Vice advice for a beginner please!

[WannabeeCarpenter]

I'm now the very happy owner of my first workbench and want to fit a vice for woodworking.

The choice is huge and as a complete novice I don't really know what to look for. My initial questions if somebody could help please, are:

• Would something like THIS be ok for a novice?
• Is 7" sufficient for DIY/project use or should I future-proof and go larger?
• Does the vice need to be mounted so that it's level with the bench surface or is this unimportant? That's probably a dumb question......!

Thanks in advance

James

 

[Bm101]

Try and find one of these local to you James. If you hang on and keep looking you will find one and have a superior vice for less money.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-...407447?hash=item3db6f35d17:g:q~IAAOSwkwFgMnMu

 

[Phil Pascoe]

It's fine, but bigger would be better. You'll get 101 opinions on how to fit it, but don't fit it flush with the bench, you'll damage your tools. Set it down 12mm - 15mm to allow a strip of wood to cover the top of both jaws.

As above - hunt for a Record. If you're lucky you'll find one locally as the P&P is expensive which limits their appeal.

 

[MARK.B.]

If you mount your vice proud of the bench top then that area becomes a dead space for working on your bench, if say you were working on a door or suchlike then the vice prevents you using the full area of the workbench top

 

[shed9]

There is a Charlies near Shorpshire and they do the Eclipse 9" version of that vice for £72. I'm fairly sure they are open in your area.

That said, as others have mentioned you will get more for your money with an old Record or similar style but do a bit of research before you go that route, they sometimes have issues (hence they are for sale) or will need some work to clean up. If your looking for a ready to go solution the Eclipse is a fairly decent vice.

 

[Ttrees]

It looks like a good vice, but I would do some research to see what the castings are like,
as in... have any of them had flaws which broke them, not talking about aesthetics or sharp edges which a file would make nice in 5 mins.

I bought a no.52 for reasonable money,
(One thing to watch out for if buying secondhand, is some may have hairline cracks which render them useless, unless one want's to do a big job making bits or getting one fixed)
Alas, I wasn't aware that there was such a difference in the size that the 52 1/2 opens to compared to the other.

I am curious to see what folks make use of the extra opening for?

Last week member Orraloon posted this interesting link...
https://www.popularwoodworking.com/...an-auxiliary-vise-jaw-to-hold-awkward-pieces/
Tom

 

[Bm101]

What Phil and Mark say...101 different opinions but it has to be below the top of the bench. The main difference of how people fit a vice is flush with the side of the bench or proud so it stands off. Most people fit a wooden face to one or both jaws depending what their preference is for flush or proud. You can make this bit flush with the top of the bench. Good luck.
As Shed9 says, a modern one will more than likely be great as well. I'd rather get an older one and clean it up but that's just me.

 

[WannabeeCarpenter]

Try and find one of these local to you James. If you hang on and keep looking you will find one and have a superior vice for less money.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-...407447?hash=item3db6f35d17:g:q~IAAOSwkwFgMnMu

It's fine, but bigger would be better. You'll get 101 opinions on how to fit it, but don't fit it flush with the bench, you'll damage your tools. Set it down 12mm - 15mm to allow a strip of wood to cover the top of both jaws.

As above - hunt for a Record. If you're lucky you'll find one locally as the P&P is expensive which limits their appeal.

If you mount your vice proud of the bench top then that area becomes a dead space for working on your bench, if say you were working on a door or suchlike then the vice prevents you using the full area of the workbench top

There is a Charlies near Shorpshire and they do the Eclipse 9" version of that vice for £72. I'm fairly sure they are open in your area.

That said, as others have mentioned you will get more for your money with an old Record or similar style but do a bit of research before you go that route, they sometimes have issues (hence they are for sale) or will need some work to clean up. If your looking for a ready to go solution the Eclipse is a fairly decent vice.

It looks like a good vice, but I would do some research to see what the castings are like,
as in... have any of them had flaws which broke them, not talking about aesthetics or sharp edges which a file would make nice in 5 mins.

I bought a no.52 for reasonable money,
(One thing to watch out for if buying secondhand, is some may have hairline cracks which render them useless, unless one want's to do a big job making bits or getting one fixed)
Alas, I wasn't aware that there was such a difference in the size that the 52 1/2 opens to compared to the other.

I am curious to see what folks make use of the extra opening for?

