Titan shredder Honda 13hp engine problems

[mickthetree]

Does anyone have any experience with honda 13hp OHV engines? One fitted to my titan (clone) chipper shredder. Beast of a machine when it works!

Starting it was no great drama when I first got it secondhand off ebay, but it has become harder and harder to get going. Nice video on cleaning the carb on youtube which I followed. There was indeed some gumph in the float chamber pin which I cleaned out but still no joy.

When trying to start it fuel spills out of the exhaust without starting.

There is a strange gasket between the the carb and the housing which seems to just leave a channel for the fuel to leak straight out. This was filled with some sort of foam gasket when I first took it apart and was soaked in fuel. This looked like a bodge someone had done at some point, but maybe it is supposed to be there? I used blue gasket sealer for carbs. This has stopped the fuel coming out of this channel now, but instead it comes out of the exhaust as I mentioned.

I cant seem to find any articles on line about overhauling these or even parts diagrams.

Any help here would be greatly appreciated.

 

[MMUK]

Doesn't sound like a genuine Honda engine from your description. Can you post some photos?

Is it 2 or 4 stroke? Have you got a spark?

 

[dickm]

My chipper clone also has a "Honda" engine (6 hp) which is an exact replica of the real thing, but isn't. Previous owner had broken some bits on it, which have now been replaced with secondhand real Honda bits from local lawnmower mechanic. So might be worth trying that route? Problem with new genuine Honda bits is they would probably cost more than the engine is worth! I've got a spare real Honda 6hp, but that wouldn't be powerful enough for your machine.

 

[blackrodd]

I have a couple of these clone engines and they are a very good copy and work well I've found.
The only difficulty was in starting one of them, it wouldn't start as the first one easily did, then I discovered
the engine has an auto decompressor and if the exhaust valve tappet became slack, the decompresssor surely
did not, nearly ripped you're arm off!
Here's a gx390 pdf.manual download on page 2.
http://www.citypassclub.com/guides/4Xx/ ... manual.pdf

Regards Rodders

 

[Flynnwood]

If it's a GX390 as Rodders suggest, here's the manufacturers page:
http://engines.honda.com/parts-and-supp ... uals/GX390

Since you have fuel passing through, the next think to check is if there is a spark at the plug (take it out and earth it by grounding/resting on the head or somewhere similar, reconnect and try and start the engine). If there isn't a spark between the electrodes, try another spark plug first.

 

[mickthetree]

Hi Chaps

Thanks all for the info and the link to the documents. I just couldnt find them when googling.

I found another youtubevideo. I picked up some carb cleaner and got it all back together. It is now running again, although still fiddly to get going.

There is definitely a spark. have done as you suggested already. I did give the spark plug a clean up too.

I'll have to checkout the exhaust valve tappet as it did nearly tear my arm off when trying to start it. I had to take the spark plug out to release the pressure to start with, but after that it did turn over and start.

It is a fantastic machine once it gets going. 20 minutes and I had ploughed through a big pile of branches from a horse chestnut I took down 6 months ago.
Thanks again.

 

[blackrodd]

If it's any help, The tappets are 6 thou inlet and 8 thou exhaust, I presume at TDC, according to this, --
http://outdoorpowerinfo.com/engine_spec ... e_gaps.asp
Or metric is there if you prefer.
Regards Rodders

 

[mickthetree]

After having this running recently it stopped running and now wont start. There is now no spark so I'm thinking ignition coil???

I've found a chap selling spares but they dont seem particularly common.

 

[Beau]

Got the GX 390 on one of my machines. Not that it will help you spark issues but the filter at the bottom of the fuel tank gets easily blocked. To clean it you need to remove the fuel tank and its attached to a nylon nut on the bottom of it.

 

[mickthetree]

Many thanks Beau. when I remove the spark plug and pull the starter a goodly splash of fuel comes out of the hole so I'm guessing that is ok. Holding the spark plug against the casing shows no spark so I think it lies there.
Thanks though.

 

[blackrodd]

Make sure the on/off switch is not faulty, it goes to dead short to earth to shut off.
Take the wire from the oil watch switch, Failing that and getting a new spark plug and still dead
You'll need one of these coils, link below, Make sure it IS the right one for you're GX390
Regards Rodders

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Ignition- ... 33856968e2

 

[Lons]

I'm no mechanic but absolutely detest engines that won't start and had my share, Recently my Honda ride on started ok but continuously "hunted" and backfired. My fault as I hadn't drained the tank fully so carb gets gummed up so bought a cleaner spray, got it running and a few sprays into the air cleaner. spluttered a bit but sorted and no further problems to date.

I have a HD Makita chainsaw which wouldn't start whatever I tried, did all the checks including spark test until at my wits end dropped in to a guy I know at a local tool hire company. He looked at it, stuck in a new spark plug and it started first time then said the spark test isn't reliable. :?

Bob

 

[Beau]

Rodders touches on it but if the oil level is low it won't start.

