Imperial measurement

[dunbarhamlin]

The average drongo on the street today needs a calculator to use base ten.
Thirty years ago all and sundry used and converted between base 12, base 14, base 16, base 20 and more without furrowing a brow.

(Oh - and one is hoist by a mine (petard) - not caught by it)

 

[t8hants]

Use both, 4' 16mm is quite an acceptable way to measure.
Thats why tape rules have both systems on them.

 

[sancho]

even though Im just now learning and using the metric system ILO the imperial system, it seems to me a lot easier to subtract 305mm from 459mm then it is to subtract say 12 1/4" from 14 32/64"

 

[Jacob]

even though Im just now learning and using the metric system ILO the imperial system, it seems to me a lot easier to subtract 305mm from 459mm then it is to subtract say 12 1/4" from 14 32/64"

Not if you know that 1/4 is 16/64. In any case 32/64 would be expressed as 1/2.
You just need to know your 2 times sequence 2 4 8 16 32 64 and how to add/subtract simple fractions. Easy.

 

[andys wood shed]

We will be talking about old money next :lol:

 

[sancho]

even though Im just now learning and using the metric system ILO the imperial system, it seems to me a lot easier to subtract 305mm from 459mm then it is to subtract say 12 1/4" from 14 32/64"

Not if you know that 1/4 is 16/64. In any case 32/64 would be expressed as 1/2.
You just need to know your 2 times sequence 2 4 8 16 32 64 and how to add/subtract simple fractions. Easy.

I know it quite well.

Remember Im a american, its what we use.

But IMO the metric is still easier.

whole numbers are way easier to figure out then fractions.

 

[Eric The Viking]

But IMO the metric is still easier. whole numbers are way easier to figure out then fractions.

I think it all depends on what you're doing.

Metres are an 'unhelpful' measure as they're not based on human beings (they're quite artificial).
Fractions, once you get used to them, make dividing distances, areas, etc. easier.
Feet and Inches go back to the Romans, and probably earlier too (Phonecians?). They're loosely based on human measurements. For that reason I find them easier to work with, as I can imagine one foot far more easily than one metre (which doesn't fit anything naturally!).

But hey, we can use whatever suits us really.

Regards to Fullerton, Il. - I ran a training course there once!

E.

 

[bugbear]

But IMO the metric is still easier. whole numbers are way easier to figure out then fractions.

I think it all depends on what you're doing.

Metres are an 'unhelpful' measure as they're not based on human beings (they're quite artificial).
Fractions, once you get used to them, make dividing distances, areas, etc. easier.
Feet and Inches go back to the Romans, and probably earlier too (Phonecians?). They're loosely based on human measurements. For that reason I find them easier to work with, as I can imagine one foot far more easily than one metre (which doesn't fit anything naturally!).

But hey, we can use whatever suits us really.

Regards to Fullerton, Il. - I ran a training course there once!

E.

Measuring the height of a cupboard in feet involves walking up a wall - easy for spiderman, perhaps...

BugBear

 

[sancho]

But IMO the metric is still easier. whole numbers are way easier to figure out then fractions.

I think it all depends on what you're doing.

Metres are an 'unhelpful' measure as they're not based on human beings (they're quite artificial).
Fractions, once you get used to them, make dividing distances, areas, etc. easier.
Feet and Inches go back to the Romans, and probably earlier too (Phonecians?). They're loosely based on human measurements. For that reason I find them easier to work with, as I can imagine one foot far more easily than one metre (which doesn't fit anything naturally!).

But hey, we can use whatever suits us really.

Regards to Fullerton, Il. - I ran a training course there once!

E.

Where in fulerton? At the Jr. College maybe?

 

[Eric The Viking]

Hewlett-Packard (training their customer engineers (big HP systems). I was trying to remember whereabouts it is/was. Google maps didn't come up with the office, so it may have been closed now.

I enjoyed being a tourist in Chicago - did the usual things: Sears' Tower, Museum of Science+Industry (loved the U-boat!), etc. and all those wonderful Art Deco interiors in the Loop. Walking round in the early evening, they were all lit up.

Funny old world.

E.

 

[sancho]

I dont know where the HP plant was at. Maybe off of Chapman /Malvern and Hughes way.

 

[Eric The Viking]

Sorry, I can't remember. It was around 18 years ago now - scary thought!

E.

 

[adzeman]

I cant believe this thread is still running, obviously a lot of members have a somthing to say on this subject. There is ome passion running like votes for women or coming out of Europe.
I find what the Americans say interesting as I think they have got it right.

 

[bugbear]

I find what the Americans say interesting as I think they have got it right.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias




BugBear

 

[Templatetom]

But IMO the metric is still easier. whole numbers are way easier to figure out then fractions.

I think it all depends on what you're doing.

But hey, we can use whatever suits us really.

