Just had a shower pump fail, that was less than two years old. Supposably made in the UK I wasn't made aware that you have to register the purchase to get a five year warranty. As we had no hot water supply had to get a plumber in who replaced the pump with like for like new pump (pump was £300, so not a cheapie). The manufacturer isn't interested, claiming 1.not registered and 2. They insist on checking the installation is correct (might be by photographs!) and if thay agree they only supply a new pump. So how long are you supposed to be without hot water, while these inspections go on? They also say that they would never repair a pump only replace as "they could not guarantee a watertight seal" If they make them, why(?), so they do not have a repair service. In future I will stay away from Salamander pumps. I will now take the hot water side of the pump apart (cold side working) and try to find the fault otherwise rather an expensive door stop. Anyone else had pump problems?
Shower Pumps
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Is it supplied by a header tank or from a pressurised system ? If from a pressurised system with a cylinder then you need to use the regulated cold water pressure take off so the hot and cold are at equal pressures otherwise some pumps will complain. For me Grunfoss pumps are my prefered option.
I've used techflow pumps for the last 20 plus years. They were bought out by Stuart Turner who discontinued that design in favour of their own. I suspect a case of killing the competition.
I would get 8-12 years use and then they always fail when the ceramic shaft seal wears out. Never a motor problem even when run for 30 minute showers. The shaft seals are a 50p part but not sold as a spare and I don't know how to identify a generic alternative.
The water in our area isn't very hard - mid range - and the high performance 3 stage pump parts which were all made from plastic never show the slightest sign of wear.
Plumbing correctly done with cold feed direct from the header tank and hot from a york flange 1/3 down the hot water cylinder.
So you can get a decent life from a shower pump, plastic isn't a bad material, proper induction motors last for years (avoid brushed motors) and ask for the part number of spare seals before parting with your cash.
Shaft seals are equivalent of the propeller shaft gland in a boat. Makes a watertight seal where the motor spindle goes into the pump body. They involve two surfaces spinning against each other at full speed but which have to hold back water. Ceramic I believe are best because ceramic surfaces can be very smooth and hard, resisting wear. The surfaces are pressed together by a strong coil spring which is part of the little seal unit. You'll find these when you dismantle each pump unit and look at the place where the spindle enters from the motor.
The seal needs to be a watertight fit in the pump housing and a watertight press fit on the shaft.
I would get 8-12 years use and then they always fail when the ceramic shaft seal wears out. Never a motor problem even when run for 30 minute showers. The shaft seals are a 50p part but not sold as a spare and I don't know how to identify a generic alternative.
The water in our area isn't very hard - mid range - and the high performance 3 stage pump parts which were all made from plastic never show the slightest sign of wear.
Plumbing correctly done with cold feed direct from the header tank and hot from a york flange 1/3 down the hot water cylinder.
So you can get a decent life from a shower pump, plastic isn't a bad material, proper induction motors last for years (avoid brushed motors) and ask for the part number of spare seals before parting with your cash.
Shaft seals are equivalent of the propeller shaft gland in a boat. Makes a watertight seal where the motor spindle goes into the pump body. They involve two surfaces spinning against each other at full speed but which have to hold back water. Ceramic I believe are best because ceramic surfaces can be very smooth and hard, resisting wear. The surfaces are pressed together by a strong coil spring which is part of the little seal unit. You'll find these when you dismantle each pump unit and look at the place where the spindle enters from the motor.
The seal needs to be a watertight fit in the pump housing and a watertight press fit on the shaft.
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Thank you Roy, not sure of layout so will question the plumber. and post again.
Thank you Sideways, My pumps are Salamander and as we are on the South Coast we have very hard water. There was no sign of any scale in the mesh inlet filter, when changing the pump.. This pump is very solidly made with both ends being brass. I shall talk to the plumber as to the actual installation. I believe the cold feed is from a tank in the loft. Pump is on the floor on a rubber anti-vibration mat alongside bottom of HW cylinder. The pump/cylinder are in one bathroom and a second shower room backs onto it. Also feeds kitchen and cloakroom downstairs.
