Wadkin AGS10 restoration

[Krysstel]

Definitely an AGS10. I even have the original handbook.

Have emailed Forrest and a couple of other suppliers but it'll likely be a bit pricey !

Mark

 

[Krysstel]

Evening all

Need a bit of help with the removal of the trunnion assembly.
I've removed both trunnion trapping plates and the rise/fall handle and the whole assembly is now loose. But how do I get it out of the main saw tub ? Do I have to also remove the rise & fall shaft bearing housing as well or should I be able to maneuver the whole lot out as is ?

 

[Krysstel]

Couple more things

Under the spindle assembly. What are the square headed bolt and the grub screw with locking nut for ?
Also, the 2 large headed pins that hold on the riving knife bracket. How does one remove them ?

The spindle bearings don't appear to have any movement in them and are completely quiet. Is it really worth me replacing them ? It doesn't seem to be a difficult job if they need to later.

Can anyone see from the motor identification sign whether this is a 2hp or a 3hp motor ?
I can see it confirmed that it's dual voltage and 3 phase but I unsure of the hp or watts.

Thanks a lot for all your help

Mark

 

[Vann]

...Can anyone see from the motor identification sign whether this is a 2hp or a 3hp motor ?
I can see it confirmed that it's dual voltage and 3 phase but I unsure of the hp or watts.

I see it's pulling 3.15amps in 400v mode. My 4hp saw pulls 5.8amps. The comparison is not accurate, but I'd expect a 3hp motor to be pulling closer to 4.5amps.

I'd guess it's a 2hp motor.

Edit: What's the "2.0" stamped at the bottom left of that tag (below the "BSG2")? Could that be the hp rating?

Cheers, Vann.

 

[memzey]

It’s a 2hp motor. When getting the trunnions out it’s easier to remove the rise and fall shaft as well. IIRC there is a well hidden grub screw holding it it place which you can only really get to with the table off.

 

[deema]

There are normally two separate grub screws under the shaft holding it on.

 

[Krysstel]

It’s a 2hp motor. When getting the trunnions out it’s easier to remove the rise and fall shaft as well. IIRC there is a well hidden grub screw holding it it place which you can only really get to with the table off.

A friend has told me the 5.5/3.15 refers to 5.5A at 230V or 3.15A at 400V and that the result should be x 1.732 since this is 3-phase (we have 230V 3-phase here in Norway).
Ie; P = (V x I) x 1.732
Thus giving 2182W for 400V 3-phase and 2190W for 230V 3-phase.
Or approx 3hp.

Is this ìncorrect ?

 

[SammyQ]

Under the spindle assembly. What are the square headed bolt and the grub screw with locking nut for ?

These are for adjusting the limit of movement. The nut locks the threaded part at the right length. Probably factory adjusted. Leave it unless the blade won't go fully down below the table.

Also, the 2 large headed pins that hold on the riving knife bracket. How does one remove them ?

They are bolts; flat circles are their heads. Move the elevation assembly down with the wheel to its lowest position and you should see the nylock nuts that hold the bolt heads. Undo. Riving knife bracket comes free.

The spindle bearings don't appear to have any movement in them and are completely quiet. Is it really worth me replacing them ? It doesn't seem to be a difficult job if they need to later.

Mine were a total and utter bear, because the pulley at the motor end of the spindle had fused itself to the Woodruff Key and the shaft. Replacing the bearings is a methodical, straightforward job after that. Modern bearing stockists have readily available ones. Note carefully the designation on the old ones, or better still, take them along with you to your stockist.

I've removed both trunnion trapping plates and the rise/fall handle and the whole assembly is now loose. But how do I get it out of the main saw tub ? Do I have to also remove the rise & fall shaft bearing housing as well or should I be able to maneuver the whole lot out as is ?

Yup. As said above, rise & fall shaft bearing housing has to be withdrawn from operator's position at tthe front of the saw. Not only does it have two allen-headed (B.S. hex) set screws hiding on the casting, you have to rotate the housing 90 degrees as you withdraw it through the curved slot on the cast iron cabinet. Take the opportunity to fully dismantle it and clean/regrease the beast while it's out.

The major internal casting can be made easier to lift if you unbolt the blade arbour and riving knife plate.

N.B. The rise and fall casting pivots on a MASSIVE pin held into the larger casting by two allen-headed set screws (B.S. again). BEWARE you don't damage this separating the two castings for cleaning or painting.

No, you shouldn't have to remove the shaft attached to the adjustment wheel. Just be VERY careful re the worm engagement, especially on reassembly, when you are dropping the main casting (tilt portion) back in. It is heavier than you think. The shaft CAN be got out fairly easily, just taper pins in the bushes etc. Make sure you identify the WIDER end, then tap with a hardened punch (cut off masonry nail) on the SMALLER end! Also, look out for the copper or bronze 'washers' used and replace them in the right sequence/place.

It pays to clean everything thoroughly, then PTFE-based lube spray does a lot. Especdialy on sliding faces of trunions.

I've got photos - not good ones - from eons ago when I did mine. Suggest you do too. It helps bucket loads when you're re-assembling. The original Wadkin AGS 10" manual is also superb if you stare at the parts diagram long enough; you eventually learn to think in three dimensions, and everything becomes clear, even if it is a dirty, ache-inducing limbo dance to fettle the bits back into place. If you've done your homework, things are faster. DAMHIKT...

Good Luck and enjoy.

Sam

 

[Krysstel]

Thanks for some great info Sam.

