Up and down lights, is there a problem??

[mg123]

Hi guys,

I've got quite a few up and down lights outside of my house. 4 on the front of my garage, 1 on PIR and 1 on a switch at the front of my house, and added 6 to the new extension.
Something I've recently noticed with them. the top lights are no longer functioning as they should. They've all become really dim and barely light up. There are several different brands of fixtures, as well as different bulbs. But they all experience this issue.
Do any of you know what causes this, or maybe you've had a similar issue to me? Or perhaps any recommendations to prevent the issue.
I'm really p***ed off with the issue. I guess its something to do with the sun perhaps as it only impacts the top lights.
The bulbs are from reputable source. The garage lights were added early last year. They've not been in use this year as I had a rewire done which meant they're not currently wired in as i'm still doing some work.
The ones at the front of the house were added when the rewire was done by the electrician, and these are the ones I noticed this issue first.
I then tested the ones from the garage and newest ones on the extension. Almost every bulb that's fitted in the up position suffers with this issue.

Any ideas?

 

[Sideways]

Most likely in my view would be a simple case of inadequate design of weather sealing.
Rain will want to run into the upward pointing lights and flow downhill so it will naturally tend to find it's way into the connector with the lamp, into the contacts and even get drawn into the wires between the strands of copper. In all places it will cause corrosion over time and that could cause these problems.
If the bulbs themselves are any good, they will be hermetically sealed. If you were to remove the bulbs and clean them, they should work fine in a good fitting. That would prove the source of your problem.

 

[Sideways]

I don't see any solution to this other than only using good quality light fittings that avoid this problem from the outset.

 

[MarkAW]

Could just be a case that the glass on top is dirty from weather

 

[HamsterJam]

This is interesting.
Not up/down lighters but a couple of years back I had my workshop professionally wired including a LED PIR bulkhead fitting above the door. This is under an overhang and on a Northern elevation so protected from rain and sun.
The first PIR lamp lasted only days and was replaced under warranty. The replacement was the same make/model and failed a few weeks later. The electrician then fitted a third lamp but a different make/model and that lasted several months. I replaced it with a fourth fitting last year of yet another make/model and that has recently failed too.
Each time the failure appears to be the LED lamps gradually giving up, rather than the PIR.
This sounds similar to your problem.
I am wondering what’s causing this. Could it be spikes from the machinery (even though the PIR lamp is hardly ever on when the machines are) or could it be our solar PV? Would an SPD (Surge Protection Device) in the consumer unit in the workshop help? (We already have an SPD in the house).

 

[mg123]

Most likely in my view would be a simple case of inadequate design of weather sealing.
Rain will want to run into the upward pointing lights and flow downhill so it will naturally tend to find it's way into the connector with the lamp, into the contacts and even get drawn into the wires between the strands of copper. In all places it will cause corrosion over time and that could cause these problems.
If the bulbs themselves are any good, they will be hermetically sealed. If you were to remove the bulbs and clean them, they should work fine in a good fitting. That would prove the source of your problem.

I had a similar thought to you, but there is no evidence or sign of water ingress. There are 3 different brands of fitting as well as 3 different brands of lamps which is why I found it odd that they all had this issue. The fittings all seem well designed, the female thread on the up light is at the top and screws onto the fitting itself and the female thread is on the fitting and the cover screws into the down lighter, and also has a rubber gasket so it should present a minimal chance of water ingress.
I'll have to give them a closer inspection and see what I can find

 

[mg123]

Could just be a case that the glass on top is dirty from weather

The glass is clean, I've switched the up and down lamps around to check if it was the lamp or the fixture causing the issue and it is the lamp itself

 

[mg123]

This is interesting.
Not up/down lighters but a couple of years back I had my workshop professionally wired including a LED PIR bulkhead fitting above the door. This is under an overhang and on a Northern elevation so protected from rain and sun.
The first PIR lamp lasted only days and was replaced under warranty. The replacement was the same make/model and failed a few weeks later. The electrician then fitted a third lamp but a different make/model and that lasted several months. I replaced it with a fourth fitting last year of yet another make/model and that has recently failed too.
Each time the failure appears to be the LED lamps gradually giving up, rather than the PIR.
This sounds similar to your problem.
I am wondering what’s causing this. Could it be spikes from the machinery (even though the PIR lamp is hardly ever on when the machines are) or could it be our solar PV? Would an SPD (Surge Protection Device) in the consumer unit in the workshop help? (We already have an SPD in the house).

Sounds highly unlikely in my view. The sockets are on a different circuit to the lighting so the surge shouldn't (I think) cause an issue.

 

[Fergie 307]

I have a single one outside the front door, controlled by a separate light sensor for dusk to dawn. Quite exposed.
Nothing special, just the one out of the Screwfix catalogue that the boss liked the look of. Your post promoted me to have a look and mine are both equally bright. Also still on the original LED bulbs, probably three years old.
Your issue does seem rather odd.
Would be interesting to know the answer if you ever get to the bottom of it.