a suspicious person might start thinking that cheap and effective alternatives are not well publicised. Pass me the camellia oil!

 

[bp122]

What do IB 8 and IB 6 mean?

And why are the bench stones larger than normal stones?

 

[Jacob]

What do IB 8 and IB 6 mean?

And why are the bench stones larger than normal stones?

8 eight inches long, 6 is six. Other than that just obscure Norton numbers, they don't make it very clear!
Bench stones are 'normal stones' aren't they? 2x8" is the commonest size and has been for generations, but other sizes available

 

[bp122]

8 eight inches long, 6 is six. Other than that just obscure Norton numbers, they don't make it very clear!
Bench stones are 'normal stones' aren't they? 2x8" is the commonest size and has been for generations, but other sizes available

Ah, thanks for explaining. I got confused because some sellers on eBay are charging over £30 for the same stone (£20 odd) labelled as bench stones.

 

[Jacob]

Ah, thanks for explaining. I got confused because some sellers on eBay are charging over £30 for the same stone (£20 odd) labelled as bench stones.

If you go ebay way get one with the wooden box too. They are essential - mainly to keep the bench clean by trapping the oil and also to stop them drying out.

 

[bp122]

Good shout, will do.

 

[Jacob]

Come to think, "Norton IB8" and "Norton "0" Combination" are the only stones I've ever had of which I've known the model number. There are hundreds of other good ones out there - have to take a chance perhaps, but not spend too much!

 

[D_W]

I am after a medium or fine oil stone. Doesn't have to be combination, in fact I prefer it not to be.

The most common ones I've seen are Norton India ones. But even they vary in price. So don't know which ones are genuine. The prices on eBay are ridiculous for old ones as they have the "vintage" status (seriously, they charge anything they like these days) and not far off from new ones.

Then there are some natural oil stones. Workshop Heaven has one called Rozsutec. Once again, don't know what is their advantage over man made ones.

I have heard of Arkansas as well, but again don't know why it is good or bad.

Can you guys share what you use and why, please?

Rozsutec is usually a finer stone - but not as fine as something like a black arkansas. What I use of oilstones:

most of the time with a grinder - fine india (don't scuff the surface, let it settle in) and either a hard Arkansas from dan's or a washita, light buffing if very high sharpness is needed.

If using a rotation of stones without a grinder:
* medium crystolon (in an oil bath)
* fine india (in an oil bath)
* the hard or washita as mentioned above. I don't scuff the washita, either. If you scuff a medium natural oilstone or don't, the difference between those two options is large.
* buff or compound on a backer if you are doing something like paring or finish planing.

Not an expensive setup - but will match or better any expensive setup that I can think of.

Note if you buy an india stone, within a short period of time, it'll be about 1/5th as coarse as it is when new, so don't overreact with how brash and coarse it is at first.

 

[Cabinetman]

Rozsutec is usually a finer stone - but not as fine as something like a black arkansas. What I use of oilstones:

most of the time with a grinder - fine india (don't scuff the surface, let it settle in) and either a hard Arkansas from dan's or a washita, light buffing if very high sharpness is needed.

If using a rotation of stones without a grinder:
* medium crystolon (in an oil bath)
* fine india (in an oil bath)
* the hard or washita as mentioned above. I don't scuff the washita, either. If you scuff a medium natural oilstone or don't, the difference between those two options is large.
* buff or compound on a backer if you are doing something like paring or finish planing.

Not an expensive setup - but will match or better any expensive setup that I can think of.

Note if you buy an india stone, within a short period of time, it'll be about 1/5th as coarse as it is when new, so don't overreact with how brash and coarse it is at first.

Not really following what you’re saying I’m afraid Doug, what do you mean by scuffing? " I don’t scuff the washita either? " Translation problem maybe, over here if you scuff something you’ve damaged it. Ian
Ps interesting what you say about 80% usage after a while on the India

 

[TRITON]

I'm going to throw the curve-ball into this.
Oil/Wood BAD COMBINATION

I just won't have oil in my woodshop(I've another room where my bikes live, so oil stays there) It's easily spilled, and a single drop left on a surface can ruin any bit of timber, so I reckon it's just not worth taking the risk.
Waterstones, be they ceramic or diamond or a wheelstone etc you will never have a problem with. It cuts just the same, and maybe the only difference is you need to splash a bit on more often, but it also means cleaning the stone of particles can be done in a sink. Oil saturates the stone container, gets on your hands, contaminates everything it comes into contact with and isnt easily removed.

 

[Cabinetman]

I'm going to throw the curve-ball into this.
Oil/Wood BAD COMBINATION

I just won't have oil in my woodshop(I've another room where my bikes live, so oil stays there) It's easily spilled, and a single drop left on a surface can ruin any bit of timber, so I reckon it's just not worth taking the risk.
Waterstones, be they ceramic or diamond or a wheelstone etc you will never have a problem with. It cuts just the same, and maybe the only difference is you need to splash a bit on more often, but it also means cleaning the stone of particles can be done in a sink. Oil saturates the stone container, gets on your hands, contaminates everything it comes into contact with and isnt easily removed.

Well all I can say is you must be a messy little monkey, never ever yet got oil on a piece of wood I was doing anything with, I’ve never considered it to be a problem. Ian

 

[TRITON]

 

[Jacob]

I'm going to throw the curve-ball into this.
Oil/Wood BAD COMBINATION

I just won't have oil in my woodshop(I've another room where my bikes live, so oil stays there) It's easily spilled, and a single drop left on a surface can ruin any bit of timber, so I reckon it's just not worth taking the risk.
Waterstones, be they ceramic or diamond or a wheelstone etc you will never have a problem with. It cuts just the same, and maybe the only difference is you need to splash a bit on more often, but it also means cleaning the stone of particles can be done in a sink. Oil saturates the stone container, gets on your hands, contaminates everything it comes into contact with and isnt easily removed.

Can't say I've ever had as problem with oil and wood in my workshop in the last 50 years or so. A few clean rags is all you need. Mystified!
Can say I've had problems with water - it's called "rust". A lot of other people complain about it too! Not good for wood either

 

[Jacob]

.......

Note if you buy an india stone, within a short period of time, it'll be about 1/5th as coarse as it is when new, so don't overreact with how brash and coarse it is at first.

They all lose their new sharpness. Not by a dramatic amount, except diamonds which eventually disappear without trace - it's only ever a thin layer of dust, nothing like the thickness of natural or alox stones.

 

[D_W]

My point is that a lot of people start with a crystolon or india stone, use it once or twice and determine that it's too coarse for their use. It'll settle in to a comfortable range if someone gives it a chance (specifically with the india stone). If the crystolon stone is new and in an oil bath, it'll always shed particles, but fast is the point with crystolon, so that's a good thing.

My fine india stone probably has "320" grit, but behaves more like a 1000 grit waterstone that can't be gouged.

 

[Stan]

This oil on wood thing is interesting.

I bought a set of six Wickes chisels in a plastic case a few months ago - plenty good enough for a novice like me. I oiled them to keep rust at bay, and found the oil was staining wood that I was working on. I found out from youtube how to make my own wax. For parts of tools that come into contact with wood I now use only wax, with oil for the rest. This has cured the staining problem and still prevents rust well.

I don't know why only the oil caused staining. Perhaps somebody can explain?