Small workshop - Pent or Apex?

[artie]

I don't think anyone else mentioned, and maybe it's not an issue, but, if using felt over sheet roofing then the same head clearance can be achieved at less cost with an apex roof.

 

[johna.clements]

It's not your height, but size of projects. It will be difficult to move 8ft lengths in 6ft shed. Doing roughing cuts outside is fine, till the rain and wind get up.
I got an apex 24 x 8, was 16x8 till I lengthened it.
It's a low height low pitch apex, wish I'd gone for a taller apex, as no overhead storage, and if I've got my face shield up, it catches on cross beams, I'm only 5ft 8, but feel enclosed.

If Doing it again I'd go for full height apex and 16 x 10 or 12, 8ft too narrow really, imagine 6ft even tighter.

(Going from 16 to 24 doesn't help working space, but great for storage.)

The shed have to fit in the space available. It is a pity that the op did not repost the photo (see above) of the location in this thread.

I would bet that the photo was taken from the back door, the lawn is very small. I also would not be surprised if the gate is hung off a wall that separates the garden from the neighbours.

There is no room unless the whole garden becomes the shed!

Added
Photo
https://cdn.imagearchive.com/ukworkshop/data/attach/124/124761-IMG20220913095240.jpg

 

[stormy121]

Wow lots of input here, thanks guys! i am leaning toward attaching to the back wall more and more as i plan it out, would be easy to do but would mean a more shallow pent roof if i do it, i intend on using felt still mind only issue i see with it is not being able to have the higher part of the shed at the front!, already accounted for the rear and intended on adding a set of paving slabs forward to create a gap at the back.

Something that has come up is the difference between the wood grade, I've no experience with c16+ ratings etc but have a basic understanding.

I can get treated wood that's pressure treated with, or without the rating, its going to be the framework of the shed, does it really "need" to be c16+? what benefit will i personally see from using this c16+ wood over the same but without the rating?

 

[johna.clements]

Wow lots of input here, thanks guys! i am leaning toward attaching to the back wall more and more as i plan it out, would be easy to do but would mean a more shallow pent roof if i do it, i intend on using felt still mind only issue i see with it is not being able to have the higher part of the shed at the front!, already accounted for the rear and intended on adding a set of paving slabs forward to create a gap at the back.

Something that has come up is the difference between the wood grade, I've no experience with c16+ ratings etc but have a basic understanding.

I can get treated wood that's pressure treated with, or without the rating, its going to be the framework of the shed, does it really "need" to be c16+? what benefit will i personally see from using this c16+ wood over the same but without the rating?

If you do not own the wall why do you want to attach the the shed to it, then you have to remove the fixings and repair the wall when you leave. (If you rest the roof on the wall it is not attached)

Why would resting the roof on top of a 2.3m high wall mean a more shallow pent. That would give you 200mm for a sole plate and rafters and felt up to 2.5m. The low side could be as low as you want.

Not sure why you would have a gap at the wall if the shed is attached to the wall or as I suggest the roof rests on the wall (that you do not own rather than use fixings)

C16 is a strength grade for timber. The shed will be blown by the wind and at some pint have snow on the roof/ plus people.

 

[stormy121]

If you do not own the wall why do you want to attach the the shed to it, then you have to remove the fixings and repair the wall when you leave. (If you rest the roof on the wall it is not attached)

Why would resting the roof on top of a 2.3m high wall mean a more shallow pent. That would give you 200mm for a sole plate and rafters and felt up to 2.5m. The low side could be as low as you want.

Not sure why you would have a gap at the wall if the shed is attached to the wall or as I suggest the roof rests on the wall (that you do not own rather than use fixings)

C16 is a strength grade for timber. The shed will be blown by the wind and at some pint have snow on the roof/ plus people.

I've sent an email to hopfully get permission to affix it to the wall, resting it on the top would look weird XD i'm just messing with the design and its abit low for my liking at the front but if i raise it up to 2m at the front the angle of the roof is really shallow which is my only major concern, i know you say to rest on the back wall but i would rather fix it to the wall and be level with it at least to allow the water to run off.

So am i right in thinking i would be better off using C16? is it really needed that much? remember my old shed was built out of 25mm/50mm roof battens and it held my weight and still stands today haha

I don't want to build something that will last a lifetime just enough to be usable for some of my projects, insulation isnt a major thing but it is something i want due to keeping tools in there, still shopping around for prices near me but my god have they gone up! debating on waiting till next year but just so stuck on it right now.

