powerful and european style router ...

[RogerP]

I wonder why the americans get a massive 2400W and only 2000W here?
.............

Frankly, in use, I can't tell a much of difference they're both very powerful.

 

[heimlaga]

I started thinking further.....

In America there seems to be a kind of gap in the tool market with very little between advanced hobbyist level and big industrial level. There are not very much tooling on the market that really is intended for a small scale professional workshop.
In Europe the same gap can be found between ordinary hobbyist level and small scale industrial level. Not very much tools on the market intended for advanced hobbyists.

Just a thought......

 

[sploo]

Many thanks for the replies to my posts on this thread.

I must admit I'm leaning towards the Triton TRA001 (or B, depending on what you get). The Trend T11EK and Dewalt DW625EK do look almost identical; except for the fact the Dewalt seems to be cheaper. The 80mm plunge stroke is interesting, but I could live with the Triton's 68mm - especially given that you can change bits from above the table, and that the height can be set above the table (like the Trend). The fact it's cheaper than either the Trend or Dewalt is good too.

From reading numerous forums, I get the gist that:

• Many people believe the Dewalt to have some better quality parts than the Trend (not sure if this is true)
• Height adjustment above the table is a big plus with the Trend and Triton
• The Triton is great in a table, but not so good handheld

The latter point doesn't bother me as I hardly ever use a router handheld these days, and the perfectly usable "cheapy" Worx WX15RT that's currently in the table can be my handheld work horse (it did a set of solid oak kitchen worktops, so it's decent - it's just a faff to use in a table).

 

[Ed Bray]

It would be worth a search on Routerforums.com using Triton TRA001 for a good review of the router and its use both in and out of the table.

Had I not other routers that I use out of the table I would not hesitate to use the TRA001 if I needed to.

 

[paulrockliffe]

I thought the power difference int he marketing was because in some countries it's the input power that's quoted, in others it's the output power.

 

[mseries]

The Dewalt 625 is the same as the Trend T10.

The Trend T11 is the same as the above except for the base which is optimised for undertable use by providing above table height adjustment.

 

[sploo]

It would be worth a search on Routerforums.com using Triton TRA001 for a good review of the router and its use both in and out of the table.

Had I not other routers that I use out of the table I would not hesitate to use the TRA001 if I needed to.

Will do thanks. Also good to know you're happy with it out of the table.

I thought the power difference int he marketing was because in some countries it's the input power that's quoted, in others it's the output power.

That did cross my mind, as there's a lot of liberties taken with ratings of motors - especially the trick of claiming a horsepower figure on US tools that's not actually possible with the wattage you could (constantly) draw from a standard 110v socket (basically using the "breaking" current, IRC).

The Dewalt 625 is the same as the Trend T10.

The Trend T11 is the same as the above except for the base which is optimised for undertable use by providing above table height adjustment.

Thanks - that makes a lot of sense (in the "T11 is a DW625 with an above table fine height adjuster" argument).

 

[gidon]

I use a Trend T11 - which is designed for router table use. I use an Xtreme Xtension collet extender and attach the router directly to the table. Much easier plus the quick change feature on the XX makes using the table a breeze.

Here's my table: two sheets of MDF, laminated with a Trend T11 attached directly to top. I picked up the Incra fence in the US for £50! (It was quite some time ago when the exchange rate was fantastic!)

Cheers

Gidon

 

[mseries]

I just re-read the original post, can you not use a US tool with a 110V transformer ?

 

[sploo]

I use a Trend T11 - which is designed for router table use. I use an Xtreme Xtension collet extender and attach the router directly to the table. Much easier plus the quick change feature on the XX makes using the table a breeze.

Here's my table: two sheets of MDF, laminated with a Trend T11 attached directly to top. I picked up the Incra fence in the US for £50! (It was quite some time ago when the exchange rate was fantastic!)

Nice looking setup. What did you use for the laminating (formica)?

I just re-read the original post, can you not use a US tool with a 110V transformer ?

Yes, and it works fine. I've got a CNC machine with a Porter Cable 892 router fitted, where I rewired the cable for a yellow 110v building site type plug, and use a transformer.

