Sharpening

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An interesting read as I'm just trying to revive my limited turning skills which inevitably means revisiting my even more limited skill at sharpening the tools. I have an elderly Electra Beckum bench grinder and the Axminster grinding jig below. Had them for years. Works ok for flat blades but was rarely used as my chisels and plane irons rarely warranted grinding. Since returning to a bit of turning I'm faced with grinding turning tools. Works OK with some tools, but gouges are very much 'work in progress'.

https://www.axminstertools.com/axmi...68I9b7DCshu-YhtL6pitX0Ti6_t4waWRoCqCYQAvD_BwE
Straight edges and simple spindle gouges are really easy to freehand, and it's the best way as you can keep refreshing the edge as you go, with very little interruption.
Bowl gouges less so, but not impossible.
Handy to have a sanding disc on your out-board end then you don't need any other sort of powered grinder.
I had a Pro-edge briefly but decided it wasn't paying its way.
 
Wow! I have that jig from many years ago and occasionally use it (very occasionally). I don't know if I paid the equivalent of that price though (I'm too tight-fisted). I have bolted it to a square bar to fit my homemade Wolverine-type system.
It's only since my wish to return to a bit of turning that I dragged mine out from under the bench. The original toolrests on the grinder were tiny and next to useless hence this purchase. I think it was probably about half the current price. I'd really like to improve my freehand sharpening technique because if you've only an hour or two workshop time available it can be a pain spending time fiddling around with a jig. I quite like the idea of a DIY wooden one as shown above.
 
It's only since my wish to return to a bit of turning that I dragged mine out from under the bench. The original toolrests on the grinder were tiny and next to useless hence this purchase. I think it was probably about half the current price. I'd really like to improve my freehand sharpening technique because if you've only an hour or two workshop time available it can be a pain spending time fiddling around with a jig. I quite like the idea of a DIY wooden one as shown above.
For most purposes you don't need a jig at all and it's much quicker. They don't feature in any of the old books, everybody managed without them.
You definitely don't need one for the gouge and straight chisel shown in that Axminster site above!
 
For whatever my opinion may be worth, I have a few comments.

I have been sharpening my chisels, plane irons, and turning tools for decades on a bench grinder with conventional grinding wheels and adjustable aluminum Veritas rests. The Veritas rests were a huge improvement over the stock rests, but I soon found that the anodized finish wore off in the grinding dust, causing considerable drag across the rests hindering smooth lateral movement of the tools.
Perhaps it goes without saying that the plane irons and chisels are ground only to establish the primary bevel, and the grinding is followed by work on either diamond plates, oil-stones, or water-stones. The tools are often then finished on a strop.

I recently purchased a set of CBN wheels, and I can only say that it has totally transformed my grinding... for the better! They cut very rapidly, and the tools remain cool. There is rarely the need to dip the tool in water to cool it off. I am sure that I will never go back to aluminum oxide wheels, etc. CBN wheels are a worthy investment, IMHO.

I also purchased the OneWay Wolverine rests and long grinding/skew grinding jigs. I did not purchase the Wolverine "Vari-Grind" jig.
I have a Wen slow speed wet grinder (a Tormek copy), so I am using the Tormek SVD-186 R Gouge Jig on both the Wen and the bench grinder with the addition of the Tormek OWC-1 Bench Grinder Adapter.

The advantage to the above set-up is only that of the ease of accurate repeatability. This saves not only time, but also wear on your turning tools.

Being a pupil of the Richard Raffan school of wood-turning, I do hone my skews and gouges prior to use, but basically just to remove the burr. That procedure takes only seconds, and leaves a razor edge.

I can see the logic of the various opinions posted above, but old habits die hard...
I am pleased with the results I obtain, and as some have said, that may be the best measure of success.
 
For whatever my opinion may be worth, I have a few comments.

I have been sharpening my chisels, plane irons, and turning tools for decades on a bench grinder with conventional grinding wheels and adjustable aluminum Veritas rests. The Veritas rests were a huge improvement over the stock rests, but I soon found that the anodized finish wore off in the grinding dust, causing considerable drag across the rests hindering smooth lateral movement of the tools.
Perhaps it goes without saying that the plane irons and chisels are ground only to establish the primary bevel, and the grinding is followed by work on either diamond plates, oil-stones, or water-stones. The tools are often then finished on a strop.

