The Veritas Shooting Plane

[David C]

And other people may be interested in a wider spectrum of subjects.

The Stanley no 9 is frequently referred to as a piano makers plane.

David

 

[Cheshirechappie]

For trimming end grain, a mitre trimmer (such as this - http://www.axminster.co.uk/axcaliber-mt1-mitre-trimmer ) would be another option. This one isn't as posh as those from Morso or Ortoguil, and is strictly speaking intended for trimming picture frame mitres, so will not have quite the length capacity of the shooting board and plane, but should do a pretty fair job.

There are more ways than one to skin a cat, and whilst doing it all with a limited kit may be an absolute necessity for some (or a conscious choice for others), most professionals and serious amateurs, now and in the past, prefer to have tools that make the job quicker or do the job to a better standard; or even just have a few tools that are a pleasure to own and use.

 

[MMUK]

Oh for pineapple sake Jacob, give it up will you!

Why?
I'm interested in these things and want to know how useful they are. I'm also interested in how much can be done with only a few simple tools. It was an eye opener for me when I was taught how much can be done with a fairly basic tool collection.

Why? Because all you are doing is repeating yourself and trying to stir up trouble - AGAIN!

You've made you case several times. Once is enough.


I'm sure I am not the only one sick of it.......

 

[Peter Sefton]

I have the axcaliber-mt1-mitre-trimmer in the workshop and for the money it's a good bit of kit, when we run short courses we work end grain by hand and eye, using the shooting board and the trimmer, it gives guys the experience of three methods and they can buy whichever kit suits their skill level and needs, or commercially we finish it straight of the table saw if appropriate.
Cheers Peter

 

[cagenuts]

Even the most basic kit includes a knife, a square, and one or two hand planes. That's all that is really needed.

Way overkill!

You just need an axe.

 

[Peter Sefton]

Even the most basic kit includes a knife, a square, and one or two hand planes. That's all that is really needed.

Way overkill!

You just need an axe.

Yeah but how would you sharpen it

 

[Trafalgar]

For trimming end grain, a mitre trimmer (such as this - http://www.axminster.co.uk/axcaliber-mt1-mitre-trimmer ) would be another option. This one isn't as posh as those from Morso or Ortoguil, and is strictly speaking intended for trimming picture frame mitres, so will not have quite the length capacity of the shooting board and plane, but should do a pretty fair job.

There are more ways than one to skin a cat, and whilst doing it all with a limited kit may be an absolute necessity for some (or a conscious choice for others), most professionals and serious amateurs, now and in the past, prefer to have tools that make the job quicker or do the job to a better standard; or even just have a few tools that are a pleasure to own and use.

Without doubt the best tool especially for treating endgrain on mouldings.

 

[yetloh]

I'm sure I am not the only one sick of it.......

Amen.

Jim

 

[Corneel]

From old German texts, even way before all these English mitre planes, I understand that endgrain planes were used mostly for miters. And that is no wonder, the mitre is about the only joint which needs painstakingly accurate endgrain work. And there were loads of mitre joints, with all the mouldings running around corners, in period furniture. The rest of the joints have the endgrain hidden or it is planed after assembly like the dovetail joint. Fitting a drawer, while needing attention of course, is more forgiving then a mitre joint.

 

[Trafalgar]

From old German texts, even way before all these English mitre planes, I understand that endgrain planes were used mostly for miters. And that is no wonder, the mitre is about the only joint which needs painstakingly accurate endgrain work. And there were loads of mitre joints, with all the mouldings running around corners, in period furniture. The rest of the joints have the endgrain hidden or it is planed after assembly like the dovetail joint. Fitting a drawer, while needing attention of course, is more forgiving then a mitre joint.

Good points all. And as CheshireChappie has pointed out the guillotine-style miter trimmer probably represents the highest form of non-electric tool for such tasks. This isn't a tool with a very high "drool factor" it would seem. No gloats. Robust. Totally self contained. No need to build anything to go with. Shearing cut is built-in. Drag it out, slice your workpieces, put it back on a shelf until next time. My wife worked in a frame shop when she was in college. They had four of them, she recalls.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Good points all. And as CheshireChappie has pointed out the guillotine-style miter trimmer probably represents the highest form of non-electric tool for such tasks. This isn't a tool with a very high "drool factor" it would seem. No gloats. Robust. Totally self contained. No need to build anything to go with. Shearing cut is built-in. Drag it out, slice your workpieces, put it back on a shelf until next time. My wife worked in a frame shop when she was in college. They had four of them, she recalls.