The problem is that once you've factored in the cost of getting a US router to the UK (shipping+tax) and got a transformer, the price doesn't look so attractive.

 

[gidon]

I use a Trend T11 - which is designed for router table use. I use an Xtreme Xtension collet extender and attach the router directly to the table. Much easier plus the quick change feature on the XX makes using the table a breeze.

Here's my table: two sheets of MDF, laminated with a Trend T11 attached directly to top. I picked up the Incra fence in the US for £50! (It was quite some time ago when the exchange rate was fantastic!)

Nice looking setup. What did you use for the laminating (formica)?

Thanks. I think I got the laminate from Jewsons - but it was a long time ago.

Cheers

Gidon

 

[sploo]

I've looked into the Triton routers a bit more, and (whilst you obviously can't believe everything you read on the 'net) the gist seems to be that the 2400w vs 2000w issue is actually down to EU rating requirements - i.e. it's the same unit, just rated under different legislation.

Looking at the manual for the Trend T10/T11, it lists input power as 2000w and output power as 1400w (a plausible sounding 70% efficiency). I don't know if the Triton is 2400w in and 2000w out (a fairly high 83%) or whether it's simply the same input power as the Trend, and the 2400w figure is from some, errr, marketing (bovine excrement), rating system. Either way, my 1500w Worx has never struggled with the bits I use, so 2000w will be fine.

I did see a hint that TRA is Triton Router Australia, and TRC was Triton Router Canada. Whether TRB is Triton Router Britain I don't know - however I've seen some North American buyers claim they ordered a TRA and got a TRC with above-table adjustment. I'm seriously thinking that the TRA/B/C are probably all the same, and it's just that the older stock didn't have the above-table adjustment.

Thanks. I think I got the laminate from Jewsons - but it was a long time ago.

Thanks. I was just wondering if it was any special/specific material that you used.

 

[sploo]

In the hope it might be useful for others; I looked into the TRA001/B/C differences. Triton's response was:

I have looked in to[sic] this with our technical team they have advised me that TRA/TRB/TRC are regional variations of the same item. We would recommend if you are to purchase one these that you go for the TRA model as this is the current up to date product that we currently stock for UK retailers.

I also spoke with Dennis Leverett (who sells Triton gear via tritontools.uk.com) and he confirmed the same.

I'm almost certain that the 2000W vs 2400W issue is purely about regulation and advertising; I ordered a TRA001 from Dennis, and it's clearly labelled as 2400W, but the amperage is rated at 9.1A (from memory - I don't have it in front of me right now). 9.1A at 220V is 2002W, so I'm pretty certain it'll be related to stricter advertising rules in the EU.

The UK version rather bizarrely comes with a 1/2" and 12mm collet - despite the fact we do seem to be very imperial when it comes to router bits here. Dennis sells 1/4" collets, so I have one of those (much better than a 1/2" to 1/4" reducing sleeve).

I haven't used it in anger yet, but initial impressions are good. Seems pretty sturdy, quiet, and I love the free plunge/rack and pinion system. Be really careful removing the plunge spring though - the length of the spring is such that it's about 6" longer than the length of the leg, so when you remove the cover it will come out pretty quickly. The end result should be great for table use.

The plastic base plate is held onto the metal base with four 1/4" UNC screws (I believe 20tpi/coarse). There are three M6 tapped holes in the metal base but they're in odd positions. I've asked Triton if they have measurements, but no answer yet. I've ordered some 3/4" x 1/4" UNC screws in the hope that'll be perfect for mounting it under a 1/2" thick router table insert.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

This is the second post I've read since yesterday that's said our voltage is 220v - I thought our mains were 230v?

 

[sploo]

This is the second post I've read since yesterday that's said our voltage is 220v - I thought our mains were 230v?

It varies (there's an allowable margin of error). At my place it's usually 230+ but I just noticed 9.1 x 220 ~= 2000.

 

[dc_ni]

This is the second post I've read since yesterday that's said our voltage is 220v - I thought our mains were 230v?

It varies (there's an allowable margin of error). At my place it's usually 230+ but I just noticed 9.1 x 220 ~= 2000.

