problem stanley no4?

[woodbutcher]

hi all on the handtoolerie side,

i have a problem stanley bailey no4 which i can not set for the life of me no matter where i set the cap iron the blade still is to far out of the mouth of the plane.
i have the cap iron set so close to the end of the blade that it would not cut but it still has no adjustment.

can someone kindly help please!
thank you

woodbutcher
(richard)

 

[bugbear]

hi all on the handtoolerie side,

i have a problem stanley bailey no4 which i can not set for the life of me no matter where i set the cap iron the blade still is to far out of the mouth of the plane.
i have the cap iron set so close to the end of the blade that it would not cut but it still has no adjustment.

can someone kindly help please!
thank you

woodbutcher
(richard)

The most obvious reason would be a non original, incompatible cap iron.

One other possibility is that the yoke isn't engaging the adjuster wheel in the right way.

But this would be easier with pictures!

BugBear

 

[jimi43]

Hi Richard

I have a spare No.4 cap iron if you want to check that...PM me your address and I will post it to you.

Jim

 

[bugbear]

Hi Richard

I have a spare No.4 cap iron if you want to check that...PM me your address and I will post it to you.

Jim

No need - just measure the distance from the end of the cap iron to the slot where the yoke engages, and get Richard to do the same.

BugBear

 

[jimi43]

Hi Richard

I have a spare No.4 cap iron if you want to check that...PM me your address and I will post it to you.

Jim

No need - just measure the distance from the end of the cap iron to the slot where the yoke engages, and get Richard to do the same.

BugBear

DOH! Good idea BB!

Will do when I get back from work tonight...

Jim

 

[woodbutcher]

hi jim

the mesurement from the bottom of the capiron to the adjuster slot is 97mm and from the slot to the top is 34mm overall the cap iron is 132mm and the width is 51mm . it is made from 2mm steel and has an S stamped in the back , it also has a square top.

i hope that you can get it from that , sorry no photo's at present.

woodbutcher ( richard )

 

[GazPal]

So, the 97mm you measured is from leading edge of cap iron to rear edge of the adjuster slot?

 

[woodbutcher]

hi gazpal

the 97mm is from the nose of the cap iron to the top of the adjuster slot.

woodbutcher
(richard)

 

[matthewwh]

I've got 97mm on a QS and 98mm on a Clifton, so it would seem that the plane itself is wierd.

Wierd!

 

[Tom K]

97mm from the tip to the of the iron to the top of the small rectangular adjuster slot is correct. Not sure how familiar you are with hand planes
but sounds very much like the blade is upside down :?:

 

[GazPal]

97mm from the cap iron's leading edge to the rear of the adjuster slot is fine for Stanley's #4 and #5 irons, but have you;

1. Advanced the adjuster screw (Behind the frog) so it's fully/almost fully forward and the adjuster lever is set for the blade edge to rest behind the rear edge of the plane's mouth?

2. Ensured the adjuster lever is properly engaged within the slot on the cap iron?

3. Ensured the yolk (Inverted Y-shaped thingy behind the frog) is correctly seated within it's slot on the brass/steel adjuster screw?

 

[woodbutcher]

hi mathew,
yes it definitely is weird!

hi tom,
i have been using planes for the last 45years but never have i come across this .

hi gazpal,
(1)yes the adjuster screw is fully forward and the blade is still to far out of the soul of the plane.
(2)the adjuster is fully engaged with no slack.
(3)the yolk is fully engaged as well.


it just seems that the blade (although a stanley)is to long for the plane!and no matter how i adjust it it still will not set correctly .


woodbutcher

(richard)

 

[GazPal]

I'm only a handful of years behind you where planes useage is concerned, but not knowing you and having no clear picture of the plane in hand tends to make a problem such as this lend itself to a guesswork approach when trying to help in solving the problem. I think a few of us are in the same boat inasmuch as trying to help you out is concerned.

I have a subtle feeling this could be one of those Bermuda Triangle planes that Stanley would push out every now and then.

Have you sat the plane alongside another and ran through all of the basic set-up procedures? God only know everyone has blonde moments, but if everything checks out it should be capable of fitting together and setting up nicely.

Blade length shouldn't really matter if it's a 2" and set upon a #4 cap iron, but this does makes me wonder if the frog is the right one for the plane. It's strange if all of the above check out, yet things still don't fit. How long have you had the plane and how old is the plane?

Could the iron and cap iron be slipping off the adjuster when you go to fit the lever cap? Is the adjuster worn?

Pic's would definitely help.

 

[Paul Chapman]

it just seems that the blade (although a stanley)is to long for the plane!

Richard, it has nothing to do with the length of the blade. The problem, as others have said, concerns the position of the slot in the cap iron, which would appear to be too high up in your plane.

If you are sure that everything else is set up correctly, then the slot would appear to be the problem.

One thing you could explore is whether it would be possible to cut another slot in the cap iron in the correct position. Whether this is feasible depends on whether there would be enough metal between the new and old slots. Cutting it would be quite simple - just drill a couple of holes and file out the slot.

To calculate the correct position, I would assemble the blade and cap iron, with the cap iron set back about 1/8" from the edge of the blade. Put it in the plane with the blade/cap iron assembly retracted as far as you can get it and measure how far the blade is projecting. If you add about 1/16" to this measurement, that will give you the distance from the old slot that the new slot needs to be with the blade fully retracted. The new slot would need to be lower than the old one (ie closer to the sharp end of the blade ).

Hope this helps.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[bugbear]

hi mathew,
yes it definitely is weird!

hi tom,
i have been using planes for the last 45years but never have i come across this .

Do you have another Bailey with a 2" blade to allow a side-by-side comparison to hunt down the glitch?

BugBear

 

[Tom K]

All things being equal and provided the frog is correct
then the fault must lay with the yoke. How old is the plane?
Some of the later ones had a cheap and nasty pressed steel yoke.

 

[woodbutcher]

hi tom it is a cast yolk and i think that the plane is early 60's

woodbutcher
(richard)

 

[Tom K]

I guess you have checked the range of movement of the yoke with the
blade and cap iron removed. Can you measure it from the mouth?

 

[GazPal]

"I guess you have checked the range of movement of the yoke with the
blade and cap iron removed. Can you measure it from the mouth?"

I hope this may help for the sake of comparison;

Measured from the rear mouth edge to rear of tip of adjuster;

Stanley #4 (Circa late 50's early 60's)

97mm open, with the yoke fully engaged

88mm closed to the point just before the yoke disengages from the adjuster screw

Record #04 (Circa 1954 - 63)

97mm

87mm

Both adjusters and mouths are crisp edged, with no deviation from true.

 

[bugbear]

to the OP; did you find the fault (what was it?!) or do you still need more info?

BugBear