I recently purchased a set of CBN wheels, and I can only say that it has totally transformed my grinding... for the better! They cut very rapidly, and the tools remain cool. There is rarely the need to dip the tool in water to cool it off. I am sure that I will never go back to aluminum oxide wheels, etc. CBN wheels are a worthy investment, IMHO.

I also purchased the OneWay Wolverine rests and long grinding/skew grinding jigs. I did not purchase the Wolverine "Vari-Grind" jig.
I have a Wen slow speed wet grinder (a Tormek copy), so I am using the Tormek SVD-186 R Gouge Jig on both the Wen and the bench grinder with the addition of the Tormek OWC-1 Bench Grinder Adapter.

The advantage to the above set-up is only that of the ease of accurate repeatability. This saves not only time, but also wear on your turning tools.

Being a pupil of the Richard Raffan school of wood-turning, I do hone my skews and gouges prior to use, but basically just to remove the burr. That procedure takes only seconds, and leaves a razor edge.

I can see the logic of the various opinions posted above, but old habits die hard...
I am pleased with the results I obtain, and as some have said, that may be the best measure of success.
Last night I tried putting an edge on a couple of secondhand turning chisels that I'd bought, using the Axminster jig, and the wheel certainly produced more dust than I remember and introduced the friction you describe. One of the irritations was that this friction hindered smooth rotation of the tool but I lessened this by clamping a small piece of softwood to the toolrest to press the tool against. It worked much better than expected.
Changing the setup was more error than trial even using blacking on the edge but I got somewhere handy. A CBN wheel will have to remain on the wishlist for now.
 
Has anyone risked trying one of the cheap 150mm CBN wheels(around the £30 mark) from Amazon or AliExpress?
There are not enough reviews on Amazon so far to get an idea.
I've spotted wheels for similar prices on eBay but they're new to me and I simply don't know enough about them. I can't justify the £140-£150 price tag frequently seen but I suspect that like most things you get what you pay for. :)
 
Last night I tried putting an edge on a couple of secondhand turning chisels that I'd bought, using the Axminster jig, and the wheel certainly produced more dust than I remember and introduced the friction you describe. One of the irritations was that this friction hindered smooth rotation of the tool but I lessened this by clamping a small piece of softwood to the toolrest to press the tool against. It worked much better than expected.
Changing the setup was more error than trial even using blacking on the edge but I got somewhere handy. A CBN wheel will have to remain on the wishlist for now.
Putting wood on the rest is a good idea. I think I will try adhering some Formica to it. I have a lot of scrap Formica, and it should be durable!
 
Has anyone risked trying one of the cheap 150mm CBN wheels(around the £30 mark) from Amazon or AliExpress?
There are not enough reviews on Amazon so far to get an idea.
I've spotted wheels for similar prices on eBay but they're new to me and I simply don't know enough about them. I can't justify the £140-£150 price tag frequently seen but I suspect that like most things you get what you pay for. :)

Brothers,

Yes, I purchased "cheap" CBN wheels on Amazon. The two below:
80 GRIT: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08S7BD6FB/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1
320 GRIT: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0B4W52BVS/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1

The 80 GRIT wheel above is excellent, and apparently no longer available in that grit (now sold only in 180 GRIT). The 320 GRIT is also good, but a tad too coarse for a final finish.

Here is my Amazon review on the 80 GRIT wheel. It covers all bases:

Simply put: AMAZING...
Reviewed in the United States on August 6, 2024 Style: 80Grit
I have been woodworking for over 50 years (metalworking more recently). Sharpening is "my thing". I must say that I can put a razor edge on just about anything. Yet, despite that, I have generally been a total Neanderthal in all things woodworking.

I was slow in converting to CBN... that was a HUGE MISTAKE.

I bought the 80 grit wheel for establishing the primary bevel (see pic), as I like to progress to honing with bench stones for the ultimate edge. I still do that. I still recommend that practice. But, I will soon be buying a finer grit wheel for lathe tools; to go right from the wheel to the work.

