Quick qestion on use of table saw.

[skeetstar]

Folks I need to rip some 8in timbers with the edge at 25deg. I'll be taking the minimum off the board to maintain as much width as possible.

I treat table saws with a great deal of respect, as I want to remain in possession of my fingers, eyesight etc.

I have set the blade over at 25deg and it leans from left to right, i.e. the top of the blade is toward the fence rather than away from it. Question is which side of the blade should the waste be? Should I set the fence so that the waste is between the fence and blade, or such that the waste is on the left hand side of the blade. Or does it even matter?

The blade wont foul the fence because I can use a low height fence option.

Sorry if this is seen as a dafty question, but I dont want to find out the hard way that I am doing it wrong.

Thanks in anticipation.

 

[Sgian Dubh]

Waste to the left of the blade, the piece you're dimensioning (with its complementary 65º angle) should run against the rip fence. Slainte.

 

[MattRoberts]

The waste should fall to the high side of the blade, so it doesn't get trapped between the blade and the table

 

[MatthewRedStars]

When you are ripping an angle I find its best to do it in two hits. They tend to move, burn, generally be a **** more than straight rips.

Take the meat off with the first cut leaving a mm to your line. Nudge the fence across for the second and final trim to size.

 

[deema]

Saws were / are traditionally setup with the fence at 1~2 degrees of taper away from the blade when it’s on the right hand side. This is for safety. The fence should either stop at the base of the gullets of the teeth or have a false fence added to make this the case. This allows plenty of room for the stuff to fall away from the blade and not become trapped. If your Saw is setup the traditional way never move the fence to the left hand side of the blade.

There is a trend to set the fence parallel to the blade, not one I personally subscribe to, it’s never going to be exactly parallel!

 

[Geoff_S]

I'm a bit confused with this one.

My table saw is designed to measure the cutting distance from the fence to the blade. Isn't that the only reason why the "waste" is to the left?

 

[skeetstar]

Brilliant fellas, thanks for the input.
Good advice on the two pass method, I'll try that. Deems, thanks for that info on the taper, it makes sense, , I've set the fence so it stops opposite the base of the tooth gullet on the leading edge of the blade, I read that on here somewhere, this really is a great site.

Thanks again

 

[skeetstar]

Well all safely done, thanks for the input, I have now an extra level to my skill set, albeit not a very high one.

 

[Steve Maskery]

I have a different take on this.
Firstly I agree with deema that IF your fence is skewed a tad, you should not have your fence to the left.
But.
I don't like the idea of a skewed fence, I prefer mine properly parallel. Why? Because although skewing the fence a few thou does prevent burning on the workpiece, it practically ensures burning on the offcut, and often I want both pieces. And if I am cutting tenons, one cheek will be clean and the other burned.
The problem with bevelling with a traditional tablesaw is that the workpiece is trapped with the saw bed underneath, the fence to the right and the saw blade to the left and above. If anything at all goes wrong, the workpiece can so very easily get kicked back, as there is nowhere else for it to go. That is why many modern saw designs, such as the Bosch that my brother has just bought, have the blade tilting AWAY from the fence, to the left, so that nothing can get trapped anywhere. The workpiece is not forced downwards and the waste is not trapped either.
But mine, like yours, tilts towards the fence, to the right.
So I move my fence to the left of the blade, like on a bandsaw. That way my workpiece cannot get trapped, the waste is free to fall away and I have no burning. Win, win, win.

 

[deema]

I personally have never had any issues with burning except with value blades of the waste material, even with a 16” blade. I off set the fence about Half the distance between the carbide teeth and the plate of the Saw, which is usually about 1/64” or 0.5mm. You don’t want the blade plate coming into contact with the stuff or it will heat up and cause the blade to destort producing both a poor cut and increasing the chances of an accident.

This offset came from something I read many years ago from Wadkin, I’ve tried to find the source, but instead came up with the Sedgwick manual for their saws. This also highlights that they offset their fences for safety reasons.

 

[Steve Maskery]

I don't agree with their representation of good setup. Yes, the fence is short, but it is not short enough. It should stop before TDC of the blade. In that diagram it extends to the very far end of the blade.
They are using that 1/64th gap to reduce kickback, but a proper short fence does the same job and can be used with a properly parallel fence, giving a clean finish on both workpiece and offcut.

 

[bg]

But Steve Maskery, whats wrong with the suggestion given in first answer, use the complementary angle, keep the waste to the left and fence to the right. The angle is much less and seems to save a lot of faffing about with the fence. Or do you think that any angle tilted towards the fence is to be avoided? My table saw would only give a very limited width if moved to the left of the blade.

 

[Steve Maskery]

The problem is that there is no clearance for the workpiece. It is in a tunnel, table below, fence on the right, canted blade left and above. If that workpiece catches or anything else goes wrong, there is nowhere for it to go. It can't go right, left, up or down. It can only go backwards...
With the fence to the left, the workpiece can at least go upwards, and the waste can go rightwards.

 

[MatthewRedStars]

The flip side to that is that the piece CAN rise.

As I half alluded to above, minimising the size of the offcut really helps. Even if you have to use an initial vertical cut to get the piece nearly to size.

Maybe it's my bad technique but i've never been able to get a straight and accurate angled rip through the middle of a board. I always treat it as a two hit process.

Things get easier with ply and then easier still with MDF. On a sliding table saw their is no option to move the fence (though you could make some kind of sliding table jig I guess)

 

[Steve Maskery]

The flip side to that is that the piece CAN rise.

True, but at least no harm is done if it does.
If it rises when in the tunnel, either more is cut off than I want, or it gets kicked back, or both.

 

[Steve Maskery]

This why modern saws have a left-tilting blade, by the way.

 

[Jacob]

..... the top of the blade is toward the fence rather than away from it.

This is inherently risky in that the piece between the fence and the blade can get lifted (vibration or whatever) and jam tight between blade and fence. Smaller pieces get shot out like a cross bow bolt, larger pieces get damaged and so can the blade.
Risk reduced if you rig up some sort of hold down e.g. feather board clamped to the fence, and/or use two push sticks.

Question is which side of the blade should the waste be? Should I set the fence so that the waste is between the fence and blade, or such that the waste is on the left hand side of the blade. Or does it even matter?
.....

The fence should be on the other side so that the blade leans away from it. Then the waste can fall away freely and the workpiece can't jam.

PS just read the thread and see that Steve has already said much the same!