My new Knife and the Law

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bugbear":3tjzuks9 said:
paulm":3tjzuks9 said:
This particular Q&A thread covers all the key points on what you can and can't do in the first post

http://www.britishblades.com/forums/sho ... php?t=8336

Cheers, Paul :D

pipper. The knife I've been carrying for years is illegal! Even more annoyingly, my multi-tool is too.

BugBear

It made me think abit - the small stanley knife that folds - is technically a lock-knife and I've wondered off numerous times to get odds & sods (dressed as a scruffy site labourer) with it in my pocket & occasionally clipped to the outside of the pocket).

Having said that i f PC plod asked me to turn out my pockets - better have a bucket for the sheer amount Nbr 10 screws and 3" RS nails. Knowing my luck it would just increase the nbr of "offensive" weapons on the charge sheet! :roll:
 
Common Sense has to be applied to this. How many blokes here are likely to get stopped and searched by a Police officer? and if a pen knife or multi-tool is found on you, how likely is it you will actually be charged? You need to worry if you have some sort of criminal background. But generally the world has gone barmy if a middle aged bloke, minding his own business, is stopped, searched and charged for carrying a pen knife.

Could the officers of the law among us explain how much discretion an officer has in these matters and how much common sense is applied?
 
The knife I've been carrying for years is illegal!

I wouldn't lose too much sleep over it BB. If you consider the number of offenses now on the statute book we probably all break some meaningles laws every day!

Roy.
 
wizer":2ii3taxc said:
Common Sense has to be applied to this. How many blokes here are likely to get stopped and searched by a Police officer? and if a pen knife or multi-tool is found on you, how likely is it you will actually be charged? You need to worry if you have some sort of criminal background. But generally the world has gone barmy if a middle aged bloke, minding his own business, is stopped, searched and charged for carrying a pen knife.

Could the officers of the law among us explain how much discretion an officer has in these matters and how much common sense is applied?

I guess about the same as if I found a sawn-off shotgun at the bottom of my garden and took it into my local police station like a good citizen.
 
I think it's a strict liability offence as well. So, none.
The best thing to do if you don't want to get nicked is to not break the law, not try to think of some way round it.

And I still don't understand why you need a knife to walk a dog.
 
Smudger":cdx7f6kx said:
I think it's a strict liability offence as well. So, none.
The best thing to do if you don't want to get nicked is to not break the law, not try to think of some way round it.

And I still don't understand why you need a knife to walk a dog.

So I could have cut the bloke down from the tree if he was still taking his last gasp's of breath.
 
RogerS":23iw6hvi said:
I guess about the same as if I found a sawn-off shotgun at the bottom of my garden and took it into my local police station like a good citizen.

I think that's wildly different Roger. Lots of people are likely to carry a swiss army knife type tool and not realise it's illegal. The discovery of a gun in any situation would be cause for concern and thorough investigation.
 
wizer":2n7asg83 said:
RogerS":2n7asg83 said:
I guess about the same as if I found a sawn-off shotgun at the bottom of my garden and took it into my local police station like a good citizen.

I think that's wildly different Roger. Lots of people are likely to carry a swiss army knife type tool and not realise it's illegal. The discovery of a gun in any situation would be cause for concern and thorough investigation.

Not over here in Longsight Manchester...They would just take it off
you and give you a home watch sticker :lol: :lol:
Leave the knifes at home..in the shed
 
It must be something to do with my age, but I fail to understand why the law should concern itself with the fact that I, at 69, carry a pocket knife, do they seriously suggest that I am about to run around slaughtering all and sundry?

Roy.
 
They probably don't.
But they do care that young men go about tooled up and stabbing each other. As they can't ban young men, they have said that certain kinds of knives are not legal.
As most of us would have no reasonable need for an 8" locknife, it shouldn't be too much of a problem...
 
They certainly can ban young men, after all they are banned from voting, entering a pub, driving a motor vehicle, marriage, owning a firearm, standing for Parliament, entering into contracts, joining the armed forces, all are age related.

Roy.
 
No it wasn't a joke. I simply made the point that age is a determinant factor in the application of certain laws, ok?
You suggested that age was major factor in knife crime, so why persecute those outside of that age?

Roy.
 
Because a law is a law. I didn't realise that was so hard to understand.

I copied this from the 'British Knife Collector Guild' website.

THE LAW
YOUR KNIFE AND YOU

Despite what you may have been led to believe, our knife laws are amongst the most sensible in the modern World.

In Great Britain we benefit from laws which promote the sensible use and collecting of fine cutlery, yet discourage those who seek to abuse what are, in effect, artistic, well engineered tools. In short, be aware of the following points, although please read the linked articles for more in-depth information ...

What You Can't Have ...
The following items are banned from sale within the UK (although if you already own one you may keep it, but not use it outside of your own property) ... Switchblades, automatics or 'flick-knives', gravity knives, balisongs or 'butterfly knives', push daggers, belt buckle knives, sword canes, disguised knives, or knuckle-duster knives.