.

Interesting number of reasons for selecting one or the other method of measuring.

If we were to apply the system of choice when using template guides with the router what would be the preference of the member?.

Over the past nine weeks whilst on holiday I have been looking into both methods. The reason being that most sets of guides are sold in the imperial mode and very few are available in the metric mode. Also the imperial sets are sometimes restricted to the largest guide being only 1" diameter. (Many people have asked me do we need anything larger).

I do have a preference, and I selected the metric system (Quoted by Sancho above) for the same reason, also I was able to find larger diameter guides to enable me to complete a greater number of routing processes. The largest guide available here in Australia in the metric is 40mm dia. I have also converted other guides to produce 50mm 60mm 70mm 80mm 90mm 100mm. Though I do not use these converted guides on a regular basis I use the 40mm very frequently, in fact this is the first guide I select to see if it is possible to use, first. (I consider the 40mm is the most important in my collection)

What are the advantages of using the guides?

Recently on one of the forums there has been a great interest in the 'Pantorouter' a great jig capable of producing a number or routing processes to rout a number of woodworking joints. (Mortice and Tenon) Certainly a Jig worth looking at. The method I have developed to produce the same joints are completed with a much simplier Jig. The jig is also produced with less expenditure and I also can promise you easier to construct.

If anyone who has purchased the set of guides and is interested on how they can assist in the production of the same joints and many more; contact me with details of the guides you have and I will forward some information on how they can be used to produce either the Mortice and Tenon, (in a variety of sizes) Bridle Joint or 1/2 lap joint when using 19mm or 3/4" material of your choice, keeping it simple 42mm or 1-1/2" wide.

This offer is open to a few to try it out before going to print so if you are interested get in touch with details of the guides you have.

Tom

 

[Templatetom]

Carb-I-Tool Australia have introduced a set of guides (Imperial) enclosed is a CD on how the guides can be used

 

[adzeman]

Local builder building an extension to a property in the village had a moan today. Flat Roof joists 400 centres 8' 0" x 4' 0" sheets fitted perfect no waste. Inulation boards in metric dont fit without unnecessary waste.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Keep using 400mm centres - before long 8' x 4' s won't fit at all. 20 or 30 years ago your timbers wouldn't suit both a ceiling and a floor. How long is this going to take!

 

[adzeman]

Hi Phil,

I am of the opinion this will not happen for a long time, not in my lifetime anyway. I am not one of those people that think metric or imperial is best. The change from Imperial to metric in 1972 was a political decision not a practical one. It has occurred and we all have to accept it. I am of the opinion that for building in the United Kingdom Imperial is the better system. In the late sixty’s I worked in Belgium and was quite happy to work in the metric system, no problems. This was because their materials and story heights are different to ours in particular their brick sizes. Bricklayers do not look at/think of measurements in Imperial or metric but in bricks for example an opening for a 760 or 2’ 6” door. The standard brick is 8½” plus a ½” joint giving a 915 or 3’ 0” opening. The 8½” due to firing could be 83/8” but the ½” is not measured it is created by hand pressure caused by experience.
Now does today’s Architect/draughtsman annotate 900? If it’s a 900 opening then if a timber door the frame will be tight, if its PVCu it will be fine. Incidentally I checked he ceiling joists on my friends extension and though the drawings showed 400 he put them in spacing them equidistance between the walls which happens to be 406 or 1’ 4” which is why the Imperial ply worked and the metric insulation didn’t.
In 1979 I was a Project Manager on one of the phases of the Byker Wall housing development in Newcastle for three years. This was the first and last time I came across metric bricks. Not 216 x 064 but specific metric dimensions 250 x 090. They did not work or true to say nothing worked with it windows and doors none standard. Simple things like rainwater outlets did not work. Roof tiles could not be used and they were roofed with metal sheets, but the lengths of sheets did not work and had a silly cut added. Heights are a problem i,e, coursing. The rise and go of stairs is still 9 x 7 which in Imperial is equal treads from finished floor to finished floor. I still come across people in the trade that don’t understand brick coursing. In 1987 I was asked to Project manage a block of luxury flats in docklands that had been running for a year. When I started on site I found the whole team had been replaced and target completion dates were looming. The site was a mess and the problem was the storey heights were wrong.
In conclusion I don’t think we are going to get a new brick for some time yet.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I understand one of the main reasons for going metric was that the USA was also going to convert, was was of course horse feathers: the other of course was the Eussr. I did A levels in '72, so had the option of imperial or metric paperss so consequently I use both systems, but it'd be good to either have one or the other as the above post above so brilliantly illustrates. I remember walking into an arguement in the kitchen at work one day as to weather there were two or three feet in a yard!
Incidentally, I just saw a packet of Polo's for sale at fifteen shillings and ninepence. We don't seem to forget things that have been drummed into us!