Kitchen and utility refit WIP

[Farmer Giles]

When we first bought the farmhouse 17 years ago, we had to burn every bit of wood apart from the pitch pine beams in two rooms and the roof, otherwise every stick went on a huge bonfire, full of woodworm, many floor joists resembled weetabix in strength, and the wife accidentally dropped a lump hammer from waist height which went through a floor board without much resistance they were that rotten.

So we could move into the house and sell up in London, we fitted the cheapest kitchen we could find, I think it was from B&Q. It is now looking very tatty, it isn't what we wanted but was all we could afford at the time and we have coped with it for a few more years until the kids are of an age where they have stopped destroying quite so many things. I've bolted many of the hinges as the carcasses have disintegrated, the plinths are in tatters, plastic legs hanging off. It has done it's job.

The utility wasn't too bad, I gave it a major makeover about 5 years ago and used some Ikea cabinets which weren't at all bad. However I have just built up on top of the utility and some of the cabinets have suffered. Here's the utility as it was, the extension was complete back in the sixties, before that the back of the house was built into the hillside almost up to the bedroom windows.

The youngest daughter's bedroom is very small so the plan was to extend the utility up a floor. Here it is in progress, it persisted it down for weeks during the work so the utility room below got a hammering water wise, but we didn't care too much, we stripped out almost everything of value and managed to keep one corner dry for the washer and dryer.

And as of a few days ago, we finished the shell so I'm busy putting in floor joists as we have the windows being fitted in mid January then I can knock through from the daughters existing bedroom, her old bedroom window becomes a passageway to the new space, the old room will become and ensuite and wardrobe.

I haven't done this myself, I do the project management and some building work but I have had builders in to do the block work, stone work, roof timbers and stone roof. I'm under doctors orders not to do too much after cranial surgery back in August and I'm back at work so don't have much time. However I do most of the electrics, some of the plumbing and I will be doing all the second fitting and some of the first fitting like insulation and plasterboard etc.

So far we have most of the 6 x 2 floor joists in and I had the presence of mind to put all the 50mm insulation backed plasterboard, roof insulation and soon mill flags up into the bedroom space before we put all the floor down. Trying to get them up a winding staircase after dragging them through the house would not have been fun.

To be continued....

 

[thick_mike]

Subscribed. I would love to do something similar in my home.

 

[Farmer Giles]

Cheers Mike

Here's first drawings of the kitchen and utility, not full details yet, still discussing it. Utility room is relatively fixed but kitchen needs more discussion with the missus. All I wanted is the high level design at this stage. If you are wondering about the size of the "cavities" in some of the walls this is because in some locations they are 600mm thick and are not cavity walls but rubble filled. They are a sod to put pipes through but I have done all that the first time around.

Cheers
Andy

 

[Farmer Giles]

We have just about finished the heavy lifting in the extension, we knocked the wall out between the old bedroom and the new on Saturday and moved all the big bits of stone down between the floor joists and some big ones back up to match the existing sandstone head and cills of the window that is now the opening between the old bedroom and the extension. I've already moved the insulation backed plasterboard up into the new bedroom which means I can now put the rest of the floor down and start the rewire. New windows are being fitted in a couple of weeks then I can get the plasterers in.

I also managed to get a couple of 28mm pipes in between the existing underfloor heating manifold and the new room. This means I don't have to lift the existing oak floor to tee into the underfloor heating, I can do it at the manifold which is much easier. The 28mm pipes mean I can put the pex plastic pipe through later.

So apart from rewiring, fixing plasterboard and rationalising the old plumbing, I'm getting tooled up for making the kitchen units.

The radial arm drill is nearing completion, I have a new mitre saw and plunge saw, I already have small table saw, routing table and bandsaw, the last two remaining items are the large holey table to dimension the sheets of birch ply and a kreg pocket hole jig for attaching the face frame, not to make the frame, that will be dominoed.

I will probably make the 8 x 4 holey top, I have a MF3 size top already, so as somebody suggested I will use that as a template to make the bigger one.

From a kreg point of view, given I have the smaller festool domino machine, I don't think I need the all singing and dancing Kreg jig, I think either the Kreg mini or the R3 which is similar but dual hole and has a clamp adapter will probably suffice.

The idea is that I will have a flush face frame and inset doors/drawers. So the face frame will just cover the cabinet edges so there is no internal lip. My original plan was to make all cabinets out of 18mm birch ply, given I am making them in units, the frame width between two units will be 36mm. If I did the same spacing between drawers then that may be a bit heavy, but if I only have one drawer per unit with a door below then 38mm may look ok. I could make the sides of cabinets next to each other to be 12mm so the frame is 24mm wide, but that may be too small and then there is the impact on the internal cabinet width if you are buying commercial sliding baskets etc.