 

[Sachakins]

The shed have to fit in the space available. It is a pity that the op did not repost the photo (see above) of the location in this thread.

I would bet that the photo was taken from the back door, the lawn is very small. I also would not be surprised if the gate is hung off a wall that separates the garden from the neighbours.

There is no room unless the whole garden becomes the shed!

Added
Photo
https://cdn.imagearchive.com/ukworkshop/data/attach/124/124761-IMG20220913095240.jpg

Thanks for the picture, I see more clearly now.
So for the OP,
Ok, so width is restricted, I assume depth is governed by aesthetics, hence 6ft not 8 or 10?.

I wouldn't be trying to fix to wall in any form, just making things awkward for your self. Keep it free standing, use decent tanalised timber for external walls/cladding.
My shed back and side are tight up to fence also, so to be double safe I also felted these external sides, using 3mm heavy roofing felt.
I would do apex, but not along its length,I would go from side to side, called reverse apex, with 63mm small gutter profile at each end.
Like this..

 

[stormy121]

Thanks for the picture, I see more clearly now.
So for the OP,
Ok, so width is restricted, I assume depth is governed by aesthetics, hence 6ft not 8 or 10?.

I wouldn't be trying to fix to wall in any form, just making things awkward for your self. Keep it free standing, use decent tanalised timber for external walls/cladding.
My shed back and side are tight up to fence also, so to be double safe I also felted these external sides, using 3mm heavy roofing felt.
I would do apex, but not along its length,I would go from side to side, called reverse apex, with 63mm small gutter profile at each end.
Like this..

View attachment 144209

May i ask why you think reverse apex? the image you have added is what i wanted from the apex but is there a specific reason a reverse apex would work better? May i ask if you could explain a little bit more on the felt on the external sides? i cant see any on your image ha! The timber i can get is either PSE tanalised treated or PSE tanalised treated C16+, both are the same size but the C16+ is almost double the cost

Thinking about it i may just go build a reverse apex to see how it would look compared to the other two!

The are which the shed will be going currently is only 6ft in depth (from grass to back wall) what i call the width is the longest part from the left wall to the right wall that just sticks out with a gate near it. that's like just over 12ft i cannot remember exact size right now, I'm going with 10-11ft so i can fit my bike down the side, the depth being only 6ft was due to the area it was being put on, though I'm now thinking closer to 7ft and adding in an extra row of slabs to put on the grass.

 

[johna.clements]

Thanks for the picture, I see more clearly now.
So for the OP,
Ok, so width is restricted, I assume depth is governed by aesthetics, hence 6ft not 8 or 10?.

I wouldn't be trying to fix to wall in any form, just making things awkward for your self. Keep it free standing, use decent tanalised timber for external walls/cladding.
My shed back and side are tight up to fence also, so to be double safe I also felted these external sides, using 3mm heavy roofing felt.
I would do apex, but not along its length,I would go from side to side, called reverse apex, with 63mm small gutter profile at each end.
Like this..

View attachment 144209

Like the idea if the felt at the back to keep the water off in the gap. You can also get in with a batten to pull out any leaves.
If the op wants a shed that has existing walls on three sides then it would be difficult to get to the back; but it is not clear to me what he actually wants.

 

[Sachakins]

Sorry for confusion, that's not my shed just a picture of what's known as a reverse apex, where apex line runs across the narrowest dimension.
Reason for reverse apex choice is with you being boxed in on three sides, gutter run off would be easier and are easy to access if the get blocked.

Personally, I think a pent roof always looks like a pigeon loft
I wouldn't bother with C16 timber, that's just a standard for construction timber that is free from most knots, giving a more uniform load ability needed in house construction.

I used all tanalised timber,
standard CLS for all stud work and joists, rough sawn 6×1 for roof and flooring and 18mm t&g log lap profile gor external. Insulated and 18mm plywood lined and 12mm plywood overlay on floor.

Some use plywood or OSB for roof, it was too heavy for me to handle, hence 6x1.

The felted sides on the faces next to fence line are just belt and braces over the log lap, against rain and rot, as can't get at them now to add preservative every couple of years.

My previous shed rotted from the outside in, on the fence side, so had no chance to see damage until to late, hence the felted approach.

 

[Sachakins]

Could save all the stress and rot with this option from Keter, 9x7, at Argos

 

[stormy121]

Sorry for confusion, that's not my shed just a picture of what's known as a reverse apex, where apex line runs across the narrowest dimension.
Reason for reverse apex choice is with you being boxed in on three sides, gutter run off would be easier and are easy to access if the get blocked.

