Precision square, where from?

[Beau]

Wont go far wrong with this: https://www.starrett.co.uk/shop/precision/shop_tools/combination_set/

Might also need to buy a smaller fixed engineers square for smaller jobs.

That looks a good call. Got a Moore and Wright combination much the same and was using it today and it's still square as the day I got it 25 years ago. Probably my most used marking out tool. I hear the arguments for and against engineering quality squares and realise there are workarounds for less precision squares but its not worth the hassle IMO. Enough inaccuracies creep into work without using dodgy squares. Get a quality one and it will last a lifetime if treated well.

 

[skipdiver]

I've got a Rabone Chesterman combination square that i bought as an apprentice and still use it everyday. It's accurate enough for me. Have several others of differing types but i usually reach for the Rabone.

 

[YorkshireMartin]

Wont go far wrong with this: https://www.starrett.co.uk/shop/precision/shop_tools/combination_set/

Might also need to buy a smaller fixed engineers square for smaller jobs.

That looks a good call. Got a Moore and Wright combination much the same and was using it today and it's still square as the day I got it 25 years ago. Probably my most used marking out tool. I hear the arguments for and against engineering quality squares and realise there are workarounds for less precision squares but its not worth the hassle IMO. Enough inaccuracies creep into work without using dodgy squares. Get a quality one and it will last a lifetime if treated well.

Sadly Moore and Wright are not the same these days. Made in China after being bought out by an investment group, I do believe.

I take what Mike said, but I think that the wear pattern is by design. I'm fairly certain I read somewhere that the locking pin is designed to wear and is replaceable. I think it's so the ruler itself doesnt wear quickly but dont quote me.

 

[YorkshireMartin]

Just had another thought. Incra Guaranteed Square are supposedly very accurate. Woodpecker also make very good quality squares. Both USA though so not ideal just at the moment.

 

[Bm101]

I have no idea what I'm about so this in no way posted as 'advice' but I have these two.
http://www.workshopheaven.com/tools/Kin ... 100mm.html

http://www.workshopheaven.com/tools/Kin ... -40mm.html

I find (in my very limited experience at least) they are (far) more than accurate enough for me. The small one is surprisingly handy. I use it for nearly everything, if i need a bigger reference I use the larger one of course but i use it for setting circular saw blades, all sorts. As a beginner I have enough problems trying to be accurate. I don't need the worry of my base measurement of square being out. I still cut wonky joints but I take comfort from the fact I can improve my skills, at least I have a reliable way way of measuring how wonky they are.

I also have an old Moore and Wright (ebay for pennies) which falls somewhere inbetween size wise which is bang on measured against the kinexs. But that's your gamble isn't it buying old tools? The one I inherited off my Grandad was out. I can't fix it but I can't throw it away either. I only found it was out when I got the Kinex ones.

A stanley combination square from diy days (so so) and a new Moore and Wright one which has a far better feel and if I had to recommend (as a beginner) 3 tools to buy it would be the two kinex and the M/W combi square (or similar). If I had to say just one it would be the best combination square you can't quite afford.

Just the mutterings of a beginners mind. They are reassuring tools when you pick them up, especially if there's doubt in your mind because you don't necessarily have years of experience and get-away-with-its to call on. I love my little squares. They are my little buddies.
Cheers.
Chris

 

[Fitzroy]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cxrCZd7r6qE

How to adjust a combination square. There is a better video but I'll be damned if I can find it right now.

F.

 

[MusicMan]

This assumes that you have stock that won't move and the tools to get that stock flat/square too (how would you measure that? ) . Chicken egg? Not sure why you would go to all that trouble as well as forking out for an adjustable square and not just buy a descent square in the first place? Each to their own I guess

Yes it does. I used 150 year old teak, and engineering techniques such as an engineers' surface plate to check all that. This was partly an exercise for me to see how accurately I could work. Obviously not everyone has these facilities. In the thread I suggest using metal T-bar slots as a relatively cheap way of getting pieces that are very flat and square.