Wondered about this myself, always thought we were 240v but see stuff as listed at 230v so i decided to google it and this is what I found

For many years, mainland Western Europe has used a mains electricity supply rated at nominally 220VAC 50Hz. The UK used 240VAC 50Hz.

Currently, ALL Western European supplies are classified 230VAC. In reality there is no 230VAC supply unless you create one locally. 230VAC was a “standard” created during European "harmonisation" to give a single voltage standard across Western Europe, including UK and Irish Republic.

Although the ideal would have been to have a single voltage there were too many political, financial and technical obstacles to reduce UK voltage to European levels or to increase European voltage to UK levels, so a new standard was created to cover both. This was achieved by changing the tolerances of previously existing supply standards. UK voltage to 240VAC + 6% and - 10% and European to 220VAC +10% and -6% (thereby creating a manageable overlap) and we would call these two combined 230VAC, despite the fact that nobody was intentionally generating at 230VAC!

 

[wcndave]

The original poster seems to have disappeared... in case you're still there, I live just North of you, you're welcome to come and try out my collection of routers, including a round one mounted in a table, which came with the table. Cheap, average quality, ideal for hobby use.

 

[Job and Knock]

European routers seem to be quite lacking in proper design IMO. I want the US style cylindrical bodied ones that you can swap out bases for, or use the router in the table with only the cylindrical body.

It depends on what you need, Dennis. Like most tradesmen the vast majority of my work is done out of the table, hand held. Where things need to be done in the table (e.g. heavy profiling or large rebates) then a spindle moulder or overhead pin router is the way to go if the budget permits. I suspect that far more heavy-duty 1/2in routers are sold to tradesmen and workshops than to hobbyists.

I wonder why the americans get a massive 2400W and only 2000W here?
But to be honest it seems alot of the high quality counterparts are rated at 1400 and 1600 watts so perhaps it's not all about the wattage.

I suspect it has something to do with the way that measurements are taken. In the USA manufacturers are allowed to quote HP figures based on maximum current drawn or some such which allows them to quote outlandishly high power outputs. But a 2000watt router will still have a lot more power and torque than a 1400 watt one - something you soon realise when you start working solid surface (e.g. Corian) which hammers equipment mercilessly

 

[sploo]

It depends on what you need, Dennis. Like most tradesmen the vast majority of my work is done out of the table, hand held. Where things need to be done in the table (e.g. heavy profiling or large rebates) then a spindle moulder or overhead pin router is the way to go if the budget permits. I suspect that far more heavy-duty 1/2in routers are sold to tradesmen and workshops than to hobbyists.

From what I've seen so far, the TRA001 looks to have been very well thought out - a bit large and heavy for handheld use perhaps, but very suited for table use (which is often a weak point of plunge routers).

I suspect it has something to do with the way that measurements are taken. In the USA manufacturers are allowed to quote HP figures based on maximum current drawn or some such which allows them to quote outlandishly high power outputs. But a 2000watt router will still have a lot more power and torque than a 1400 watt one - something you soon realise when you start working solid surface (e.g. Corian) which hammers equipment mercilessly

Yep. It always amuses me when you see a tool sold in the US that claims a horsepower figure that wouldn't actually be possible based on the necessary current draw from a standard wall outlet (i.e. it's a "marketing" derived figure rather than one derived from any sort of real world use).

 

[DennisCA]

It depends on what you need, Dennis. Like most tradesmen the vast majority of my work is done out of the table, hand held. Where things need to be done in the table (e.g. heavy profiling or large rebates) then a spindle moulder or overhead pin router is the way to go if the budget permits. I suspect that far more heavy-duty 1/2in routers are sold to tradesmen and workshops than to hobbyists.

I want cylindrical bodies because they are easy to work with and integrate into homemade solutions, and they take a lot less space that way. I had to modify my tilting router lift and modify the mount to make it work with my plunge router, which I basically stripped down to it's bare essentials to make it work, even had to reroute the power cord. I want to build a pantorouter one day and I don't wanna muck about with a clumsy plunge router again, fortunately it seems Draper sells a nice router at a reasonable price level.