MorrisWoodman12
Established Member
I too fell fowl of Salamander's "must inspect the installation" clause in a flat I rent out. They didn't like it so I paid for both the inspection and a new pump. I suspected the motor capacitor but never got around to testing it. The pump was just over a year old. The identical replacement has been running properly for about 7 years. Go figure. BTW I found Salamander pumps are a lot quieter than some other brands.
I love how manufacturers like to hide behind ‘you didn’t register for the five year warranty’ Stuff. Manufactures make all sorts of demands on consumers on what they have to do to have a warranty. All complete waffle. So, what would I do, this would be my solution and I’m not recommending it or providing advice. Right, so the disclaimer is now in place 
As I understand it, (I used to run company making consumer products, but that was over seven years ago before I retired ) manufacturers are responsible for their products for the reasonable expected life of their products to ensure they are material, design and manufacturing defect free. For the first year, it’s up the manufacturers to prove the unit wasn’t faulty, after that it’s down to the user. I would have taken photos of the installation and have records of who installed it. Second I would write to the manufacturer or where ever you bought it with a 14 day letter, (lots of templates online) explaining the reasonable steps you have made to ask them to resolve the problem, that you’ve been forced to replace it and ask for the total amount you’ve had to spend including installation to be refunded. They wil either pay up, offer a solution ie a payment somewhat less than your asking or ignore you. If you don't accept an offer, or they ignore you I would take the case to the County Courts. Now, it’s very easy to do, takes about 10mm online, BUT it’s not free, we are taking a hundred or so pounds depending on how much your claiming. But if you win you get it all back. Your case is simple, it’s failed after being professionally installed within two years and the manufacturer offer a warranty for up to five years. Now, this is almost certain to grab their attention. The courts love to bash company’s so the chance of them winning versus the damage and cost of defending the case is what they balance up. If your seeking less than say £1K it’s always in a company’s interest to settle out of court. However, if they don’t, you literally get a day out at the courts which is all very low key, intersting and you don’t need a lawyer.
As I understand it, (I used to run company making consumer products, but that was over seven years ago before I retired ) manufacturers are responsible for their products for the reasonable expected life of their products to ensure they are material, design and manufacturing defect free. For the first year, it’s up the manufacturers to prove the unit wasn’t faulty, after that it’s down to the user. I would have taken photos of the installation and have records of who installed it. Second I would write to the manufacturer or where ever you bought it with a 14 day letter, (lots of templates online) explaining the reasonable steps you have made to ask them to resolve the problem, that you’ve been forced to replace it and ask for the total amount you’ve had to spend including installation to be refunded. They wil either pay up, offer a solution ie a payment somewhat less than your asking or ignore you. If you don't accept an offer, or they ignore you I would take the case to the County Courts. Now, it’s very easy to do, takes about 10mm online, BUT it’s not free, we are taking a hundred or so pounds depending on how much your claiming. But if you win you get it all back. Your case is simple, it’s failed after being professionally installed within two years and the manufacturer offer a warranty for up to five years. Now, this is almost certain to grab their attention. The courts love to bash company’s so the chance of them winning versus the damage and cost of defending the case is what they balance up. If your seeking less than say £1K it’s always in a company’s interest to settle out of court. However, if they don’t, you literally get a day out at the courts which is all very low key, intersting and you don’t need a lawyer.
Stuart Moffat
Established Member
I have had one fail about a year ago. My perception was that they do play for time, knowing that it’s something most people are severely impacted and just want it fixed quick. I gave all the measurements and photos that they asked for, and my installation was compliant with their installation requirements. We have a water softener so there is no issue with scale, the filter baskets in the shower pump feed were like new. Whilst their warranty states they may want to inspect the installation, and the installation must be left alone till they have approved replacement, I reckoned the odds of them doing that were close to zero when they have all the photographs. I did an improvised bypass of the pump to give us a reasonable gravity fed shower, and then went out and bought a different make. But I persisted chasing the replacement, which came about a fortnight after the failure (with a prologue for the delay!). So I now have a spare boxed ready for if and when the replacement fails!