The point is, how do you know the square is indeed decent ... and how decent ... and has it worn without you realising? I do find it hard to kick the precision habit after a long career in precision engineering of one sort or another, and I feel much more comfortable if I know the metrology is right.

 

[thetyreman]

I have a few starrett squares, whilst they are not cheap, they are worth it in my opinion longterm.

 

[RossJarvis]

I have a few starrett squares, whilst they are not cheap, they are worth it in my opinion longterm.

Unfortunately I made the mistake of buying a 12" and 6" starret combi squares. They'd be fine if I were still in engineering, but not for me as a chippy. Problems; Starrett do not make stainless blades, so unless you oil them all the time they will rust. The lock screws are not brilliant and will often not do up tightly enough, causing all sorts of issues. For the metric blades it is hard to get whole mm measurements. .5mm is ****** hard to read easily. For English I'm not sure if the scales are any less than 1/32, still not too easy to read.

I much prefer the PEC carpenter squares, which have excellent locking screws, stainless blades and easy to read scales. The major downside is that you may need to fettle out of the box to get a really true 90 degrees and they are incredibly difficult to get hold of. The importer won't sell direct so you need to find a local retailer.

For cabinetry in a workshop Starrett are probably fine, on site they are a PITA.

 

[Estoril-5]

Wow, thanks for the vast amount of info. Well I've been naive in squaring out.

I have a cheap combination square and a roofers square. Feel quite embarrassed by it all now.

Didn't realise it can get very expensive, £100 for a combination square, worth it but not something I myself can justify.

I think I'm going to get a 10 or 12" square first and take it from there.

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[MusicMan]

Estoril, I see you are in the West Midlands. I'm in Warwick. Feel free to drop round when you get a square, and I will calibrate/correct it for you! Send me a PM when you are ready.

Keith

 

[Estoril-5]

Now there's an offer you don't get everyday!

Quick question, if you have a 6" square, and you need to draw a 20" line, do you mark along the square up to 6" and then just use a ruler to extend the line?

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[MattRoberts]

Butt the ruler up against the square

 

[RossJarvis]

Now there's an offer you don't get everyday!

Quick question, if you have a 6" square, and you need to draw a 20" line, do you mark along the square up to 6" and then just use a ruler to extend the line?

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Generally I will set the square up and put a longer rule alongside that (touching it), remove the square and then mark the line along the rule. You really need a very sharp pencil or a knife or scriber to get the line right. You need to be careful holding the square and setting the rule. Regardless of how accurate your square is, if you don't know how to hold it against the workpiece (all too common I'm afraid) you'll never get the marking right, particularly a nightmare when using those squares with a 45degree top to the stock for mitres (not the combi square type).

 

[Bodgers]

If you want cheap and accurate avoid anything that is made out of more than one piece.


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[Estoril-5]

I bought a couple of these: http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-wo ... es-ax23310 contrary to the reviews mine where spot on.

Mike

Anyone else have these?

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[Beau]

I bought a couple of these: http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-wo ... es-ax23310 contrary to the reviews mine where spot on.

Mike

Anyone else have these?

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If you have an Axminster shop near by go check one out. With cheap squares the best option is to ask to use one of the BS branded ones and use it to check the cheaper options. However badly put together they are even chance would allow some of them to be square . Wanted a big square some years back and went for an Axy cheap one and when it arrived put a M&W square on it and it was well out of square. To be fair to them I complained and sent it back and they did me a very good deal on a M&W large square.

 

[Estoril-5]

Closest one is Nuneaton but I'm going to order online.

Think I'm going to bite the bullet on this one, it conforms to the Din standard and for under £20.

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-pr ... sel=102463

Let me know if I should opt for something else

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[MusicMan]

That looks good. That standard is 3 parts in 10000 in angle. or about 0.05 degrees.

Keith

 

[Estoril-5]

What I don't get is that Axminster precision square is din875 class 2 at £18 and then you get this din875 class 1 (which I'm assuming is better) for less than half the price...

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/p23063? ... LSkUcSJACW

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