So still thinking about this, I will be making a prototype for the utility room so I can play with dimensions and looking at similar cabinets on line and in the flesh.

Irrespective of the width of the face frame, the kreg jig will just be used to attach it to the cabinets.

I've had a look at the internal measurements of some older B&Q cabinets and some Ikea cabinets. The only thing they have in common is n x 32mm, the depth of cabinets are different and the "n" is also different when it comes to mounting holes. I will be walking around to a couple of neighbours to see what sizes they have, some have very expensive kitchens, some are a bit more basic. What I am aiming for is to drill all the holes in the cabinet sides in advance of building them so I can fit Hafalle/Hettich and Ikea accessories.

I have some Blum and Hettich drawer sliders and Hettich hinges on order to play with, I have some Ikea baskets and drawers so will source so Hafalle fittings then I can decide on cabinet depth and hole patterns.

Cheers
Andy

 

[siggy_7]

It sounds like in many respects you're at a similar point to my own kitchen build, and thinking of a similar construction technique. What I've settled on is:

1) A grid of vertically placed plywood strips screwed down into the floor - this will form a level base onto which I can screw down the cabinets, and also forms the kickboard
2) 18mm plywood cabinet boxes screwed onto the base frame - these will basically be frameless boxes. Each cabinet will be separated horizontally by another 18mm strip of plywood, so the gap beween one internal face of one cabinet and its neighbour is 54mm
3) A sub-frame of maple (chosen because it will make a good match to the birch ply, both covered with clear sealer - I'm thinking floor varnish). I'm planning a horizontal top, middle (bottom of drawer height) and bottom rail that stretches the full run of each cabinet, making the whole assembly very stiff. The vertical parts of the sub-frame will be 54mm wide to match the cabinet spacing, leaving no lip. This will be nailed in place once the cabinets are installed (nails placed so that they are covered by...)
4) An inset face frame of doors and drawers. The maple sub-frame forms about a 10mm reveal when a door/drawer is opened. Will be using Blum Blumotion cup hinges for the doors and Blum Movento drawer slides. I'm planning to fit all the doors and drawers first, level them up along a run, then install the rest of the face frame around the doors and drawers. This will be done in painted beech

I got the idea for this from a kitchen design book "Rennovating a Kitchen" by Taunton. It's a bit American, but has some good ideas in it. https://books.google.co.uk/books/about/ ... edir_esc=y

 

[woodywoodwood]

FG - the house is beautiful. I would love to see some more pics of the work you are doing. We are due a refit, but after losing the main workshop the spare bedroom, study and dining room, as well as the garage, store room (s) and lock up are ALL full of table saws, work benches, spindle moulders, drum Sanders, bandsaw, overhead routers........ Well, you get the picture.
Hopefully you can inspire me. Now where did I put that morticer?????..... :shock:
Thanks for posting.
Www
PS - regarding your foresight in putting boards upstairs before floorboards, today I had a fit in Rickmansworth. The surveyor did his job, few weeks ago, but in between him measuring up and my arriving to fit a bedroom, the stairs, complete with doglegs, went in. So, the easiest thing was to take out the windows, yep - the windows, to get the end panels in. Apparently my fault!!! :roll:

 

[Farmer Giles]

thanks for the kind words and glad to see others have the same thought processes

I've been away working down south, which I do every week however this week my brother was down due his wife having a big operation. So I had two nights on the town, the first to keep his mind off his wifes operation the following day, the second celebrating what seems to be a successful op.

Trouble is I think I overdid it and now I have the lurgy so laid up in bed really frustrated. All the hinges and sliders have arrived and all sorts of other stuff but I feel like death so will leave it until next week.

 

[Farmer Giles]

I managed to get time for a quick peek at the sliders and hinges I bought to try out.

The Hettich Quadro V6 full extension under-mount sliders are expensive but ooze quality and will work with a flush face frame, I think. All I need to do is have a two part drawer front and make sure the front of the drawer extends down a little to clear the slider. So the missus can have full extension, soft close and nice dovetail drawers, lovely and I get a couple of mill of adjustment just in case my fixing isn't bang on I'm still going to mock up a prototype before deciding for definite.

I bought a pair of flush face frame hinges, I only had a brief look but they looked the part and the soft close mechanism is nice, I'll give them a quick test this weekend before detailing what they are in case anybody wants some.

The missus has given me more info about the kitchen she wants over and above the basic cabinet layout. Near the cooker she wants a stainless steel worktop which extends all the way to and beyond the sink. She definitely wants function over form as she has asked for two chutes in the SS top, one for compostable waste and one for other food waste (meat, bones etc.). All of that is doable and given the wall is not remotely square I can make a template up and take it down to the local SS fabricators and get them to cut, bend and let in a couple of small SS sinks. The rest of the worktops will be a bit different, more later on that

The wife has just planted 1400 trees and bushes in the field, hedging or for coppicing, but she already has some willow that she harvested last year and will have loads more for this year. So instead of wire baskets, other than the Ikea ones we already have that I will reuse, we are toying with the idea of willow slide out baskets. I'll provide a frame that slides out, she can do the rest.

