Trend Tenion & Mortise jig

[Shivers]

Interesting that some people can comment on the quality or precision of a product without having either seen it in use or used it !

Think you'll find that the naysayers work as cabinetmakers for a living & learned a long time ago not to buy every jig available,but to make their own,
The jig is fine if you are limited for space(garden shed ect),but if you have your own small shop with some space the same results can be gotten from other equipment.its not hard to set up a morticer to do angled mortices,or to use a home made router table(a well designed one that is)--to take care of the tenons.--but you are i the business of selling to hobbiests and thats your market.


regards.

 

[andy@trend]

Think you'll find that the naysayers work as cabinetmakers for a living & learned a long time ago not to buy every jig available,but to make their own,
The jig is fine if you are limited for space(garden shed ect),but if you have your own small shop with some space the same results can be gotten from other equipment.its not hard to set up a morticer to do angled mortices,or to use a home made router table(a well designed one that is)--to take care of the tenons.--but you are i the business of selling to hobbiests and thats your market.


regards.

I am not suggesting that a proficient cabinetmaker may need one, I just can't see the logic in condemming a product that you have not used or seen used !. The poster does not specify that he wants to use the jig for production work.

As reqards your comment about 'selling to hobbiests' then this is true for certain products, not necessarily the M&T jig though !

I am sure that you are aware we also produce products for Industrial Tooling applications, Trade use, Diy as well as the hobbyist.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but saying something is a Rip Off without having used it, seen it used or knowing fully what it's capable of seems like poor advice to me.

The very reason I signed up.

andy@trend

 

[Shivers]

Think you'll find that the naysayers work as cabinetmakers for a living & learned a long time ago not to buy every jig available,but to make their own,
The jig is fine if you are limited for space(garden shed ect),but if you have your own small shop with some space the same results can be gotten from other equipment.its not hard to set up a morticer to do angled mortices,or to use a home made router table(a well designed one that is)--to take care of the tenons.--but you are i the business of selling to hobbiests and thats your market.


regards.

I am not suggesting that a proficient cabinetmaker may need one, I just can't see the logic in condemming a product that you have not used or seen used !. The poster does not specify that he wants to use the jig for production work.

As reqards your comment about 'selling to hobbiests' then this is true for certain products, not necessarily the M&T jig though !

I am sure that you are aware we also produce products for Industrial Tooling applications, Trade use, Diy as well as the hobbyist.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but saying something is a Rip Off without having used it, seen it used or knowing fully what it's capable of seems like poor advice to me.

The very reason I signed up.

andy@trend

I didn't mention its a rip off at all(go back & read my posts),what i did do was offer options ---something i know you wont do.
The fellow could even be persuaded to do it by the dreaded by hand method.

 

[andy@trend]

Coo thats pricey for a not-very-good router add-on gadget. I'd go one step further and look at entry level morticers - much more useful.

cheers
Jacob
PS and look at all the expensive add-ons you will still need :shock:
Looks like a total rip-off.

I wan't quoting you Shivers, it was this comment !

andy@trend

 

[Shivers]

Coo thats pricey for a not-very-good router add-on gadget. I'd go one step further and look at entry level morticers - much more useful.

cheers
Jacob
PS and look at all the expensive add-ons you will still need :shock:
Looks like a total rip-off.

I wan't quoting you Shivers, it was this comment !

andy@trend

Not the best choice of words by grims there but i second his sentiments,the whole part of being a woodworker is being an independent thinker---thats where all the creativity comes from,it comes from innovation or problem solving.
Our advice even if it seems a bit tactless is straight to the heart of the matter.Theres nothing wrong with your jig --but if an amateur woodworker reached for a jig everytime something has to be done --then they aren't learning are they.

regards.

 

[Philly]

Andy
Welcome to the forum!
As always, the people who are the loudest to condemn are the ones who have never used or even seen one in the flesh :roll: I hear the same complaints about products like Bessey clamps, Lee Valley / Lie-Nielsen planes, Festool, Xcaliber, etc...... :lol:
Shivers
Since when has cabinetmaking been about "independent thinking"? Be interested to see where you got that from-the recent furniture threads have shown that most folk like traditionally evolved furniture. And we like to make that furniture with time tested, traditional methods. You don't see many "new joints" these days, do you?

As someone who actually owns and has used the Trend M+T jig I can give an opinion. The jig is pretty easy to use once you are familiar with it. You do need the correct (imperial!) cutters before you get stuck in but it can quickly and accurately know out a range of M+T joints (as well as being used for doweling) If you have multiple joints to cut it makes quick work of them, and makes very clean, accurate shoulders on tenons.
Downsides? I found there was a knack to using and controlling the router. You need a gentle but controlling touch to ensure an accurate result. And you really need to run test cuts before doing it "for real".
With a little practise you will soon be turning out some cracking joints-and you don't need to round over the ends of the tenons to match the rounded ends of the mortise. Is it worth the money? I think so, as long as you use it!
Cheers
Philly

 

[Shivers]

Shivers
Since when has cabinetmaking been about "independent thinking"? Be interested to see where you got that from-the recent furniture threads have shown that most folk like traditionally evolved furniture. And we like to make that furniture with time tested, traditional methods. You don't see many "new joints" these days, do you?
Philly

You missed the point there,by independent thinking i mean you troubleshoot in the shop off your own wits(as in problem solving)--the more this is done without having to buy something,the more creative you become.