Last week member Orraloon posted this interesting link...
https://www.popularwoodworking.com/...an-auxiliary-vise-jaw-to-hold-awkward-pieces/
Tom

What Phil and Mark say...101 different opinions but it has to be below the top of the bench. The main difference of how people fit a vice is flush with the side of the bench or proud so it stands off. Most people fit a wooden face to one or both jaws depending what their preference is for flush or proud. You can make this bit flush with the top of the bench. Good luck.
As Shed9 says, a modern one will more than likely be great as well. I'd rather get an older one and clean it up but that's just me.

Guys, guys, guys!

Thank you SO much for responding so quickly with such useful info - it's helped no end and I'm taking on board every single comment.

James

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I am curious to see what folks make use of the extra opening for?

 

[Ttrees]

I suppose if that was a plinth for carving, it'd be handy and quick to move about, or for a quick chamfer around the edges of said plinth seems a good reason to have a vice opening that large.
I've just never seen a real 'no other reasonable way for a one off solution' for an opening that large, if that makes sense.
Not trying to argue that a bigger vice doesn't make sense....

Definitely wasn't miffed with myself for not clicking, that the no.52 1/2 vice, had a substantially larger opening capacity, especially after subscribing to that big Record vice thread which I glossed over a few times!

Tom

 

[TominDales]

Try and get 9 inch wide as future proof. I broke my fathers cheap 6 inch draper. Record as mentioned on ebay is best, but check is in good condition. Get a quick release and a dog hole if possible. If the spring breaks its relatively eady to fit a replacement. I have two Parkinsons (the origional that record copied) still going after 100 years. For new, ive heard Eclipse do well made do a reasonable copy.
As mentioned fit 1/4 inch below surface of bench to avoid tools hitting face. Use 2 wood chocks underneath to avheive theis depth.
Dont have to recess flush to front face, I did in my day but its a waste of time and there are better was to secure long boards and being a bit proad of the apron is useful. Fit wood inserts to jaws to protect your work from the steel. Some even cover one face with a piece of leather to aid grip. Good luck.

 

[Dr W]

One thing to keep in mind about these vices is that they are very heavy, awkwardly shaped - and like as not covered in slippery machine oil. All of which can make bolting them to the underside of a workbench quite a challenge, especially if you're working solo.
I'm sure everyone has their own way of dealing with that but FWIW, here's how I fitted mine recently to my manky old workbench (this vice being an ex-school Eclipse 51 1/2 that I bought from eBay).

In case it's not clear from the photo what's going on, the nice piece of 22mm birch ply is the front jaw lining, which protrudes about 5mm above the top of the metal jaws but sits flush with the bench top. The yellowing scrap of pine is clamped very firmly in the vice jaws (sitting flush with top of the jaw liner). I then bolted an off-cut of scaffold board at right angles to that VERY securely with long coach screws. This piece then just sits on the bench, holding the vice effortlessly in just the right position, while I muck about underneath with packing and holes etc to bolt it into place.
Cannot emphasise enough how important it is to make sure everything is held securely, that the jaws can't slip, and that the bit of wood resting on the bench is strong & long enough to prevent the vice falling off while you're fitting it - but for me this was a much easier method than trying to support the vice from underneath while sorting out the mounting hardware.

All the best,
Stuart

 

[TominDales]

Read up on where to site it on the bench. Usual to place just a couple inches inside of the leg. Right handers site it on front left hand end and lefties to the right so that you plane towards the vice.

 

[Bod]

One thing to keep in mind about these vices is that they are very heavy, awkwardly shaped - and like as not covered in slippery machine oil. All of which can make bolting them to the underside of a workbench quite a challenge, especially if you're working solo.
I'm sure everyone has their own way of dealing with that but FWIW, here's how I fitted mine recently to my manky old workbench (this vice being an ex-school Eclipse 51 1/2 that I bought from eBay).
View attachment 104491
In case it's not clear from the photo what's going on, the nice piece of 22mm birch ply is the front jaw lining, which protrudes about 5mm above the top of the metal jaws but sits flush with the bench top. The yellowing scrap of pine is clamped very firmly in the vice jaws (sitting flush with top of the jaw liner). I then bolted an off-cut of scaffold board at right angles to that VERY securely with long coach screws. This piece then just sits on the bench, holding the vice effortlessly in just the right position, while I muck about underneath with packing and holes etc to bolt it into place.
Cannot emphasise enough how important it is to make sure everything is held securely, that the jaws can't slip, and that the bit of wood resting on the bench is strong & long enough to prevent the vice falling off while you're fitting it - but for me this was a much easier method than trying to support the vice from underneath while sorting out the mounting hardware.