There is a small "breakfast bar" type area, this she wants dual height so she can kneed dough more easily etc. She has asked for under counter storage and power, and somewhere to put the mixer. I've got a few ideas of how to incorporate this along with slide outs for scales etc.

So the mists are clearing, I'll have a tooled up warm workshop in a month with a bit of luck and by the time I have finished the bedroom and utility I think I'll be ready to tackle the main event. I'm quite looking forward to it

Cheers
Andy

 

[Halo Jones]

Looking forward to the stainless steel counters. We are planning a large island unit with a stainless steel top. One thing I don't understand is the grades of SS as some types seem to get marked very easily. Is there a standard for kitchen use?

 

[Farmer Giles]

It's been a while but I have been tickling along the utility room build and the kitchen build is looming so I thought an update is in order. I'm on the weekly commute so my pictures are limited but I have a treat in store, I'm not going to patent my mop bucket cabinet design but open it up to the world

I fitted a stainless steel sink in the utility first, I had this custom made with a big deep catering sink and 600mm drainers either side so I could get the washer and dryer either side. I then made a cabinet to fit underneath with a large pull out drawer with double runners to hold the bin. Pictures later. I haven't made any drawer or cabinet fronts yet, I need to take the missus out to a few places to look at laminates, the initial intention is to use laminated ply with an oak surround for the utility but this may change.

Next was the full height cabinet next to the sink that holds the microwave. The utility is going to be used to take a lot of stuff from the kitchen when I start on that build so for now I have repurposed some IKEA pullout baskets and moved the recycling bin from the kitchen. This will probably change once the kitchen is finished.

All made from 18mm birch ply, except the back which is 9mm. The sink is 700mm deep, I hate trying to squeeze pipes behind appliances, so the cabinet is 700mm deep too. You can just see the welded frame used instead of those horrible plastic feet. I first built the frame with adjustable feet to fit the space, levelled it with adjustable feet then the cabinets sit on it and are screwed to it from underneath.

Next, for your delectation is the innovative mop cupboard. I had limited depth to play with as the back door opens into the space to the right of the microwave cabinet, so I had to recess the back a little to gain an extra 30mm. That way I could get the annoying ironing board in there too.

And now the exciting bit, I had a eureka moment one night after a couple of pints of homebrew, or was I hallucinating?

The incredibly accurately machined slot allows you to put the mop bucket under the shelf with the mop still in it and get it out easily without disturbing the junk above it! Revolutionary utility room technology

I don't have a photo on me with the cabinet installed and in use but the missus seems to be happy and is using it. I'm sure all her coffee morning friends are jealous and getting their hubbies to install a bespoke mop bucket cabinet between the hot tub and the pot pourri.

Next is two more full size larder cabinets, 2100 tall, 500 wide, 700 deep. I'm making slide out tray style drawers for these, 600mm deep so I can install spice racks etc on the back of the doors. I made the carcasses at the weekend, just need finishing with water based poly and the 25mm steel box base frame welding up.

I've ordered 40m of 11mm x 100mm quarter sawn oak for the trays. I may post pictures of the sink, waste cabinet and the mop bucket cabinet in use but I'll make little progress for the next two weeks as we have various family events getting in the way. Once I have the trays fitted in the larder units I can move on to the kitchen carcasses. The first batch are 5 wall and 5 base cabs to make, all similar dimensions so should be able to knock these up quickly. The rest of the kitchen is all funny sizes and angles to fit weird spaces.

Cheers
Andy

 

[Shaggy]

We have a small depth cupboard in our kitchen that has the Hoover and mop bucket in that my wife wants me to shelve out so with your permission I'd like to copy your mop bucket idea and maybe adapt it for the Hoover too (hammer) .

 

[TFrench]

Visionary!

 

[Farmer Giles]

We have a small depth cupboard in our kitchen that has the Hoover and mop bucket in that my wife wants me to shelve out so with your permission I'd like to copy your mop bucket idea and maybe adapt it for the Hoover too (hammer) .

No problem, just subscribe to my none existent Facebook page and buy the slot template and plans . You will receive a bag of slots in the post plus carefully written beermat based instructions in code. To decode drink 4 pints of Atlantic Vanilla Porter

 

[Farmer Giles]

here's a few more pics

The SS sink in the utility, it was made to order by a catering company in Manchester. I looked on ebay and elsewhere for a large double drainer single catering sink, but all were too small to take an appliance either side.