Personally, I think a pent roof always looks like a pigeon loft
I wouldn't bother with C16 timber, that's just a standard for construction timber that is free from most knots, giving a more uniform load ability needed in house construction.

I used all tanalised timber,
standard CLS for all stud work and joists, rough sawn 6×1 for roof and flooring and 18mm t&g log lap profile gor external. Insulated and 18mm plywood lined and 12mm plywood overlay on floor.

Some use plywood or OSB for roof, it was too heavy for me to handle, hence 6x1.

The felted sides on the faces next to fence line are just belt and braces over the log lap, against rain and rot, as can't get at them now to add preservative every couple of years.

My previous shed rotted from the outside in, on the fence side, so had no chance to see damage until to late, hence the felted approach.

I've just noticed that i never thought about adding guttering! probs a good idea i guess as the back would be much less attacked by rain.

I thought when you said reverse apex you meant to do it opposite to what you had shown XD its okay though, I've now done 3 designs, pent, apex and reverse apex, it seems that apex will give me a slightly better "working" environment inside the shed so I just have to pick between the two types

 

[TheUnicorn]

there is also the option for a dutch barn roof
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d7/07/98/d70798b3a3c7bad2c99b54fe90082d80.jpg

 

[stormy121]

there is also the option for a dutch barn roof
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d7/07/98/d70798b3a3c7bad2c99b54fe90082d80.jpg

Hm, thats possible, would need to do it in reverse or work out some interesting designs to add the window to the long side! would save on shiplap though

 

[Inspector]

The Gambrel (Dutch) roof is not a good choice for a little shed because from about bench height on up the "walls" are sloping inwards. You can't hang toosl, cabinets or lean sheet stock against them easily. Great in a big barn to get a large clear open area to stack hay in but not so good in a small structure.

Pete

 

[Jameshow]

I would a pent with the guttering of the back wall resting on the existing wall this stopping rain getting down the back.

You could use stud walling insulation and membrane without the cladding right up to the back and side walls.

Get a uPVC patio door for the front door and the amount if cladding needed is minimal.

Go for 8ft depth you'll thank us when built. If any asks say UK workshop told me too!

 

[Ollie78]

I would do a flat roof with epdm roofing. You put a small 5 degree pitch on it, kerbs on 3 sides and a gutter drip on the back. This gives maximum internal height for the permitted development rules, is easy to build and doesn`t cost much more than felt.

Ollie

 

[stormy121]

I would a pent with the guttering of the back wall resting on the existing wall this stopping rain getting down the back.

You could use stud walling insulation and membrane without the cladding right up to the back and side walls.

Get a uPVC patio door for the front door and the amount if cladding needed is minimal.

Go for 8ft depth you'll thank us when built. If any asks say UK workshop told me too!

my old shed was 7.5ft so i know 8 would be nice XD but i dont want to loose to much of my garden ha! most of my projects are small, so handling sheet material isnt a major concern! Thankfully

I have a uPVC Door but i also have a really nice 1930s dougles fir solid door which looks just beautiful plus the uPVC door is massive and would actually increase the cost of the shiplap!

I would do a flat roof with epdm roofing. You put a small 5 degree pitch on it, kerbs on 3 sides and a gutter drip on the back. This gives maximum internal height for the permitted development rules, is easy to build and doesn`t cost much more than felt.

Ollie

I have to disagree, i can get 20m of felt for £30 vs a epdm at around £100 am i looking in the wrong place?

 

[artie]

The Gambrel (Dutch) roof is not a good choice for a little shed because from about bench height on up the "walls" are sloping inwards. You can't hang toosl, cabinets or lean sheet stock against them easily. Great in a big barn to get a large clear open area to stack hay in but not so good in a small structure.

Pete

Would it be possible to make the walls straight up to shoulder height?

That's what's on my to do list.

 

[TheUnicorn]

i can get 20m of felt for £30 vs a epdm at around £100 am i looking in the wrong place?

I put up a shed last year and put on cheap felt (not my choice), It was horrible to work with, thin, brittle, I could see cracks and tears forming from day one. I doubt it will last more than three years, and I'd bet that when it does get replaced, the roof will need to replaced too... and then the top of the walls will be showing signs of rot... Just a false economy. Keep water out at all costs

 

[artie]

I have to disagree, i can get 20m of felt for £30 vs a epdm at around £100 am i looking in the wrong place?

There's good quality felt available in 21m rolls for around £75 it says Blizzard on the wrapper.

I've used it and it lasts very well.