Just for the record, I suggested that the mitre trimmer was 'another option' for the working of endgrain. I didn't state that it was the highest form of non-electric tool for such a task.

Also just for the record, I'm very glad that Derek undertook his review of the LV shooting plane, and I'm glad he posted his findings, because I now know more about the available options for working end-grain than I did before. It's clearly a very capable tool. In common with anything carefully designed and well made, it comes at a price, and it's for each to decide whether that price is one they are able or willing to pay. There are other options available for working end-grain, such as a bench-plane on a shooting board, a mitre plane (Stanley type or infill), a picture-framer's mitre trimmer, and the unguided use of a block plane or similar. The appropriate option will depend on circumstance, inclination and available finance; but they all work, some better than others in various situations.

If the Mods will permit, I'd like to add my voice to those calling for an end to the veiled sniping and back-biting. It helps nobody.

 

[Billy Flitch]

Long time ago now but worked in a shop fitters shop that had one of those miter guillotines a lot bigger than the one shown in the thread. JMHO but I found it too slow you had to creep up on the miter bit by bit.

 

[Jacob]

Long time ago now but worked in a shop fitters shop that had one of those miter guillotines a lot bigger than the one shown in the thread. JMHO but I found it too slow you had to creep up on the miter bit by bit.

I've had one on site once but found it too precise (architraves and other mouldings) in that a lot of stuff wasn't square to start with. So back to basics - mark and saw as close as you can, offer up several times, block plane, undercut, etc. No scope for a shooting board either.

 

[Peter Sefton]

The Guillotine is a great bit of kit but I agree probably not for site work, if the joint can be cut of the saw it should be, powered or hand cut with a bit of trimming after. The guillotine does give a very clean cut when sharp but it does have it's limitations, you usually need to pre cut with the saw, creeping up to the line can be a pain and if you don't judge it right and only try to make a very fine trimming cut you get a curved finish. This is where the shooting board is better you can plane to fit with very fine cuts.
Peter

 

[David C]

I have been thinking!

In a small cabinetmaking workshop like mine, large mitres are marked out sawn and planed and tested, with no great difficulty, but it is a time consuming business. (No guillotine).

Small drawer front ends, I used to work with a block plane, testing and adjusting as before. 7/8" stuff being a bit difficult to shoot with a conventional plane.

Drawer sides, on the other hand are getting a bit thin to balance a block plane on, 8 mm, so shooting is the perfect solution, as the ends of the sides can be identical pairs.

Thin panel joints respond well to match shooting, with a straight blade.

Extra thin stuff, i.e. linings for boxes, 2.5 mm thick are easily mitred if one builds a double sided ramp for the shooting board. Small frames and mouldings are equally perfectly done with another 45 degree aid.

Veneer joints can be superbly prepared by shooting with a different set up. 0.7 mm thick if you are lucky.

The only thing I have noticed since buying the L-N 51, is that I can now shoot those 7/8" drawer fronts, with ease, saving considerable time.

Best wishes,
David Charlesworth

 

[bugbear]

...7/8" stuff being a bit difficult to shoot with a conventional plane.

The only thing I have noticed since buying the L-N 51, is that I can now shoot those 7/8" drawer fronts, with ease, saving considerable time.

What's the difficulty with a conventional plane, and how does the #51 overcome it? Is it just the force required, or something more subtle?

BugBear

 

[David C]

I was shooting with a 5 1/2 and think that it is either the shock at the start of a shaving or possibly lack of momentum which made thick stuff difficult.

The greater mass and skewed blade seem to be a great help, so one wonders how a 5 1/2 on a ramped board would fare?

Omitted my conclusion in the above. Simple shooting boards are fantastically useful in the small cabinetmaking shop.

David

 

[Racers]

That's what I found when I had a play with the Veritas, no thump at the start of the cut it just seems to slide through the cut.

Pete

 

[cagenuts]

For the very thin stuff like veneers, there's always the option of the new Veritas Sanding Shooter.

 

[carlb40]

For the very thin stuff like veneers, there's always the option of the new Veritas Sanding Shooter.

Pity it isn't a bit longer