As for the other comments furniture,joints ect--it goes without sayin theres a multitude of ways to do things --& i see people offering valid suggestions there.

 

[Newbie_Neil]

Hi Andy

Welcome to the forum and spending time with us, I'm sure it will be beneficial for us all.

Cheers
Neil

 

[andycktm]

Trouble is with this and proberbly many other forums, is lots of people force their opinions across.Many a thread is dead within 3-4 posts because people have strong opinions and the poster is proberbly scared away.

 

[andy@trend]

Hi Andy

Welcome to the forum and spending time with us, I'm sure it will be beneficial for us all.

Cheers
Neil

Thanks Neil,

Don't worry I am not here to give you the 'Hard Sell' on our products, it's just on a number of forums a lot of inaccurate information is given out and I don't want people to be misled.

I am keen to hear from you guys about your likes and dislikes, can't always promise a result, but you never know.


I spent 15 years in retail selling powertools and accessories to endusers (Trade & DIY) before I joined trend 8 years ago, so I am use to people with opinions,

Just want to help with facts where I can,

I will not be posting links other than to our website for information purposes in order to be fair to all the dealers up and down the country,

Mr Google is far better at saying where to buy or whose products to buy than I am. If we have done our job properly then we need not worry about self promotion on forum websites (that's just before anyone chips in with that old chestnut!)

Regards,

andy@trend

 

[dedee]

Andy,
welcome to the forum. It's always nice to see manufacturers contributing, I am sure there are many other who just lurk.

What position to you hold within Trend may I ask?

Andy

 

[andy@trend]

Andy,
welcome to the forum. It's always nice to see manufacturers contributing, I am sure there are many other who just lurk.

What position to you hold within Trend may I ask?

Andy

Hi dedee,

National Accounts Manager (Sales) amongst other responsibilities, I am also a keen woodworker myself.

I have been a lurker too :wink:

andy@trend

 

[Roger]

Even Shivers' calculator is out of whack! Good to have you here Andy - nice to see some Manufacturer's representation here above board. The more the merrier

 

[filsgreen]

I would go with Mr_Grimsdale idea and look at entry level morticers - much more useful.
nice one here
http://www.charnwood.net/ProductDesc.js ... ckref=W310

the Charnwood looks very similar to the Perform for £67 :?

Phil

 

[Anonymous]

Coo thats pricey for a not-very-good router add-on gadget. I'd go one step further and look at entry level morticers - much more useful.

cheers
Jacob
PS and look at all the expensive add-ons you will still need :shock:
Looks like a total rip-off.

I wan't quoting you Shivers, it was this comment !

andy@trend

OK sorry I withdraw "rip-off" and substitute "complete waste of money". This is in comparison with the alternative ways of making M&Ts.
Looking at the prices filsgreen noted it looks like you could do much better than "entry level" real morticer for the price of a Trend jig (+ expensive tooling).
For the ludicrous price of a Leigh jig (+ very expensive tooling) you could buy a reasonable table saw as well and think about binning the router for ever :lol:
Actually I kept mine (Black & Decker made by Trend I think) as I do find a need for it once in a blue moon.

cheers
Jacob

 

[Alf]

Actually I kept mine (Black & Decker made by Trend I think) as I do find a need for it once in a blue moon.

(Staggers theatrically, prises jaw from floor etc) Say it ain't so, Joe! :shock: :wink:

Cheers, Alf

 

[Anonymous]

Actually I kept mine (Black & Decker made by Trend I think) as I do find a need for it once in a blue moon.

(Staggers theatrically, prises jaw from floor etc) Say it ain't so, Joe! :shock: :wink:

Cheers, Alf

Yebbut I use it as a door stop that's all I meant. Oh and the occasional stopped housing but a chisel usually preferred.

cheers
Jacob

 

[Philly]

Jacob
Where do you come up with "complete waste of money"???????
In this world there is more than one choice. Amazingly, some people use other methods to yourself. As you have no experience of this jig, and never use routers, why on earth are you even commenting???
Why do you assume this forum is here for you to air your opinion on things you have no knowledge or interest in?? :?
The forum is inhabited by woodworkers of many different skill levels, from total beginners through hobbiests, collectors and woodworkers who actually do it for a living. There is no "right" answer to every question as each member has a different set of circumstances.
Please keep this in mind with future comments.
Philly

 

[Anonymous]

That is my considered opinion after about 40 years of woodwork mostly full time earning a living. Over the years I have used many machines including routers and watched others efforts, discussed, listened, read etc. etc.
So I'd say to you; "Please keep this in mind with future comments".
Sorry you don't like my point of view but I don't see that that entitles you to that air of irritated disapproval.
Instead, why not explain why, in your opinion, a router and M&T jig etc is a better option than going for proper machinery such as a morticer?
Join in, instead of just disapproving from the sidelines.

cheers
Jacob

 

[Alf]

...hobbiests, collectors and woodworkers...

Collectors? None of those here, chum... :wink:

Not sure anything can be a complete waste of money really; even if it's just a lesson not to do that again. :lol: If someone favours loose tenons, f'rinstance, anything based on using a router is probably going to make more sense than a "proper" mortiser, isn't it? Dunno; keep meaning to try them, keep not finding the tuit. Mind you, I'd use the Woodrat, but that'll just give Jacob apoplexy so I best not mention it. Although...

Hey, Jacob! What about the Woodrat then? :wink:

Cheers, Alf