A couple of question though

Under the spindle assembly. What are the square headed bolt and the grub screw with locking nut for ?

These are for adjusting the limit of movement. The nut locks the threaded part at the right length. Probably factory adjusted. Leave it unless the blade won't go fully down below the table.

Why two bolts ? One square headed without a locking nut and one grubscrew with locking nut.
I do need to adjust these as the blade doesn't go fully down.

The spindle bearings don't appear to have any movement in them and are completely quiet. Is it really worth me replacing them ? It doesn't seem to be a difficult job if they need to later.

Mine were a total and utter bear, because the pulley at the motor end of the spindle had fused itself to the Woodruff Key and the shaft. Replacing the bearings is a methodical, straightforward job after that. Modern bearing stockists have readily available ones. Note carefully the designation on the old ones, or better still, take them along with you to your stockist..

But it's OK to not touch the bearings if they appear to be both quiet and without any play ?

No, you shouldn't have to remove the shaft attached to the adjustment wheel. Just be VERY careful re the worm engagement, especially on reassembly, when you are dropping the main casting (tilt portion) back in. It is heavier than you think. The shaft CAN be got out fairly easily, just taper pins in the bushes etc. Make sure you identify the WIDER end, then tap with a hardened punch (cut off masonry nail) on the SMALLER end! Also, look out for the copper or bronze 'washers' used and replace them in the right sequence/place.

Sorry, bit confused. Which shaft is this ? The rise and fall shaft or the tilt shaft ?

I've got photos - not good ones - from eons ago when I did mine. Suggest you do too. It helps bucket loads when you're re-assembling. The original Wadkin AGS 10" manual is also superb if you stare at the parts diagram long enough; you eventually learn to think in three dimensions, and everything becomes clear, even if it is a dirty, ache-inducing limbo dance to fettle the bits back into place. If you've done your homework, things are faster. DAMHIKT...

Yep ! Have photographed everything.
All the pictures are in the Google album I linked to earlier.

Mark

 

[SammyQ]

Tilt shaft I meant; long one that goes transversely across cabinet. Rise and fall is much shorter and is inside thallic housing that comes out through the 'smile'.

Bearings quiet? Leave 'em alone.

Square nut etc: Will have a look and report back.

Sam

 

[memzey]

There is a square nut that retains the gib strip in place. Could that be it?

 

[Krysstel]

There is a square nut that retains the gib strip in place. Could that be it?

I've arrowed the bolts in question in the picture below.

 

[memzey]

Nah. The gib strip would be behind where you have placed the text “Square Screw”. Can’t remember what those ones are for or even if my one has them.

 

[Krysstel]

Hi again

Do we know the RAL code for the green hammerite colour used +/- 1963 ?

 

[Krysstel]

Can anyone help me ?
Still trying to remove the trunnions and am having trouble removing the rise & fall shaft bearing housing.

Sam previously said there were two allen-headed (B.S. hex) set screws hiding on the casting but either I'm blind or my saw doesn't have them !

This picture is from the front and you can just see two bolt heads (approx 16mm). I removed them but that didn't help.

The next picture is taken from the back of the housing.
There's a pin (5 dia x 40 long grovelock spring dowel in the parts list, no. 53) through the shaft, just behind the worm drive, but I can't see any allen-headed screw in the raise and fall shaft bearing housing.

 

[SammyQ]

Gawd...It's a LONG time since I took mine apart...but..I'm changing the dust removal on mine, so I'll lift the lid and have a shufti tomorrow for you. That square headed screw you mentioned earlier is nagging away at me too. :?:

Sorry for no immediate answer.

Sam

 

[Krysstel]

Thanks Sam. Much appreciated.

I'm trying to lift out the whole trunnion assembly but what's stopping me is the part of the rise/fall housing on the outside, behind the handwheel, where the tilt angle pointer screws on. That bit stops me pulling the whole lot through and out of the tub from the inside.
It seems to me that part of the housing has to be removed separately but I can't for the life of me see how !

Mark

 

[SammyQ]

Quick archive search:

If you go to the OLDER AGS 10" manual by Daltons? The 3-D diagram on page two shows the problem!!

You've removed parts 37 and 37 (!) put 'em back quick before the castings separate... ...You are looking for part 70, which is a sly wee bugger that locates the thallic shaft (part 40) in the castings, part 39 and 27. From memory, it's an allen key removal, down the side of the casting. Take a brush to accumulated sawdust and a torch or/and hand mirror to locate it.

I'll try to attach my pdf of the manual. Alternatively, PM me and I'll email it to you.#

Sam

 

[SammyQ]

This forum's software is graphically horrible, encoded by a cack-handed, I.Q in single figures, Darwin Award reject, with ADHD in spades, to the power 'n'...it won't let me upload either a screen shot or pdf :duno: PM me!!

Sam

 

[SammyQ]

Right Mark, here's hoping...

The thallic housing looks like this:

As you can see, there is a through hole on the side. Part 70 has an end exactly shaped to fit in this hole, and is screwed into casting 27, see below.

From memory, it's the third hole from the front, low down, just in front of the transverse teeth at the rear of the casting

I still do not have a baldy what that square headed screw does, but the thread sticking up from a nut flush with the surface of the casting is definitely the blade height adjustment/stop.

STOP!! GOT IT!!!

look through 'the smile'...

See the slotted screw? "That's Yer Mon, Big Lad!" Undo it and the willie-shaped wotsit should slide out...rubber hammer to encourage it?

Sam