That being said, this 80 grit wheel eats metal extremely rapidly!!! Yet, the tool stays COOL (relatively). Frankly, it is a TOTAL JOY to use.

I can now grind my primary bevels in a quick few minutes compared to the arduous task on a conventional abrasive wheel, which took a long time, and frequent dipping in water was required to cool the tool. On occasion, I would burn a tool! Very frustrating! THOSE DAYS ARE GONE!

I have recently been grinding British and American bench chisels, as well as plane irons with this CBN wheel. They are made of high-carbon steel. So far, there has been absolutely no build-up of metal on my wheel! I have read (and watched videos) that state that you can only sharpen HSS. Others claim that any hard steel is OK with CBN:
"CBN is best used to grind hard metals like:
• Steels with a hardness rating of at least 45Rc
• Cast and wrought irons
• Nickel alloys
It is second in hardness only to diamonds."


I can vouch for that! Most woodworking tool steel is 55-60Rc. I was hesitant to purchase CBN because I though it was only for HSS... NOT TRUE!

In closing, I was at first disappointed because I had a lot of runout on my old cheap 6-inch Grizzly grinder. I was using bushings to match my grinder spindle.
I then mounted the wheel on the opposite side, and it ran true and smoothly. I have read that sometimes you have to reposition the wheel a few times until you get it right. Try that. I worked for me.

I will be buying more CBN wheels.
Read less

01 Marples Plane Blade 80 grit Grind dsc04561.jpg

ADDENDUM- Prior to CBN, I was never able to get perfect primary bevels like the one above! (Unless I took it to a stone or diamond plate!)
 
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Brothers,

Yes, I purchased "cheap" CBN wheels on Amazon. The two below:
80 GRIT: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08S7BD6FB/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1
320 GRIT: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0B4W52BVS/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1

The 80 GRIT wheel above is excellent, and apparently no longer available in that grit (now sold only in 180 GRIT). The 320 GRIT is also good, but a tad too coarse for a final finish.

Here is my Amazon review on the 80 GRIT wheel. It covers all bases:

Simply put: AMAZING...
Reviewed in the United States on August 6, 2024 Style: 80Grit
I have been woodworking for over 50 years (metalworking more recently). Sharpening is "my thing". I must say that I can put a razor edge on just about anything. Yet, despite that, I have generally been a total Neanderthal in all things woodworking.

I was slow in converting to CBN... that was a HUGE MISTAKE.

I bought the 80 grit wheel for establishing the primary bevel (see pic), as I like to progress to honing with bench stones for the ultimate edge. I still do that. I still recommend that practice. But, I will soon be buying a finer grit wheel for lathe tools; to go right from the wheel to the work.

That being said, this 80 grit wheel eats metal extremely rapidly!!! Yet, the tool stays COOL (relatively). Frankly, it is a TOTAL JOY to use.

I can now grind my primary bevels in a quick few minutes compared to the arduous task on a conventional abrasive wheel, which took a long time, and frequent dipping in water was required to cool the tool. On occasion, I would burn a tool! Very frustrating! THOSE DAYS ARE GONE!

I have recently been grinding British and American bench chisels, as well as plane irons with this CBN wheel. They are made of high-carbon steel. So far, there has been absolutely no build-up of metal on my wheel! I have read (and watched videos) that state that you can only sharpen HSS. Others claim that any hard steel is OK with CBN:
"CBN is best used to grind hard metals like:
• Steels with a hardness rating of at least 45Rc
• Cast and wrought irons
• Nickel alloys
It is second in hardness only to diamonds."


I can vouch for that! Most woodworking tool steel is 55-60Rc. I was hesitant to purchase CBN because I though it was only for HSS... NOT TRUE!

In closing, I was at first disappointed because I had a lot of runout on my old cheap 6-inch Grizzly grinder. I was using bushings to match my grinder spindle.
I then mounted the wheel on the opposite side, and it ran true and smoothly. I have read that sometimes you have to reposition the wheel a few times until you get it right. Try that. I worked for me.