Late on in 2004, an amendment to the law was introduced which restricts the sale of any knife which is not readily detectable by the normal methods of detection, ie: either x-ray or metal detection, unless it can be proven that the knife's sole purpose is for the preparation of food. So for instance, the Cold Steel CAT Tanto or Lansky Knife are now prohibited within the UK. These knives are correctly referred to as Airport Knives, but in English law are commonly referred to as Stealth Knives.

In 2006, so-called Disguised Knives were prohibited. You may not buy any knife designed to look like something else, for instance a knife which appears to be a pen, (and it doesn't matter whether the pen works or not, it's still prohibited here).

What You Can Carry ...
The Criminal Justice Act (1988) says that you may carry a knife with a blade length of 3.0" or less so long as it is capable of folding. That means no fixed blade knives. But use your loaf - a knife has no place at a football match, in a pub, nightclub or school and becomes an offensive weapon in these circumstances in just the same way as a screwdriver, or any other innanimate tool.

But I NEED a Bigger Knife ...
If you wish to carry a larger knife then you must have 'reasonable cause'. That means that you must be able to prove that you had a genuine reason for carrying the knife.

You may carry a larger cutting tool if it is associated with your work (for instance a chef may carry a 9.0" butchers knife roll to and from work), or if it is associated with your sport, (for instance a fisherman may carry a 6.0" fillet knife, or a hunter may carry a 4.0" fixed blade hunting knife).

Don't forget it's there though. If you stop off in Tesco's for a can of beans on your way home take the knife off of your belt and lock it in your glove box, or your local Bobby will be unimpressed at your excuses. When transporting a knife by car keep it locked away in the glove box or securely stored in the boot of the vehicle. Do not slip it into the door side-pocket, under your seat or in a centre console, this is a dangerous practice, and if stopped by the Police this gives the impression of keeping the knife close to hand.
 
Because a law is a law.

And yes they can a little difficult to understand when for example the law insists on a Mandatory five year term for carrying such an item and judges ignore it!
Plus when such laws state that it is an offense to die in the Houses of Parliament I have to wonder how they expect to enforce that one!
And I repeat what you ignored. Many laws are age related, I was not suggesting some Earth shattering new idea.

Roy.
 
Smudger":2uxt12js said:
So this was something you were anticipating?
I could do that with my perfectly legal SA knife.

No I wasn't expecting to find a 31 year old man hanging from a tree. But if he hadn't been as dead as the beers he had just sunk then maybe just maybe ~I could have cut him down and maybe somehow changed things.
The cable he used was 110v cable so the cutting implement would have had to have been of a substantial size.

12 years in the Parachute Regiment have taught me that having a cutting device in my pocket at all times helps in times of need.

The truck driver in France i'm guessing is pretty chuffed that I something on me so I could cut him out of his seat-belt.

Believe it or not we are not all knife wielding idiots.
 
wizer":4qoae9b8 said:
Common Sense has to be applied to this. How many blokes here are likely to get stopped and searched by a Police officer? and if a pen knife or multi-tool is found on you, how likely is it you will actually be charged? You need to worry if you have some sort of criminal background. But generally the world has gone barmy if a middle aged bloke, minding his own business, is stopped, searched and charged for carrying a pen knife.

Could the officers of the law among us explain how much discretion an officer has in these matters and how much common sense is applied?

I agree with your thoughts above Tom, and I generally carry what I like, when I like, on that basis, but it's worth being aware of the potential risk in the event you find yourself having a discussion with an over-zealous or less well informed constable I guess.

As for Smudger's 8" lock knife, you're beginning to sound like the Daily Mail ! Nobody is discussing 8" zombie slaying martial arts tactical type fantasy knives :roll: , what is being discussed is sensible folks carrying sensible and very useful everyday tools of moderate size with a valuable built in finger saving safety feature which, even if the blade is only 1" long, is deemed illegal without some reasonable cause being present!

As BB says, even carrying many of the common Leatherman and other type multitools or a beautifully made and very useful classic Laguiole can theoretically cause you a problem, with no differentiation between those and the stupid fantasy type of knives and no differentiation for the owner of same being a middle aged upstanding member of the community (not me then :lol: ) in a rural location walking their dog versus a young gang member with form acting suspiciously or aggressively in an inner city hot spot area.

In the latter case if they are the type to cause problems then they will likely do so with whatever they can get their hands on, be it screwdrivers, pointed sticks, bricks, glass bottles or whatever, but I don't think anybody is planning to make them illegal for people to have in normal usage.

The issue is the individuals and not what they are using.

As usual the legislation is an exceedingly blunt instrument that criminalises the vast law abiding majority while doing little or nothing to actually address the target or core issue which is the individuals and their propensity for violence by whatever means comes to hand.

Just my own thoughts for what they are worth :wink:

Cheers, Paul :D
 
As usual the legislation is an exceedingly blunt instrument that criminalises the vast law abiding majority

Which beautifully explains my opinion also. Thank you Paul.

Roy.
 

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