Monty Don's craft show (woodworking) SPOILER

[woodbrains]

Hello,

Bad spell corrector! Should be material costs.

Mike.

 

[Glynne]

Clamped in the vice with a fence on the router......no fancy wancy Norm type stuff such as router tables here!

I thought I saw a Rutlands router table in the background?

 

[deema]

It may have been my eyesight, but I thought the example box joints had a few gaps? What ever became of hidden mitered dovetaits for true craftsmanship?

 

[riclepp]

I thought the tables were.....errrm how can one put it politly....*****!!!!! I would not pay 1 pence for them let alone 400 to 500 quid. Jeeze what are designers thinking. In my mind the live in a world of pink fluffy stuff and not reality. The amatures also had two weeks to design and complete a small occasional table, they bearly managed that, how will they ever survive in the real world!!

I like the show though

 

[petermillard]

Had to laugh at Monty Don waffling on about how the winner’s commission could see them selling ‘scores of tables’ through Benchmark outlets. Last time I checked, a ‘score’ was only 20, so hardly going to keep the maker busy / in luxury...

Pete

 

[undergroundhunter]

Had to laugh at Monty Don waffling on about how the winner’s commission could see them selling ‘scores of tables’ through Benchmark outlets. Last time I checked, a ‘score’ was only 20, so hardly going to keep the maker busy / in luxury...

Pete

I agree 20 units would not a living make, but what a fantastic start to a new career, I don't think the show is intended to turn the winner into an instant business success its more of a boost to give a starting point on which to build.

Matt

 

[AnLasair]

just watched it on catch up. I do not understand why that guy dropped out... his excuse seemed flimsy, I am at college at the moment but if I had the chance to be involved in something like that I would take a month off college for it and I can say with almost certainty that the college would be fine with that. They put me down of "placement" if I get any temping work in a related field so I see no reason why they wouldn't do the same for this or why his course wouldn't do the same. Seemed like an excuse to me, I think he bottled it as he felt out of his depth

I was not that keen in the tables to be honest. The nymph one especially as to me it sort of looked like a chair, but that may just be me. I did like the steam bending of the legs on the other though, I just feel something more interesting could have been done with the top.

 

[Sgian Dubh]

I do not understand why that guy dropped out... his excuse seemed flimsy, I am at college at the moment but if I had the chance to be involved in something like that I would take a month off college for it.

He's a student at the Royal College of Art, and perhaps falls into the same category as those ladies that are, as they say, too posh to push, ha, ha. Tongue firmly planted in cheek on my part. Slainte.

 

[AnLasair]

lol, I guess. Still seems odd to me though as in my view nothing beets hands on experience, and being able to work with people who are considered "masters" in their field has got to be a beneficial thing in the long run. Both for your own skills and as something to add to your CV (or just to drop into conversation with an employer).
But that might just be me. As a rule I will jump at any chance to work with people who are established within the world of joinery/carpentry as there is so much that you can learn from them, and even without considering the learning potential the networking potential has to be huge

 

[devonwoody]

come on Jacob, your views would be worth a pot of gold on this one. (hammer) :wink:

 

[Jacob]

come on Jacob, your views would be worth a pot of gold on this one. (hammer) :wink:

I'm flattered!
I already posted on this. Basically if he is already at the RCA and a posh chap with money behind him, a fly-by-night TV prog and an opportunity with one of many furniture outlets, would be a distraction and he probably thought better of it. He already has all the privileges he needs.

 

[disco_monkey79]

I enjoyed the prog - wasn't sure Monty brought much to the table (no pun intended), other than snide comments.

 

[Glynne]

As they were at Acton Scott, it was a shame they didn't nip across to Andrew Crawford's workshop and do a profile of him.

 

[Shultzy]

I was disgusted at the wood show. It was disrespectful to the many amazing amateurs which grace our forum with their remarkable skills as shown in the many projects here. The three contestants were not woodworkers as they demonstrated with their box making skills. As they all didn't know how to use the powered machinery properly you would have thought their hand skills would have been good. In the box making task (8hrs time limit) the "token" female chopped all the pieces to length before she had sized them. Surely even 1st year students know you have to "keep it as long as you can, for as long as you can". The youngest only finished one corner, although he managed to plane the lid, before dropping out; I suspect he realised he was out of his depth. The older of three, who had ideas above his skill level, managed part of the box but his dovetails were awful.

The two remaining contestants made tables for the judges. The end results could have been bettered by any 5th form woodwork student. The trainer didn't really help, fancy allowing someone to steam bend table legs when they have never done it before, especially for a competition entry. These people wanted to make a career of woodwork and didn't appear to have worked at it for very long.

I'm sure this is one of those programmes made for the accidents / incidents / comedy, rather than the genuine skill component.

 

[Mr T]

Just watched it on 4od and my main feeling was one of embarrassment. Embarrassment for the contestants whose hopes were raised to unrealistic levels for entertainment purposes. For the professionals concerned jeopardising their integrity in such a weak concept and for Monty Don spouting such twaddle.

