interested in your experiences paying for tradespeople

[Lons]

Just an aside in case it applies to anyone reading this thread.

Very small jobs are a pita to most small businesses and prices are normally way out of proportion due to overheads, travel costs and disruption to the days work which is often why it's hard to find anyone who'll even quote.
If you have small jobs then save them up to at least a full days work and tradesmen will be much more likely to accept and charge a reasonable rate.

 

[Matt@]

in terms of due diligence I'd go a step further if I was looking at paying someone an appreciable sum ie building work . Look up company names on CompanyCheck website for financial status and check out directors etc. If I were looking to get a £30K extension built I may well baulk at using a company thats been going 3 years and is about to be struck off with lots of debt however well they have been recommended. A service provider is only as good as the people behind it whether one man band or LTD company and it pays to check the people themselves out.

 

[Doug71]

I can't see why a customer would want to see any of my receipts? We agree a price for the job which includes all materials and labour and I do the job for that price, it is no concern of theirs what I pay for things.

It is normal practice to add a percentage to materials, most of my suppliers will not deal with the public, even with a bit added on it is still cheaper for them then they would buy elsewhere.

Doug

 

[Doug71]

I'll still be happy if people ask me for receipts, because "adding a little extra because that's just how it is" is the reason why so many customers think they have to keep an eye on you. I've had a trades person say "I want a new festool vac, I'll just roll it into my next customers price" - and with a totally straight face as though it was the most natural thing - I think that's immoral, especially considering it's a deductable anyway.

Over here in Finland I have had a few people operate quite differently to the way the trades do in the UK. What they do is just go to the supplier (builders merchants or wherever), get what they need, and have the bill sent directly to me. This helps their cash flow and means I get the itemised bills directly from the source. It removes any chance of them adding a mark-up on the materials, which is good for me but maybe bad for them. It also means I can be billed by a supplier I have no direct contract with and the supplier is left billing someone they may have never seen or heard of, but they seem to do it so the system works. I don't know what would happen if I refused to pay, or disputed a bill.

There are suppliers in this country who will invoice the trades customer directly but it is not as good as it seems.

For example customer wants kitchen, builder says go look at kitchens at XXXXXXX I have an account there you can use. The kitchen supplier tells the builder the cost of the kitchen and asks him how much he wants them to bill his customer for. Kitchen might cost £3000, he says bill customer for £3750. Customer thinks they are getting kitchen at builders trade price but they are paying over the odds, the kitchen supplier then credits the builders account with the £750 knowing he will spend it with them.

Happens all the time and is just so wrong.

So be warned the builder is not always doing you a favour by getting you billed directly from his supplier.

Doug

 

[DrPhill]

A recent experience - our bathroom refit.

Asked 5 people around who they would recommend. Three independently recommended the same chap. Lets call him Bruce. It was October, so there was a quiet window coming up - no-one wants a major job in the house going on near crimbo, so Bruce reckons it will be done before the festivities start.

Bruce came twice to discuss the job, as it was complex (to my mind) involving tidying up ch runs, walk-in shower with big glass sheet, outside tap (spurred off bathroom) roof vent for the fan, false ceiling, coving, all pipes buried in the wall, electrics back to the box. He was making sure that we both knew what was happening. He was obstinate about some things - he is a perfectionist. As I could appreciate his arguments I deferred on most points.

He gave a quote and we winced, checked with other folk that this was within range, gritted our teeth and agreed. His quote included a schedule of payments.
He turned up when he said, did exactly what he said, finished when he said, and charged what he said. He organised the sparks as a sub-contractor and took responsibility for that. His work is immaculate, and we are happy.

Key point for us was that he was willing to really engage with us to explain/discuss the job. His obstinacy was a plus as he could be argued round on some points, but I felt others were a principle for him. (And a 65-ish he knows a dam sight more than I ever will about the job). His creativity and positive attitude were a big plus in discussions.
His clear payment schedule gave us confidence, and I payed on the dot by electronic transfer.

When I need another job done he will be my first call. He or whoever he recommends will get first opportunity.

Does that help any?

 

[Chip shop]

One thing that has occurred to me while reading this thread is what trades are we talking about? It might sound like a daft question, but I can turn my hand to most disciplines in the building trade.

I can plaster (after a fashion), I can lay blocks somewhere near plumb, I can point brickwork but some of the mortar will fall on the floor, I can do electrical work but I only have a vague understanding of regs, I can wipe a joint but they sometimes weep.

However if you want a door made, hung in a new casing that I guarantee will be square and plumb , or you need a sash (or any other window for that matter) window replacing or repaired, or you need a fitted unit or even a piece of furniture I can and will do it.

My point (finally) is that I've always been very wary of people who drive vans with stickers all over them that claim that they undertake plastering, plumbing, electrical work, brick work, civil engineering, gutter cleaning, joinery, ground works, roofing blah blah blah and usually all aspects of building work undertaken.

If you need a chippie employ a chippie. Plumbing get a plumber. I guess you get the point.

If a customer rang me and asked me to skim a ceiling, I'd say let me ring Steve to see if he's free...obviously Steve is a plasterer

 

[Geoff_S]

.....
Anyway, the extension is now finished and would be a good job but for the leaking roof! ....