I will be buying more CBN wheels.
Read less
View attachment 187935
Ok. I've ordered one from AliExpress.
I shall be blaming you if it turns out to be rubbish.
Could I have your street address, please, so that I can send my American brothers in law round if I'm not satisfied?
 
Ok. I've ordered one from AliExpress.
I shall be blaming you if it turns out to be rubbish.
Could I have your street address, please, so that I can send my American brothers in law round if I'm not satisfied?
Yes, of course... however, I am sure you will love them.
I recommend the coarser grits (if you are like me).
My address is: 1600 Pennsylvania Ave NW Washington, DC 20500.
When you stop by, just ask for "Joe"... :ROFLMAO:.
P.S. Please update us with your first impressions!
 
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I bought my first CBN wheel in 2012, probably the best turning related tool I have ever purchased. Now they are more widely available but I'm very happy with the brand I chose, as it's 1.5 wide, which make it good for other cutting edges than just turning gouges.
Now I find out they have improved them
https://d-waytools.com/
 
I’ve started using a Burnisher for my wood turning scrapers and the burr you get is really sharp and more durable than anything straight from a grinder. I sharpen the scraper on an 800g belt, remove the burr then press a new one on with the Burnisher. When it dulls you can go back to the Burnisher a couple of times before needing the grinder again.
 
I remember when I started turning I had a video by Del Stubbs. He used an oilstone to sharpen some of his tools.

I don't use an oilstone but I do use a flat stone to sharpen my skew chisels, my ring tools and some of my scrapers and hollowing tool cutters by hand. I prefer my skews to have a flat bevel and the scrapers have a finer edge off a finer stone. The hollowing tool cutters just last longer being sharpened by hand.

Stone wheels don't crack unless you abuse them and having owned a CBN wheel, I may just buy a stone wheel next time I need a new wheel. Personally I don't thing CBN wheels are worth the extra expense.
 
I can and regularly do sharpen most blades freehand. I'm in the Jacob corner for most sharpening situations. With practice, it can be faster than setting up a jig. But, when turning, I tend to use a 1" roughing gouge for pen turning and roughing, a bowl gouge and a skew for the majority of what I tend to produce. I can put a cutting edge on any of these freehand if I wanted but usually, the Wolverine-type set-up is already in place for repetitive grinding. I timed myself setting up the jig for the bowl gouge - fifteen seconds. Grinding a new edge - eight seconds for each and subsequent grinds. Roughing gouge: nine seconds to set up, four seconds for each grind. Every grind will be the same as the last - every time. The skew is the only one that I grind freehand because most of the time I use a stone to sharpen it and may even hone it occasionally. Saying I don't use a jig though isn't really true. Isn't the tool rest on the grinder a jig? Of course, there are all the other tools I use on the lathe and depending on how much I am using each one depends on whether it's worth it to change the jig set-up or eyeball it by hand. The Wolverine-type set-up has been around for many more years before we referred to it as the 'Wolverine' system. It is easy to reproduce in wood or mild steel as I did with an Aldi cheap welder (£60) probably £20 worth of square stock. Quite a lot less than the Wolverine system and you've now got a welder for other projects (like a belt grinder) to boot. As Paul said above. If I needed to replace the twenty-year-old stones on my 6" grinder I would contemplate a CBN wheel. But, since woodturning takes up most of my workshop time, and much of that would be pen and bowl turning which means a lot of edge grinding per project, I think even though my stones have lasted this long, they still have many more years left in them, probably due to using a jig or maybe not. So that would be a very long contemplation. By the way. I sold my Tormek years ago. I think it was an impulse buy after I saw Norm Abraham using one.
 
I bought my Axminster Ultimate Edge some time ago when it was on special offer. I wouldn’t be without it now. Unlike the Pro Edge it’s variable speed and has forward and reverse. It’s great for removing a lot of steel if needed with a 60g belt, or putting a polished edge on my WT gouges with an 800g belt. I use non woven abrasives on the spindle for cleaning stuff up. I also have a leather wheel for polishing the inside of flutes etc, All in all it’s been worth what I paid for it.
 
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