I got caught out with this when working the machine on an angle

 

[blackrodd]

I'm no mechanic but absolutely detest engines that won't start and had my share, Recently my Honda ride on started ok but continuously "hunted" and backfired. My fault as I hadn't drained the tank fully so carb gets gummed up so bought a cleaner spray, got it running and a few sprays into the air cleaner. spluttered a bit but sorted and no further problems to date.

I have a HD Makita chainsaw which wouldn't start whatever I tried, did all the checks including spark test until at my wits end dropped in to a guy I know at a local tool hire company. He looked at it, stuck in a new spark plug and it started first time then said the spark test isn't reliable. :?

Bob

When you check the spark against the engine, you're looking for a red/blue spark, for the engine to go,
A white yellowy spark wont fire up in the cylinder under compression.
And as someone mentioned (beau)?with the honda GX range, and Oil Watch, there has to be enough oil in the engine and the engine on flat level ground to work, or the oil level float switch inside the sump will stop the engine firing or running at all.
I had a honda 535 for 7 years, sold that 4 years ago, bought a hayter harrier, both among the best you can buy.
I forget to service either, take out the petrol etc, but each year, season's first time start is petrol down the carb, first or second pull, it starts, rest of the season first or second pull every time.
Regards Rodders

 

[Lons]

I had a honda 535 for 7 years, sold that 4 years ago, bought a hayter harrier, both among the best you can buy.
I forget to service either, take out the petrol etc, but each year, season's first time start is petrol down the carb, first or second pull, it starts, rest of the season first or second pull every time.
Regards Rodders

I'm pretty sure that my ordinary mower is an HRD535 Rodders, the one with the roller and aloy deck. Bought it in July 2000 for £745 when the list price was around £1100 but the cost still shocked me at the time however in all that time it's had only one professional service (I do my own) and a couple of new blades. It's as reliable today as it was new and I have a pretty large lawn.

The tractor is an HF 2417 and is pretty impressive though twice the price of many of similar size.

Bob

 

[blackrodd]

That's the one Lons, hydrostatic drive, ally deck, my biker mate loves them, runs his own horticultural supply and repair shop, he services these machines, chainsaws etc,
He says the drive system is good but will not stand rough treatment like banging up and down steps, etc,
So looks though you've looked after you're well! They still go for fair money today.
My Hayter is much lighter and a simple belt drive, doddle to work on!
Regards Rodders

 

[mickthetree]

Many thanks guys. Hopefully I'm armed with some good knowledge to get this great machine back up and running. Got a few more jobs for it then I can sell it on.

 

[Eric The Viking]

I hate small engines for starting, like others, had to deal with my share.

The notable exception is Honda's CG125 engine* which is almost bomb proof, but it's a very simple 4-stroke. I think that GX engine in the video has the same air filter as the CG, obviously piped differently though. Love the way the guy just lifts off the gaskets!

Small things do flood horribly, especially 2-strokes. We used to run two industrial Flymos with 125 2-strokes with diaphragm carbs (have to work on all kinds of slopes). You really do need to flush them for the winter, but you can help starting by thoroughly warming the end of the plug on a gas ring first (go gently to avoid damaging the ceramic). They might misfire at first, but they will start, and then settle down.

We had a 15- or 20cc strimmer ("Paice-Setter") that I never got running really well. It was a complete pig to start. My dad gave it to me the last time they moved house, and I keep intending to have a look at it properly, but mostly it just gets moved from one cupboard to another. It's another 'stroker.

E.

PS: I'd use meths, not WD40 to clean the carb - dissolves any varnishes properly - WD won't and it will leave residue too.

*(makes sign of holy pushrods)

 

[Lons]

PS: I'd use meths, not WD40 to clean the carb - dissolves any varnishes properly - WD won't and it will leave residue too.

*(makes sign of holy pushrods)

Eric
The spray I bought was choke and carb cleaner,
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221810899958? ... EBIDX%3AIT
is meths better than that?

Bob

 

[Eric The Viking]

PS: I'd use meths, not WD40 to clean the carb - dissolves any varnishes properly - WD won't and it will leave residue too.

*(makes sign of holy pushrods)

Eric
The spray I bought was choke and carb cleaner,
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221810899958? ... EBIDX%3AIT
is meths better than that?

Bob

I doubt it - proper carb cleaner would be far better, although you do need to watch/remove the O-rings, etc. with that stuff as it usually has some "quite fun" solvents in it.

I was responding to the chap in the video, who seemed to attack the thing with WD40. It probably would dissolve the varnishes, but it also leaves a lot of gunge of its own behind.

I was surprised how well meths works on its own recently, doing the petcocks on my Beemer (R80). The filters were almost completely gunged up, but it cleaned them really well. You can strip them, but they're really awkward to reassemble, and I think meths is gentle enough to do the job properly without upsetting the rubber seals.

It's my own stupid fault, I left some fuel in the tank for way too long. It smelled horrid when I did get round to draining it and it now needs the proper POR15 treatment to clean up the inside of the tank and prevent it rusting again. Thankfully there's no leak and the tank is still sound - just rather rusty inside.



E.