Probably because you insisted on them doing it your way! :lol: :lol:

Bloody hell Jacob, you could have something there. My fault, because I only explained that I wanted a flat roof but hadn't made it clear that it needed to keep the rain out. Yep, what a fool I've been :roll:

 

[Jacob]

......Really? "Well don't do it that way, do it my way 'cos I'm flipping well paying and you're talking b*ll**ks!" We end up having an understanding that I am not an imbecile and I am watching every detail of their work......

Looks like the buck stops here! :lol:

I bet they were glad to get off the job. If they read this thread they'll be laughing their heads off!

 

[Bm101]

Jacob, yes exactly! got to tread very carefully and just pay!! one benefit I think is the welsh don't like spending money so I think in a way the trades there like the English as they pay more..

Replace Welsh with Indian or Nigerian or Pakistani Matt. Now read it back and think if you'd post that on a forum and expect people from those countries not to to take exception to your statement. I suppose I'm misunderstanding your comments. Some of your best friends are even Welsh eh?
#-o

 

[Brandlin]

Jacob, yes exactly! got to tread very carefully and just pay!! one benefit I think is the welsh don't like spending money so I think in a way the trades there like the English as they pay more..

Replace Welsh with Indian or Nigerian or Pakistani Matt. Now read it back and think if you'd post that on a forum and expect people from those countries not to to take exception to your statement. I suppose I'm misunderstanding your comments. Some of your best friends are even Welsh eh?
#-o

Couldn't agree more. General judgemental stereotypes don't help anyone.

 

[Jacob]

One thing that has occurred to me while reading this thread is what trades are we talking about? It might sound like a daft question, but I can turn my hand to most disciplines in the building trade.

I can plaster (after a fashion), I can lay blocks somewhere near plumb, I can point brickwork but some of the mortar will fall on the floor, I can do electrical work but I only have a vague understanding of regs, I can wipe a joint but they sometimes weep.

However if you want a door made, hung in a new casing that I guarantee will be square and plumb , or you need a sash (or any other window for that matter) window replacing or repaired, or you need a fitted unit or even a piece of furniture I can and will do it.

My point (finally) is that I've always been very wary of people who drive vans with stickers all over them that claim that they undertake plastering, plumbing, electrical work, brick work, civil engineering, gutter cleaning, joinery, ground works, roofing blah blah blah and usually all aspects of building work undertaken.

If you need a chippie employ a chippie. Plumbing get a plumber. I guess you get the point.

If a customer rang me and asked me to skim a ceiling, I'd say let me ring Steve to see if he's free...obviously Steve is a plasterer

Agree.
When I started I had a go at everything and realised it meant that I did a lot of it not very well. So I decided to specialise in joinery and just do that not very well.

 

[Matt@]

Jacob, yes exactly! got to tread very carefully and just pay!! one benefit I think is the welsh don't like spending money so I think in a way the trades there like the English as they pay more..

Replace Welsh with Indian or Nigerian or Pakistani Matt. Now read it back and think if you'd post that on a forum and expect people from those countries not to to take exception to your statement. I suppose I'm misunderstanding your comments. Some of your best friends are even Welsh eh?
#-o

thank for pointing out my post, I've edited it accordingly...

 

[Lons]

Phill

Your bathroom project could easily have been one of my jobs as it describes exactly how I tried to run my business and why I never needed to look for work.
Make no mistake, the guy was checking you out as much as the reverse and I'm sure that had you insisted you wanted corners cut he would have walked away.
Comes back to my point that responsibility and trust works both ways and now he has a satisfied long term customer while you have someone you can rely on. Until he retires that is! I had wailing and complaining from some saying "who can we go to now? You can't retire!"

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I've had a trades person say "I want a new festool vac, I'll just roll it into my next customers price" - and with a totally straight face as though it was the most natural thing - I think that's immoral, especially considering it's a deductable anyway ...

Funny enough, my neighbour said exactly that. What really amuses me is the "Icthys" symbol on his van. :lol:

 

[Jacob]

One thing clear about this thread - people seem to get the tradespeople they deserve. :lol:

 

[Brandlin]

One thing clear about this thread - people seem to get the tradespeople they deserve. :lol:

Agreed,

 

[powertools]

In my experience having had a new house built in the garden of our previous house the people most likely to over charge and under perform are the ones who you have to employ to be able to get the project passed by building control.
In order of the most problems I had.

Hetas approved stove fitter.
Architect.
Structural engineer.
Plumber.
Electrician.
All other people involved in our project delivered what was expected at an acceptable price.

 

[Lons]

One thing clear about this thread - people seem to get the tradespeople they deserve. :lol:

Agreed,

+1

 

[Matt@]

In my experience having had a new house built in the garden of our previous house the people most likely to over charge and under perform are the ones who you have to employ to be able to get the project passed by building control.
In order of the most problems I had.

Hetas approved stove fitter.
Architect.
Structural engineer.
Plumber.
Electrician.
All other people involved in our project delivered what was expected at an acceptable price.

its the ones that hold most accreditation then! how I wish I had been a central heating boiler engineer, thats all I can say :?

 

[Geoff_S]

I guess with some tradespeople it's like having to see a surgeon.

You have to but you don't really want to, there's going to be at least some pain and you'll be scarred for life, possibly better, possibly dead.