profchris
Established Member
Not quite. It's the seller who is liable as you describe.I love how manufacturers like to hide behind ‘you didn’t register for the five year warranty’ Stuff. Manufactures make all sorts of demands on consumers on what they have to do to have a warranty. All complete waffle. So, what would I do, this would be my solution and I’m not recommending it or providing advice. Right, so the disclaimer is now in place
As I understand it, (I used to run company making consumer products, but that was over seven years ago before I retired ) manufacturers are responsible for their products for the reasonable expected life of their products to ensure they are material, design and manufacturing defect free. For the first year, it’s up the manufacturers to prove the unit wasn’t faulty, after that it’s down to the user. I would have taken photos of the installation and have records of who installed it. Second I would write to the manufacturer or where ever you bought it with a 14 day letter, (lots of templates online) explaining the reasonable steps you have made to ask them to resolve the problem, that you’ve been forced to replace it and ask for the total amount you’ve had to spend including installation to be refunded. They wil either pay up, offer a solution ie a payment somewhat less than your asking or ignore you. If you don't accept an offer, or they ignore you I would take the case to the County Courts. Now, it’s very easy to do, takes about 10mm online, BUT it’s not free, we are taking a hundred or so pounds depending on how much your claiming. But if you win you get it all back. Your case is simple, it’s failed after being professionally installed within two years and the manufacturer offer a warranty for up to five years. Now, this is almost certain to grab their attention. The courts love to bash company’s so the chance of them winning versus the damage and cost of defending the case is what they balance up. If your seeking less than say £1K it’s always in a company’s interest to settle out of court. However, if they don’t, you literally get a day out at the courts which is all very low key, intersting and you don’t need a lawyer.
Manufacturer is liable to its buyer, and so on down the line, but not with the consumer protections in place except for the final consumer.
The warranty is a separate contract which needs to be accepted by registering if that's the deal offered.
As a general rule I'd pursue the seller first.
Have you ever thought of fitting a water softener ? With a closed system, pressurised I would not fill with hard water and hard water is a good excuse used by many to make a few extra bucks.
Sachakins
The most wasted of days is one without woodwork
As an aside, if product fails within 6 months, onus is on retailer to orove its not faulty, after 6 months onus on customer to prove defective product, although most retailers don't enforce it, using instead their 12 month guarantee to do it.
Technically in England there is a legal case that products be of usable quality for up to 7 years. The caveat is that it is price dependent, ie if you pay £5000 for a TV, a court would expect that it would be reasonable to expect 7 years of life from it, however, if it was £500 its very unlikely they would expect it to last 7 years, (Scotland is 6 years)
Consumer law starts with the seller, not the manufacturer, always put onus back onto to seller, never let them fob you off with you have to contact manufacturer.
Technically in England there is a legal case that products be of usable quality for up to 7 years. The caveat is that it is price dependent, ie if you pay £5000 for a TV, a court would expect that it would be reasonable to expect 7 years of life from it, however, if it was £500 its very unlikely they would expect it to last 7 years, (Scotland is 6 years)
Consumer law starts with the seller, not the manufacturer, always put onus back onto to seller, never let them fob you off with you have to contact manufacturer.
RogerS
Established Member
I have always fitted Stuart Turner pumps in our houses and renovated properties. They have been excellent. The odd times I've had a minor problem, their records are detailed enough and go back far enough to be useful.
Thank you for the various comments on shower pumps. The pump was the choice of the plumber who installed it. The installation is a little more complicated as the previous owner installed solar panels (hot water not PV), which also are fed into the HW cylinder along with the gas boiler feed. I will be checking that the installation acords with Salamander pumps installation instructions, which I believe they do.
They used to make pumps for bus interior heating systems and were all brass / bronze construction.
eribaMotters
Established Member
Another vote for Stuart Turner here. It was only make my plumber mate would fit in our bathroom a few houses ago back in the mid 90's. That pump is still going strong, a 3 bar twin impeller, but at about £1,000 new you can see why they are not a common fitment.
Colin
Colin
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