And the sliding cabinet underneath pulled out, this will be for the waste bin. It snot sliding as nicely as it should, slight misalignment of the guides, probably when I drilled the pilot holes. Shall redo them now I have some decent self centring drills.

Mop and ironing board cupboard in use. The pipes to the right go underground to the boiler room around the back and will be boxed in with a false cupboard door.

And the final two cupboards for the utility, these are both 2100H x 500W x 700D and will form the pantry. Just need finishing and the box section base welding up before being put into position.

There is a box to build above the fridge to hide some cabling and a few other bit to do, but after that its onto the kitchen.

Cheers
Andy

 

[Farmer Giles]

Just got back from holiday so not much done but progress being made. I welded up the base of the larder cabinets this morning, it should have taken about and hour but with the kids off school it took me best part of 3 hours.

To keep the youngest daughter out of mischief I let her paint it, it will definitely only need one coat the way she puts its on Here she is doing her Boris Johnson impression.

I'll attach the adjustable feet in the morning then we are nearly ready to install the cabinets, I just need to move a socket that is feeding the fridge first, it is currently directly behind where the larder cabinets are going.

Cheers
And

 

[Farmer Giles]

Face frame dimensions....

Utility room carcasses all but complete, I shall take pics later once they have a coat or two of water based poly.

We haven't completely nailed the kitchen drawer/door design yet, however its going to be a face frame. Face frame material will be 20mm thick quarter sawn oak.

I don't have to finalise the stile widths at the moment but, I need to get the rails about right as I'm making 5 carcasses now so will be fitting them soon.

I'm using 18mm ply for the carcasses with 9mm ply backs, when two are butted together you get 36mm rails, but if I put a 9mm packer in between you end up with 45mm. Most face frame cabinets I'm looking at seem to around 50mm rails. I could use an 18mm packer and end up with 54mm rails.

Any preferences?

Cheers
Andy

 

[Farmer Giles]

I've got a run of five 500mm wide base carcasses built from birch ply, four in a pile and one just about to come out clamps, sorry if the pic orientation is screwed, it's not me, its the website software.

Next, build the base/legs, 25mm box section welded. The legs will go on tomorrow, this is the main frame. The legs will have rivnuts in them to take the baseboard/plinth.

I'm going for a curry, kids are away with their grandparents in Anglesey so we can go for a few beers, may watch a gig later so that's it until tomorrow.

Cheers
Andy

 

[Farmer Giles]

I finished welding the base, first cut the legs

Weld them on, the front legs get a 11mm hole for the M8 rivnuts I'm using to hold the plinths on.

Now bend the frame straight, even with the frame clamped to the table, welding the legs on one side causes a bit of distortion. It didn't take long, I did have to pack each end up a bit more to get the necessary bend in the tube to counteract the distortion than shown in the picture

A coat of black hammerite and nearly there. Just need to add the feet and the rivnuts tomorrow.

If you notice that the "newspaper" being used is the Daily Fail, we don't buy it, the MIL does and brings it around. We use it for mulch and jobs like this. We bought her a Private Eye subscription for her 70th, she's loving it, so hopefully the supply of the mail will dry up....

Cheers
Andy

 

[Trainee neophyte]

I finished welding the base, first cut the legs



Weld them on, the front legs get a 11mm hole for the M8 rivnuts I'm using to hold the plinths on.



Now bend the frame straight, even with the frame clamped to the table, welding the legs on one side causes a bit of distortion. It didn't take long, I did have to pack each end up a bit more to get the necessary bend in the tube to counteract the distortion than shown in the picture



A coat of black hammerite and nearly there. Just need to add the feet and the rivnuts tomorrow.



If you notice that the "newspaper" being used is the Daily Fail, we don't buy it, the MIL does and brings it around. We use it for mulch and jobs like this. We bought her a Private Eye subscription for her 70th, she's loving it, so hopefully the supply of the mail will dry up....

Cheers
Andy

There are two vitally important things missing from my life - welding kit, and the ability to weld. I shall sit here and be jealous, and impressed, in equal measures. Also your workshop. I have workshop envy - I never knew until now...

 

[Farmer Giles]

I'm an occasional welder so it's not great but passable for the stuff I make. Fortunately I know some really decent welders, so if I've got something where structural integrity is key, then I get them to do it. For example the hitch bracket on our wood chipper so we can tow it with a quad bike, I will get that done by a friend, taking notes while he does it

I've settled on stile width, it will be 45mm, which is 2 x 18mm carcass thicknesses plus a 9mm ply packer.

The rails will vary, mid ones all the same but top narrower and bottom wider. I'll decide on them tomorrow when I put in the first drawer spacers in the carcasses to go behind the space frame.

Cheers
Andy