Ledge door

[meccarroll]

Thanks for the advice! What's the argument for clenching with the grain as opposed to across the grain? I was worried about splitting, and I thought it would be stronger perpendicular to the grain, but that was just my guess.

Otherwise, I did my best to embed them into the ledges. I wacked them hard with a lump hammer and a 5mm piece of steel as an anvil against the nail head. These nails are VERY stout and not easy to clench.

The door you have made looks very nice but clenching with the grain allows the nails to sink in to the wood slightly. I would tend to knock the end in first a little then flatten the rest of the nail down a little so there is no hook created by the nails to snag clothes. Take a look next time you are in a Historic building or even a ironmonger's that has ledge and braced doors.

 

[thetyreman]

I have the same book doormaking and window making, it's recommended that you add diagonal bracing, I'm wondering why you didn't do this?

 

[AJBaker]

I have the same book doormaking and window making, it's recommended that you add diagonal bracing, I'm wondering why you didn't do this?

He recommends bracing if it's wider than 2'6", but my door is just under that and fairly lightweight since it's out of pine.
I thought of maybe bracing it anyway in case it needed it, but sagging has thankfully not been a problem on this door.

 

[AJBaker]

The door you have made looks very nice but clenching with the grain allows the nails to sink in to the wood slightly. I would tend to knock the end in first a little then flatten the rest of the nail down a little so there is no hook created by the nails to snag clothes. Take a look next time you are in a Historic building or even a ironmonger's that has ledge and braced doors.

Thanks!
Not many doors with clenched nails around here, unfortunately. Historically, I think that nails were more expensive here than in the UK, so they weren't used as often. Most interior and front doors I've come across have been a variation of a four panel door, and ledge doors were mostly for shutters or cellars/barns. They mostly seem to be made from two (very wide) boards, and instead of being nailed on, the ledges are inserted into the boards with a sliding dovetail.

 

[johnnyb]

ive seen some batten doors move over an inch. Even a small amount is a pain tbh. But your door looks the business. Can you adjust the hinges a bit so it claps to better.?

 

[AJBaker]

ive seen some batten doors move over an inch. Even a small amount is a pain tbh. But your door looks the business. Can you adjust the hinges a bit so it claps to better.?

Thanks!
How would I go about that? This is my first time making and hanging a door.
The hinges are big 18" strap hinges.

 

[JSW]

You could try putting it in purgatory, @Sgian Dubh posted about this Here, I've done this in the past, sometimes it works, but usually only short term.

Other than that, move the stop lath and threshold over to meet the doors twist on the clapping side

BTW, are those worm holes in the threshold?

 

[HOJ]

BTW, are those worm holes in the threshold?

The frame jamb look like it has its fair share of worm as well.

Could the frame be in twist as well, to check, if you've some string pin it to all the corners and run it diagonally across the opening, if it touches in the middle where they cross it is pretty close to being ok.

As in:



When dealing with doors (especially in old buildings that have issues) and that are in twist I set the hinge side of the door frame, hang the door then adjust and fix the latch side of the frame to suit the door closing properly.

 

[Jester129]

Hoj, look at the photos. These are not the hinges that we usually use on doors here, inset into the frame. I think they are 'brace' hinges, but don't know the correct name fore them, sorry.

 

[AJBaker]

You could try putting it in purgatory, @Sgian Dubh posted about this Here, I've done this in the past, sometimes it works, but usually only short term.

Other than that, move the stop lath and threshold over to meet the doors twist on the clapping side

BTW, are those worm holes in the threshold?

Yes, there are some wormholes in the frame and threshold. I used pine boards that have been sitting in the attic here for decades.

 

[schnapps95]

After spending 48 years as a Carpenter & Joiner I have never seen the ledges split due to clenching nails with the grain, that's not to say it has not happened but I have never seen it happen. If you used ordinary wire nails of a heavy gauge with pointed ends you would be more likely to separate the fibre but blunt ended nails tear the grain rather than split it and I would add that I have never seen a professional Carpenter/Joiner clench nails across the grain.

I have to agree with Meccattoll i am still working 84 this year where he calls them ledges we called them battens and the door was called a batten door we put screws in the ends of the battens turned it over and put lines on for nailing one nail one side of the line next nail the opposit side of the line four nails to a board and never put any nails into the middle of the batten as that's where the tee hinges or crooks & bands are going to be fitted. I have never seen any nails clenched across the grain if it happened in our workshop i'am afraid they would get a good bulling. A bit late a happy new year to everybody on UK Workshpo

 

[John Brown]

I have the same book doormaking and window making, it's recommended that you add diagonal bracing, I'm wondering why you didn't do this?

According to Mike G in the other place, braces were not commonly used on internal doors, just ledges.
Also supported by my neighbour, who made all his internal doors without braces.

 

[AJBaker]

I have to agree with Meccattoll i am still working 84 this year where he calls them ledges we called them battens and the door was called a batten door we put screws in the ends of the battens turned it over and put lines on for nailing one nail one side of the line next nail the opposit side of the line four nails to a board and never put any nails into the middle of the batten as that's where the tee hinges or crooks & bands are going to be fitted. I have never seen any nails clenched across the grain if it happened in our workshop i'am afraid they would get a good bulling. A bit late a happy new year to everybody on UK Workshpo

Thanks for your insight (and to the others who have shared their experience).
What kind of nails did you use for those doors? Wire nails, cut nails, or forged nails? Pilot holes as well?
If using cut nails, would the nail shank have been aligned with the board rather than with the ledge?

 

[AJBaker]

You could try putting it in purgatory, @Sgian Dubh posted about this Here, I've done this in the past, sometimes it works, but usually only short term.

Other than that, move the stop lath and threshold over to meet the doors twist on the clapping side

BTW, are those worm holes in the threshold?

I'd never heard of putting a door in purgatory, interesting. I put a block of wood at the top (where it touches the stop) and at the bottom I clamped the door against the stop. We'll see if it works.
Another mistake, I reckon, was being a bit too hasty ib building it, I didn't let the wood acclimatise to our house first.

I'll try adjusting the stop lath, but on the threshold I planed a rebate, so I won't be able to adjust that.

 

[meccarroll]

According to Mike G in the other place, braces were not commonly used on internal doors, just ledges.
Also supported by my neighbour, who made all his internal doors without braces.

If you use the correct nails, there is no need to use braces. In this case and the ones made by you know who on the other place the correct nails were used so no need for braces. Of course the correct nails are expensive so if you compensate with modern wire or round nails then braces would be advisable.