Chris

 

[Mr T]

Just watched it on 4od and my main feeling was one of embarrassment. Embarrassment for the contestants whose hopes were raised to unrealistic levels for entertainment purposes. For the professionals concerned jeopardising their integrity in such a weak concept and for Monty Don spouting such twaddle.

Chris

PS I was also embarrassed for myself watching it through to the end!

 

[Jacob]

I suppose you are right. I've got very low expectations of TV to start with and if it's crap I take it for granted.
But the contrast between the Scot chaps fussy amateur table design and his finished product was interesting. If that was genuinely his personal achievement then he gained something. But it might have been a fix by the production team.
And why turn it into a cliche competition/race? What's wrong with a straight documentary?

 

[Sgian Dubh]

I was disgusted at the wood show. It was disrespectful to the many amazing amateurs which grace our forum with their remarkable skills as shown in the many projects here.

Oh dear. I hardly know where to begin, but here goes.

The three contestants were not woodworkers as they demonstrated with their box making skills.

Agreed. That was surely the point?

As they all didn't know how to use the powered machinery properly you would have thought their hand skills would have been good.

Why? You seem to be assuming that all woodworkers develop hand skills before they learn how to use machinery. I know quite a few woodworkers that can knock out some pretty good stuff primarily using machinery but are quite weak when they're given hand tools to work with.

In the box making task (8hrs time limit) the "token" female ...

I've met Jodie. I suspect she would be offended by your comment, and from what I know of her I wouldn't be surprised in a conversation with you she'd make you retract that pretty quickly.

... chopped all the pieces to length before she had sized them. Surely even 1st year students know you have to "keep it as long as you can, for as long as you can".

You might be surprised how long it takes for fundamental practices in any profession to become routine. I come across third year BA(Hons) students that forget that one, and when I ask why they've done it they usually redden up and admit they simply 'forgot'. Daft I know, but it's true.

The youngest only finished one corner, although he managed to plane the lid, before dropping out; I suspect he realised he was out of his depth. The older of three, who had ideas above his skill level, managed part of the box but his dovetails were awful.

I largely agree with what you say there, but the skill levels demonstrated didn't surprise me given the limited woodworking experience any of them had.

The two remaining contestants made tables for the judges. The end results could have been bettered by any 5th form woodwork student.

Are you sure about that? Have you seen what sort of stuff some fifth form 'resistant materials' students turn out? I've seen a great deal of what A level students in this subject produce, and a much of it is a lot more basic than the tables produced.

The trainer didn't really help, fancy allowing someone to steam bend table legs when they have never done it before, especially for a competition entry.

Trying to restrict an ambitious but inexperienced practitioner in a creative environment can be very difficult. As a teacher or supervisor you have to be careful that you don't stamp out all ambition. Much learning is possible through failures and difficulties: restricting learners only to what they can achieve with relative ease doesn't always provide the most memorable lessons. The participants had the opportunity to push themselves, and the steam bending seems to me to be a chance taken to do that.

These people wanted to make a career of woodwork and didn't appear to have worked at it for very long.

Er, obviously. Wasn't that the point?

I'm sure this is one of those programmes made for the accidents / incidents / comedy, rather than the genuine skill component.

I didn't see it like that. I even passed on a catch-up link to my furniture students for them to evaluate and to consider the implications for their own future. I am aware (as their teacher) that even a very successfully qualified student leaving my course has a great deal still to learn when they enter industry. Just on the manufacturing side they neither work fast enough nor accurately enough, and the best ones need to at least double their speed and to generally raise their accuracy by something in the order of perhaps 80 or 100%. Slainte.

 

[AnLasair]

personally I didn't think the show was as bad as some of you are making out... yes the contestants work was not amazing, but it wasn't meant to be amazing, they are meant to be amateurs afterall. It's possible that they struggled with the machinery as how many people have access to these items on a daily basis? I mean I do to some of them and so can use them, but I am very lucky on that front.

And it's very easy to forget steps, especially when under pressure. I've just completed my exam piece at college and it is rubbish, despite my making a procedure list before hand an taking a lot longer on the setting out and marking out stages than I possibly should have. As unlike all the other course work there was a higher pressure level and so I forgot steps, it's natural, and being on TV and under the level of judgement that they were under has got to be an even higher level of pressure.

When it comes to it they were basically very keen amateurs. I also saw nothing wrong with the guy being allowed to do steam bending... people have to do these things for the first time at some point, and as a rule we learn more from trying and failing than we do from not trying. If you try something and make a mistake you are more likely to remember it and adjust it than if you are just told the potential mistakes.

 

[Mark A]

I haven't seen the programme yet (don't know if I should bother now) but going by previous comments posted here I do not understand why people would agree to appear on television if they have no experience in woodworking?

If the producers wanted a competition format, then surely they should have chosen competent individuals. Otherwise it would be like me signing up for the 'Great British Bake-off'...

Mark