All the best,
Stuart

Genius!
By far the easiest way of supporting the vice in the correct place.

Bod

 

[TominDales]

One thing to keep in mind about these vices is that they are very heavy, awkwardly shaped - and like as not covered in slippery machine oil. All of which can make bolting them to the underside of a workbench quite a challenge, especially if you're working solo.
I'm sure everyone has their own way of dealing with that but FWIW, here's how I fitted mine recently to my manky old workbench (this vice being an ex-school Eclipse 51 1/2 that I bought from eBay).
View attachment 104491
In case it's not clear from the photo what's going on, the nice piece of 22mm birch ply is the front jaw lining, which protrudes about 5mm above the top of the metal jaws but sits flush with the bench top. The yellowing scrap of pine is clamped very firmly in the vice jaws (sitting flush with top of the jaw liner). I then bolted an off-cut of scaffold board at right angles to that VERY securely with long coach screws. This piece then just sits on the bench, holding the vice effortlessly in just the right position, while I muck about underneath with packing and holes etc to bolt it into place.
Cannot emphasise enough how important it is to make sure everything is held securely, that the jaws can't slip, and that the bit of wood resting on the bench is strong & long enough to prevent the vice falling off while you're fitting it - but for me this was a much easier method than trying to support the vice from underneath while sorting out the mounting hardware.

All the best,
Stuart

Brilliant the trad way on a small bench was to turn the bench upside down. This is clever.

 

[bp122]

Advice on using an older vice is sound.

But if you are indeed in a hurry and can't find an older one close to you, look at Paul Sellers' recommendation on a voice that he had used on his recent workbenches.

And generally Amazon isn't a good place to buy from, as it wouldn't be the best price.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

There is a thread here on vice fitting for anyone who wishes to search for it.

 

[pe2dave]

If you think of your vice as your third hand... Used every time in the workshop...
IMHO worth investing as much as you can?
An old record met my needs and is still a friend. Jaws replaced 3 times. Each one lined with leather (grip).
Never regretted the cost.

 

[Bm101]

Just thinking you might like this thread Wanabe.
https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/threads/20th-century-colour-add-vise-fitted-it-finally.123143/

One thing to keep in mind about these vices is that they are very heavy, awkwardly shaped - and like as not covered in slippery machine oil. All of which can make bolting them to the underside of a workbench quite a challenge, especially if you're working solo.
I'm sure everyone has their own way of dealing with that but FWIW, here's how I fitted mine recently to my manky old workbench (this vice being an ex-school Eclipse 51 1/2 that I bought from eBay).
View attachment 104491
In case it's not clear from the photo what's going on, the nice piece of 22mm birch ply is the front jaw lining, which protrudes about 5mm above the top of the metal jaws but sits flush with the bench top. The yellowing scrap of pine is clamped very firmly in the vice jaws (sitting flush with top of the jaw liner). I then bolted an off-cut of scaffold board at right angles to that VERY securely with long coach screws. This piece then just sits on the bench, holding the vice effortlessly in just the right position, while I muck about underneath with packing and holes etc to bolt it into place.
Cannot emphasise enough how important it is to make sure everything is held securely, that the jaws can't slip, and that the bit of wood resting on the bench is strong & long enough to prevent the vice falling off while you're fitting it - but for me this was a much easier method than trying to support the vice from underneath while sorting out the mounting hardware.

All the best,
Stuart

That's a good option, an even easier way is a length of timber flush on the bench side and butted on the floor. Tighten the vice up and it holds itself in place tightly against the underside of the bench. Same thing, less screws and can't be dropped. Both will get the job done equally well of course!

 

[WannabeeCarpenter]

Try and get 9 inch wide as future proof. I broke my fathers cheap 6 inch draper. Record as mentioned on ebay is best, but check is in good condition. Get a quick release and a dog hole if possible. If the spring breaks its relatively eady to fit a replacement. I have two Parkinsons (the origional that record copied) still going after 100 years. For new, ive heard Eclipse do well made do a reasonable copy.
As mentioned fit 1/4 inch below surface of bench to avoid tools hitting face. Use 2 wood chocks underneath to avheive theis depth.
Dont have to recess flush to front face, I did in my day but its a waste of time and there are better was to secure long boards and being a bit proad of the apron is useful. Fit wood inserts to jaws to protect your work from the steel. Some even cover one face with a piece of leather to aid grip. Good luck.

Thank you!!